They might have waited for yield to improve enough to allow a relatively large 14nm die at console level pricing.
Middle Generation Console Upgrade Discussion [Scorpio, 4Pro]
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What i find quite funny is this:
Before both the PS4 and XB1 launched, the PS4 folks wanted to believe that 50% more TFs will yield a huge graphical advantage, while the Xbox fans did not.
Games launched, some differences are there (framerate, minor resolution, minor differences in multiplatform games), but at the end of the day, the weaker inferior XB1 still managed to sell 25M+ consoles and most are happy with it, despite the graphical offset. And why wouldnt they? For every better PS4 version of the same game, we can all point to the even more superior PC versions. Did us PS4 gamers buy a PC because of it? No.
So why in gods name will it now suddenly make a difference that Scorpio is 50% more powerful than a PS4pro?
Has the market cared or stopped playing games because most games fail to meet native 1080p, some games being as low as 720p? Why will it make a difference if the Pro or Scorpio fail to meet 4k?
If the market were that fixated on performance and graphics, we'd all be gaming on a PC...
Before both the PS4 and XB1 launched, the PS4 folks wanted to believe that 50% more TFs will yield a huge graphical advantage, while the Xbox fans did not.
Games launched, some differences are there (framerate, minor resolution, minor differences in multiplatform games), but at the end of the day, the weaker inferior XB1 still managed to sell 25M+ consoles and most are happy with it, despite the graphical offset. And why wouldnt they? For every better PS4 version of the same game, we can all point to the even more superior PC versions. Did us PS4 gamers buy a PC because of it? No.
So why in gods name will it now suddenly make a difference that Scorpio is 50% more powerful than a PS4pro?
Has the market cared or stopped playing games because most games fail to meet native 1080p, some games being as low as 720p? Why will it make a difference if the Pro or Scorpio fail to meet 4k?
If the market were that fixated on performance and graphics, we'd all be gaming on a PC...
is 14nm that much of an improvement over 16nm?
Not that I'm agreeing or disagreeing, but this bit of your argument doesn't stand. PC is a different experience. Going back to the tired analogy, if it's speed everyone wants, why don't they buy the two seater sports car instead of the five door family car? If you want a five door family car, you then pick the fastest (or not) car of that type. With consoles, if people want performance than they'll buy the fastest console, but they won't look to something that's not a console. Any more than someone wanting the fastest portable gaming system (Vita) would buy a more powerful smartphone.
But of course we all know the most powerful console isn't intrinsically the one that sells, and consumer choice is affected by many parameters.
Well it bothered me to a degree. I prefer Xbox because of the OS, controller and tend to like shooters more. But PS4 hitting 1080p on nearly every title and Xbox One lagging in performance definitely was disappointing. Scoprio being the most powerful console definitely makes the decision easy to upgrade to that device (from my XB360 nonetheless).
people will care because it's 4x more powerful than the x1, for starters.
secondly we'll have to wait and see but the Gpu is only one aspect that affects graphics.
how much visible difference there will be is unknown.
thirdly as you outlined - people who claimed to see enough of a difference and wanted the best will get it, Xbox owners who claimed they didn't see it probably will with the bigger difference that Scorpio will provide, although even then may not care.
in the end I think we just can't say how things will pan out, don't think you can even use 4pro as good indication if it's supply constrained as people say, also messaging and available games to show it off could be better etc
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nailed it. The likelihood that most PS4 owners bought a PS4 was probably because of the games and their friends. If the games you want to play aren't on any other system, it makes the decision matrix rather trivial.
Huh? PS4 sold DOUBLE Xbox One. Coming off a generation where PS3 sold on par with Xbox 360.
If you want to believe power played no significant part in that, ok, live in that world. But it isn't reality.
Do we not remember the scandals every time a Xbox One game was 900P and crappy framerate compared to 1080P on PS4? Literally every time, it was it's own mini-scandal. It never went away.
It's finally died down a bit (not completely gone) for two reasons, one, it's expected now, two, people know Scorpio is coming so the situation is a bit transient anyway.
It does not look like this to me, they had an opportunity to further improve the Slim which they did not take. Whether they were right or wrong Sony's move forced their hands (personal theory based on their messy com to counter Sony annoucement #daspantisdown ).
