settings would be hard to predict but basically my guess is if PS4 Pro is running a game 1440p then Scoprio will run that game at 1800p with more stable/slightly higher framerate.
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Middle Generation Console Upgrade Discussion [Scorpio, 4Pro]
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Let's assume SM6 will come to XBO and Scorpio as for all DX12 based GPUS. There will be locked features within SM6 that will require hardware, much like DX12 Feature levels.
I suspect heavily that Scorpio will be FL12_0+ and have more SM6.0 hardware support than any existing GPU on the market today.
At the very least you should see the following on Scorpio:
edit: at the very least you should see resolution and framerate differences. I'm actually hoping developers go another path, this path:
Shadow quality, both resolution and shadow softening
http://images.nvidia.com/geforce-co...active-comparison-001-nvidia-hfts-vs-low.html
This is something that stands out in that W3 gif from E3 reveal
Lighting - SVOGI, varying qualities of hardware based GI.
Once again, this is exactly the type of features visible in the E3 reveal of W3
Execute Indirect.
Denser foliage, particles, large amount of draw calls that can kill a weak CPU
http://www.redgamingtech.com/directx-12-gdc-2015-early-technical-analysis-news/
All this tech exists today, we haven't even touched on SM6 task management and other features it will enable to developers.
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I'm going to play devils advocate here. (and yes, this is also directed at mrcorbo)
At the moment, the user install base is something like this:
PS4 ~55 million (?)
Xbox1 ~26 million (?)
I take it these numbers are more or less accurate. We know in the NA, XB1 is quite competitive with the PS4, the PS4 at a slight advantage. If we assume a 45/55 split, it means the PS4 must be leading at more than 66/33 in the rest of the world (Europe/Asia/etc) to end up at having more or less a 2:1 lead globally.
We are 3 years into this generation, which as mrcorbo put it, is what we expect to be half way. The problem with a lead such as this, is that people faced with buying either console will most likely end up with the more successful one because there isn't much that differentiates both and people tend to buy the more popular/successful one. This will continue to be the case for at least a few months until Scorpio releases. We will have to wait at least until June (or so I am reading) until Microsoft will tell us more. By then, I expect the gap between to PS4 and the Xbox to be even larger. That is a very steep battle. The only hope Microsoft (IMO) has, is to reach parity in NA and maybe surpass Sony there with help of the Scorpio. Could they do it? Certainly. NA has been a very strong market for Microsoft with the X360. But those that have already "jumped ship" and bought themselves a PS4, I can't really see them jumping ship again mid generation. Maybe some will buy both and replace one with the other eventually, but I don't expect that to be a majority.
On a worldwide basis, I expect Sony to ride this one out comfortably. The people buying 4k screens now are covered with the Pro. The only advantage I can see Microsoft has is that they are offering support for Bluray UHD (or whatever it's called) which Sony missed and might appeal to some people dishing out money for 4k screens and wanting to exploit that to the maximum by also buying some 4k movies. But they [Sony] could easily solve that by offering a newer revision later on.
I'm thinking at same resolution, to see how much visual difference Scorpio could bring if it didn't have to target higher resolutions. So either 1080p PS4Pro versus 1080p Scorpio (PC equivalent) or 1440p (reconstruction res) vs 1440p PC.
Minor I think. They did post a lot about 4K I agree, as a method of marketing. But it's true in the end they would be comfortable with settling with just the best graphics.Microsoft's self-inflicted problem is they mocked PS4 Pro's checkerboard solution as not "native" 4K yet we know from their own leaked white paper the are also exploring/promoting this for devs having already committed too "Any games we’re making that we’re launching in the Scorpio time frame, we’re making sure they can natively render at 4K."
So well done for creating that PR dilemma, Microsoft. They can waste GPU powerful on native 4K for their own games to meet their commitment or look like dicks for doing exactly what Sony did having mocked them for it.
If you remove the concept of reaching parity with PS4 and you look at the long game, like where will Xbox be in 10 years, it makes a lot of sense to start right with Scorpio. Picking your battles is key, and as a business decision we would imagine that MS (being around as long as they have) are smart enough to know when to stop investing into a losing area for themselves. All successful companies have ups and downs, I've never seen a company just keep going up without some failures here and there. MS needs to be playing the long game here, the short game is PS4. Pretty sure they know they won't win that.
I think that them going on about 4k the way they did was a mistake, one I may understand (simple message) , but in the end it shouldn't cause them a problem.
I think message should've been "best looking and performing games on any screen" or something like that.
On x1 their first party games are 1080p (some dynamic) as far as I can remember.
They can do the same for Scorpio 4k dynamic.
Leave 2nd and 3rd parties to push for even more pretty pixels, especially as those are easier to compare and as many people have said mulitplats are the big sellers this gen.
Even if Scorpio isn't for the mainstream, it can have a halo effect on the brand.
Publishers use it to demo games, send out preview codes for review on it, etc. Things like that start to have an impact on what people see.
Ms needs to become lead platform where possible and grab some more marketing deals.
It's about establishing foundation including for x1, for the mid to long term, especially if they do try to blur generations.
I think message should've been "best looking and performing games on any screen" or something like that.
On x1 their first party games are 1080p (some dynamic) as far as I can remember.
They can do the same for Scorpio 4k dynamic.
Leave 2nd and 3rd parties to push for even more pretty pixels, especially as those are easier to compare and as many people have said mulitplats are the big sellers this gen.
Even if Scorpio isn't for the mainstream, it can have a halo effect on the brand.
Publishers use it to demo games, send out preview codes for review on it, etc. Things like that start to have an impact on what people see.
Ms needs to become lead platform where possible and grab some more marketing deals.
It's about establishing foundation including for x1, for the mid to long term, especially if they do try to blur generations.
