First Killzone screenshot/details? So says USAToday..

i think the issue is the tried to pass the CGI as real time... and lay off the sugar with the "out of this world" I don't think is that much better than stuff like COD4 or Gears or Unreal Tourney.

You don't like those games either then?

(leave the guy alone.. If he thinks the game looks wonderous then it probably does to him.. Why don't you lay off trying to force your own oppinion's on the visual appeal of the game on others.. :rolleyes: )
 
Question

i think the issue is the tried to pass the CGI as real time... and lay off the sugar with the "out of this world" I don't think is that much better than stuff like COD4 or Gears or Unreal Tourney.

Doesn't the term "graphic fidelity" mean the game retains most of the visual quality of it counterpart? In this case the CGI Killzone tailer?
 
You don't like those games either then?

(leave the guy alone.. If he thinks the game looks wonderous then it probably does to him.. Why don't you lay off trying to force your own oppinion's on the visual appeal of the game on others.. :rolleyes: )


Oh I think it looks very good. But the out of this world only possible on ps3 kinda things I thought it was not very well received in this forum.
 
Havnt seen a single game that has come near the graphics (technically) in ToyStory.
This is a in-game ss from KZ2:
KZ2sl1.jpg

Do you really mean that KZ2 is the best -looking game (on console of course;)) and that it is "out of this world"?
If you do I guess you have missed a lot of games that is "out of this world".
 
Haven't checked the whole thread - has this been posted yet?

CG vs in-game comparison:

http://generationdreamteam.free.fr/afrika/killzone2/KillZone2compa.jpg

Obviously not quite upto the CG but much closer than I was ever expecting.
This game really has blown me away graphically more than any other game.

The best thing about it for me is that whatever rendering technique they are using along with all the filters and post-processing gives the game a very movie-like look.
 
Sad to see this thread took a turn for the worse, but I can't say I'm surprised.



I've given them ample congrats on a great job with KZ2 and will continue to do so as it isn't lip service. The team looks to be preparing an awesome AAA gaming experience. But this talk of PS3 = RT CGI has to stop.

Truth be told, there are other games on the market currently that outshine this demo in many ways and others which are coming soon that do the same. It shouldn't diminish the fact that GG has done an outstanding job with this effort, but let's try to keep the perspective grounded in reality a bit.
 
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Didnt IGN say the game uses both static and dynamic lighting? Why are you guys arguing. Bottom line, at the end of the day the game looks damn good. Best looking console game imo.
 
Havnt seen a single game that has come near the graphics (technically) in ToyStory.
This is a in-game ss from KZ2:
KZ2sl1.jpg

Do you really mean that KZ2 is the best -looking game (on console of course;)) and that it is "out of this world"?
If you do I guess you have missed a lot of games that is "out of this world".

I dont know about you but this image could have been used as proof of the Killzone's unique visual quality. Unless ofcourse you nitpick on areas that still doesnt affect the game from looking visually unmatched.
 
E3 2005 Killzone 2 CGI cannot be done on the PS3. Not by a longshot. You can with artwork achieve something close to that, but no way in hell you can do the same rendering techniques applied to the trailer in realtime on a PS3.

KZ2 looks great and all that, its still lightyears away from the CGI technically speaking.

this argument is ill-minded

1/ Even if you're an ignorant newbee programmer, it would be very stupid to even try to use offline techniques to render a game (one media is not superior to the other,they are different media ) That said ,i don't think it's less technical to put what we saw in 450 Mb of Memory and render it 30 times per second ,...not even talking about interactivity...

2/The point is not to discusss if technically it matches ,but if it matches overall visually .Nobody will try to defend the first ,but the second is certainly another matter (if you can mentally remove the camera work from the cgi,some parts are actually better than the cgi).

Now,for average joe who don't care about technicalities ,i'd say Guerrilla has done the promised deal.
 
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=170302&page=96

post 4767

Not sure if everyone seen this.

However incredible detail and animation of moving in first person looking through sight as your walking down stairs.