I believe MSFT should have significantly redesign the SOC for the XBox 1S and set themselves in a situtation to beat the PS4 slim on price and performances.
Ultimately MSFT could have still pressure Sony by annoucing a replacement (not necessarily the drop of support for the XBox One) fall 2018 with new CPUs and GPU IPs.
Now that says nothing about the respective commercial succes of the Ps4Pro and the "Scorpion" but looking at the boost the Slim created (at least in the US) my belief is that MSFT would have been better served by a further revamp Slim vs still falling short of all PS4 sku +/- and announcing the XB1S replacement in one year.
This time last year, the optimal strategy seemed to be a two-tier slim, one ~ 2TF product at $199/249 and another the power of the pro. They obviously didn't go that route. To me that really implies a CPU beyond jaguar as nothing else is changing in the meantime as they could have had a Vega-ish GPU in November.
Given the success of the S at a high price point, it seems that they gambled well.
Were there potentially any other metrics price that might have played a part in the sales disparity you mentioned?
Tkumpathenurpahl
Veteran
Or the fact that the XBoxOne's main USP was "you can buy games but you don't own them."
I try not to be pleased by failure or by someone losing their job but, when the public denounced such nonsense and Don Matrick scurried back under the crusted turd from which he emerged, I felt a little twinge of joy.
Can anyone imagine what would have happened if that was well received? EA and Activision would hire security contractors to ensure you don't let anyone else play your games that you don't own.
I try not to be pleased by failure or by someone losing their job but, when the public denounced such nonsense and Don Matrick scurried back under the crusted turd from which he emerged, I felt a little twinge of joy.
Can anyone imagine what would have happened if that was well received? EA and Activision would hire security contractors to ensure you don't let anyone else play your games that you don't own.
The biggest problem of PS3 was not the power. It was the price. Believe me if the PS3 was not 599 euros in continental Europe, the result would have been not much different than PS4 against Xbox One... A bit better for 360 because they launch one year before PS3.
The Playstation brand is very strong here and Xbox is a choice if Sony do some shitty things like launch a console at 599 euros...
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Silent_Buddha
Legend
It's also strong in Canada and Australia. Early on in the generation it was also more popular in Brazil (due to HUGE import taxes on PS4 at the time) as well as Mexico, not sure how it is in those locations now.
Regards,
SB
In Brazil grey market the PS4 is far ahead I think. In Mexico the Xbox brand is far ahead. I forgot Canada and Australia but PS4 is far ahead in Australia...
After they did another error with Tiers 1 and Tiers 2 market. In Tiers 2 market in Europe the situation is much worse than in France where the last number were 75% of the market for PS4 against 25% for Xbox One (not counting WiiU) and more than 80% of the market for PS4 in Germany. I never see a Kinect Xbox One bundle in France or Germany since a long time. Here in Switzerland they continue to try to sell it... Sony has probably more than 90% marketshare in Tiers 2 country... It is the case in some Tiers 1 country like Spain or Portugal..
Sold a console more than 399 euros/dollars is not a good things too, PS3 and Xbox One are lesson to learn for platform holder...
Sold a console more than 399 euros/dollars is not a good things too, PS3 and Xbox One are lesson to learn for platform holder...
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I can only speak from personal viewpoint but it makes a difference as Microsoft have been talking down generations, in which case you must assume Scorpio will at some point will get games released exclusively for it where the PS4 pro will always be tied to the PS4. That performance delta makes this more plausible in my mind and a large part why I hope for a good CPU uplift over PS4 Pro.
To me the interest in Scorpio derives from it should have its own full lifespan that I can buy into now , rather than PS4 Pro where you know its got a limited life because its tied to PS4. This in part is possibly the same reasoning many 360 owners had when the went to PS4 knowing it was more powerful, I did not so cannot truthfully say.
I will say as a non PS4 owner the Pro so far has failed to excite so far; the hardware in Scorpio interests me greatly, however I do think Microsoft need to wow us to justify its later arrival. Also if they could make it look sexy like the S so its easier to sell the idea to the boss that would be grand, the One S set the bar with ease of entry into the living room
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