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Deleted member 11852
Guest
It's something that undermines Microsoft's credibility. They're not working from a market position of strength here, they need to drop these amateur PR antics. This generation of Xbox has been one inevitable backtrack after another.
If people don't believe what you say, they'll be less likely to invest in your product.
That's why I said it depends on your definition of success. If you're just scoreboard watching, Scorpio isn't going to make Xbox platform "win" this generation. I don't happen to think that that is the only result that would qualify Scorpio as a success.
No absolutely, I agree. Scorpio is a necessity. Absolutely. My point is more in regards to:
1.) I think Scorpio is coming way too late. Release date should have been far more aggressive, if not earlier than PS4pro or at worst same time
2.) that I am not expecting any miracles in regards to them catching up Sony this generation.
3.) The hardware is only one element. If they are to sway people like me (PS customers) to the Xbox brand, they will have to be much more aggressive and leading ahead and not reacting to what Sony is doing (e.g. being a step behind).
This whole situation just reminds me too much of PS3 vs X360 but in reverse. There the PS3 was behind, massively behind and even though they [Sony] managed to catch up on a world-wide basis, they lost a lot of marketshare due to the hickups. Now it's in reverse; Microsoft is behind and we see them playing catch up while Sony is seemingly always a step ahead. Even if PS4pro is weaker, they beat their competitor almost a full year and are already gaining sales. Coming with more powerful hardware but late isn't going to work well - it didn't for the PS3 (at least in NA), and even so, the PS3 was aided by the belief of being vastly more powerful, having Bluray and managed to keep many existing PS2 owners waiting.
This is a mid generation upgrade, not a new console. Why should people be waiting to get a Scorpio if it's only Xbox1 1.5? It isn't going to offer new games. It's going to over the same games at better visuals - something the Pro (and the PS4) is already doing vs the current Xb1.
For whatever reasons they have decided to wait an additional year. I'm sure this has to do with the hardware requiring more time to bake.
I guess we'll know the answer to this by E3. Resolution and frame rate only upgrades would not be able to change the direction of course for Xbox. It needs to be more.
How they market Scorpio at E3 will be pretty important. They will have some true native 4K AAA games, and they will have less. The critical part is having the ability to do true 4K for developers that want to go that route. And other ways for developers to go their route. I don't think you will be seeing different graphical options like you do with 4Pro. It sounds like they are giving full control to the developer on how they want to proceed.
Tkumpathenurpahl
Veteran
The timing of its release is what makes me think it would be in their best interest to have a Zen CPU in there, however costly. This will be Microsoft's chance to get a head start on the next generation: it will launch as a more powerful XBoxOne, but will be the new base model in a few years.
The messaging is probably the most difficult part of that but, in three years, when the PS5 launches, they'll have an existing box on the market that can function as a cheaper competitor. For that to be so, they need a CPU in the Scorpio that will be capable of keeping up with the PS5 to some extent i.e. half the cores, lesser clockspeed, but the same, fundamental architecture.
Anyway, if they get this right and it's PC enough in design, they should be able to iterate as frequently as the market is willing to purchase.
I think the only truly shitty thing with the Scorpio is that they're not supporting VR with the XBoxOne. If smartphones have VR content, and the PS4 can cope, then so too could the XBoxOne, albeit with fairly poor image quality. Would PS2 quality games with VR's immersion be such a bad thing?
The messaging is probably the most difficult part of that but, in three years, when the PS5 launches, they'll have an existing box on the market that can function as a cheaper competitor. For that to be so, they need a CPU in the Scorpio that will be capable of keeping up with the PS5 to some extent i.e. half the cores, lesser clockspeed, but the same, fundamental architecture.
Anyway, if they get this right and it's PC enough in design, they should be able to iterate as frequently as the market is willing to purchase.
I think the only truly shitty thing with the Scorpio is that they're not supporting VR with the XBoxOne. If smartphones have VR content, and the PS4 can cope, then so too could the XBoxOne, albeit with fairly poor image quality. Would PS2 quality games with VR's immersion be such a bad thing?
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Deleted member 11852
Guest
So no different to PS4 Pro then except Sony didn't commit their first parties to native 4K (or 1800p or 1440p or any specific resolution at all) when they may have preferred spending the GPU power elsewhere. It feels like the marketing people at Microsoft call the shots, not the technical people.
Tkumpathenurpahl
Veteran
Possibly. Sony do seem to have a better grasp on the balance that needs to be struck between customers and developers/publishers. That said, they could have done with their marketing department telling them to include a UHD drive in the Pro.
Probably not, except for everybody would say that VR sucks on Xbone and PS4 is super duper more powerful than Xbone, just look at the VR. Its logs for the flames
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Deleted member 11852
Guest
I have no expectation that Microsoft will follow through on their first party native 4K vow. They'll spin it in some positive (or confusing) way. They've done this before, remember the 720p MSAA TRC on 360? It would be the right thing to do, but it's shitty to promise customers something then not deliver. Some people won't care, some people will care but make excuses for the oathbreaker (I've been watching Game of Thrones season 6!), others will be annoyed.
It's better to avoid putting yourself in this position in the first place. Treat your customers with respect, don't promise things you can't deliver after they've bought in already.
My expectations are native 4K for Forza (non-Horizon). Probably native 4K (dynamic resolution) for Halo 5 and Gears of War 4. Games like Crackdown 3 and Sea of Thieves might reach native 4K..but they don't appear demanding graphically.
But other than that I don't expect many AAA native 4K games.
But other than that I don't expect many AAA native 4K games.
Rikimaru
Veteran
PS3 was selling better than 360 worldwide though. I believe PS3 beat 360 in the end despite a year 360 headstart.
Now MS is even further behind everywhere except US.
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