The amount of animation as the sight bobbles, and the green laser site look is superb. In addition later on the gun seems to sway to the right as you turn your body.

Amazing attention to detail, I honestly cant believe its supposidly pre-alpha at this stage!
 
Gotta love Killzone threads :oops:

The game is very impressive looking, given that it's pre-alpha makes it more exciting, i can't wait to see the finished product.

As for the best looking game or the like comments - I agree the COD4 trailer is also very impressive and is not knocked for 6 so to speak, by killzone.

I look forward to seeing how killzone compares visually to fps games launched around the same time as it.

Loving the movie like quality the game gives off, my biggest gripe in action is the way the npc's talk, their mouths look terrible... but that's nitpicking...
 
Sad to see this thread took a turn for the worse, but I can't say I'm surprised.



I've given them ample congrats on a great job with KZ2 and will continue to do so as it isn't lip service. The team looks to be preparing an awesome AAA gaming experience. But this talk of PS3 = RT CGI has to stop.

Truth be told, there are other games on the market currently that outshine this demo in many ways and others which are coming soon that do the same. It shouldn't diminish the fact that GG has done an outstanding job with this effort, but let's try to keep the perspective grounded in reality a bit.

Excellent post!
 
Off the tangent, back to the topic.

I think everybody can sense that it's spiraling a little too far out of bounds at this point.
 
Back on topic, is there any particular (technical) reason why Guerilla (spelling) chose not to use normal\bump mapping on anything but characters?

Aspecially the wall\dropship\ground textures wouldn't be that bad off with some pixelshaders
 
Back on topic, is there any particular (technical) reason why Guerilla (spelling) chose not to use normal\bump mapping on anything but characters?

Aspecially the wall\dropship\ground textures wouldn't be that bad off with some pixelshaders

I would assume memory space and becouse the environments will be destructible (to what point I dont know). That would mean a lot of debris and extra use of RAM.
 
Back on topic, is there any particular (technical) reason why Guerilla (spelling) chose not to use normal\bump mapping on anything but characters?

Aspecially the wall\dropship\ground textures wouldn't be that bad off with some pixelshaders

I guess it must be because of the framerate, I mean I´ve already seen a lot of frame drops on the latest vids ( I was not streaming the video and no there´s is nothing wrong with my computer:LOL: ).
 
I guess it must be because of the framerate, I mean I´ve already seen a lot of frame drops on the latest vids ( I was not streaming the video and no there´s is nothing wrong with my computer:LOL: ).

Not really, I think it is about memory space (RAM) and becouse of extra objects that will cover the ground from the destructible environments system. How much can be destructed is another question but I think key parts will be able to get destroyed. Such things as pillars, selected walls and small stuff like cables, wood planks and such.

About the framerate then yes it was a bit unstable during gameplay (I esstimate 20-30fps) but as a game in pre-alpha stage then I dont see any problem with this at all.
 
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Ironically people arent discussing "technology", what it has achieved considering it is real time and the technical cepabilities of the console, how it did it, what techniques and tricks have been used etc etc.

In the contrary the discussion isnt any better than any other forum.

Also people seem to ignore than not everyone is a tech geek in here and there are no rules that force these people to shut up or not express what they see.
The "technological" nature of the forum can be used only as an excuse since it is also unfairly nitpicked by people who dont know about graphics or technology.

It is being nitpicked to death as if there is a perfect looking game, and it is being nitpicked for things other games are doing worse, while everything that sets it apart or is impressive is completely undiscussed or downplayed in case someone tries to. Why?

And this is not a problem only in here. It is almost in every thread.

They are real time games and they should be judged as such. "I see a blurry texture, I see no shadow, hey there is no reflection here". That's not a technological discussion by any means. Especially when people are selective with what screen they choose to discuss upon.

In case of Killzone 2 yes it suffers just like every other real time game. Ofcourse. It is real time on a certain hardware and the devs arent Gods. In some places to a lesser extend in others to a greater. Bottom line is that the developers have chosen the right things to reduce or increase at the right places, leaving room for improvement on important areas to achieve the needed visual illusion that people craved to believe this is like a CGI movie (irrelevant whether it has reached the original). Trying to nitpick some parts is only the half story. Seeing the whole picture is different. The forum is not about nitpicking.
All games lack in an area or two. It is a natural phenomenon. The forum is about everything.

The screenshots showing things such as lack of some shadows (missing only in some areas but totally mindblowing and existing in others. But this was ignored and undiscussed. Only certain images that lack them deserve discussion?), some blurred textures and the likes express their very careful and smart approach. If I didnt watch the screenshots first I wouldnt have noticed until I tried to watch it more carefully.

Lastly the game is being criticized in here for its static imagery, but thats just only a part of the whole package. The A.I, animation and physics are also part of the complete visual quality. Yet this is downlplayed as well despite that it is doing it so well that, animation for example, feels as if it came out of a CGI movie. These are technical achievements too. And they also played their role at increasing the illusion of a CGI render. Such animations and varied motions I only saw them in CGI and never have I expected Guerilla to do that so extraordinary well during gameplay. This also played its part in fooling people because it gives a sense of something scripted while it is not. It is not just static imagery that make offline renders so much more impressive, so Killzone doesnt have to approach only that imagery in quality to fool the eye.

The fact that people were blown away and feel this was supposed to be achieved only on high end computers if at all gives information on the game's visual splendor.
 
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Ironically people arent discussing "technology", what it has achieved considering it is real time and the technical cepabilities of the console, how it did it, what techniques and tricks have been used etc etc.

In the contrary the discussion isnt any better than any other forum.

Also people seem to ignore than not everyone is a tech geek in here and there are no rules that force these people to shut up or not express what they see.
The "technological" nature of the forum can be used only as an excuse since it is also unfairly nitpicked by people who dont know about graphics or technology.

It is being nitpicked to death as if there is a perfect looking game, and it is being nitpicked for things other games are doing worse, while everything that sets it apart or is impressive is completely undiscussed or downplayed in case someone tries to. Why?

And this is not a problem only in here. It is almost in every thread.

They are real time games and they should be judged as such. "I see a blurry texture, I see no shadow, hey there is no reflection here". That's not a technological discussion by any means. Especially when people are selective with what screen they choose to discuss upon.

In case of Killzone 2 yes it suffers just like every other real time game. Ofcourse. It is real time on a certain hardware and the devs arent Gods. In some places to a lesser extend in others to a greater. Bottom line is that the developers have chosen the right things to reduce or increase at the right places, leaving room for improvement on important areas to achieve the needed visual illusion that people craved to believe this is like a CGI movie (irrelevant whether it has reached the original). Trying to nitpick some parts is only the half story. Seeing the whole picture is different. The forum is not about nitpicking.
All games lack in an area or two. It is a natural phenomenon. The forum is about everything.

The screenshots showing things such as lack of some shadows (missing only in some areas but totally mindblowing and existing in others. But this was ignored and undiscussed. Only certain images that lack them deserve discussion?), some blurred textures and the likes express their very careful and smart approach. If I didnt watch the screenshots first I wouldnt have noticed until I tried to watch it more carefully.

Lastly the game is being criticized in here for its static imagery, but thats just only a part of the whole package. The A.I, animation and physics are also part of the complete visual quality. Yet this is downlplayed as well despite that it is doing it so well that, animation for example, feels as if it came out of a CGI movie. These are technical achievements too. And they also played their role at increasing the illusion of a CGI render. Such animations and varied motions I only saw them in CGI and never have I expected Guerilla to do that so extraordinary well during gameplay. This also played its part in fooling people because it gives a sense of something scripted while it is not. It is not just static imagery that make offline renders so much more impressive, so Killzone doesnt have to approach only that imagery in quality to fool the eye.

The fact that people were blown away and feel this was supposed to be achieved only on high end computers if at all gives information on the game's visual splendor.

Post of the thread IMO well said.
 
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