HL2 40% faster on X800 compared to NV40?

[Evildeus]

I'm sure they will be faster in their respective game, but 40%...? :?

Look at the shadermark results.

If HL2 is shader limited, wouldn't the difference be much higher?

look at the shadermark results.

Well, if i look at the SM result, i would say that you are wrong. The results of the 800XT are 2 times as fast as the 9800XT. So if HL2 is shader limited, i should find 2 times faster results not just 40%

 

[Althornin]

I'm sure they will be faster in their respective game, but 40%...? :?

Look at the shadermark results.

If HL2 is shader limited, wouldn't the difference be much higher?

look at the shadermark results.

Well, if i look at the SM result, i would say that you are wrong. The results of the 800XT are 2 times as fast as the 9800XT. So if HL2 is shader limited, i should find 2 times faster results not just 40%

um, they are talking about compared to the 6800.................so i'd say you are wrong?

 

[jvd]

I'm sure they will be faster in their respective game, but 40%...? :?

Look at the shadermark results.

If HL2 is shader limited, wouldn't the difference be much higher?

look at the shadermark results.

Well, if i look at the SM result, i would say that you are wrong. The results of the 800XT are 2 times as fast as the 9800XT. So if HL2 is shader limited, i should find 2 times faster results not just 40%

um, they are talking about compared to the 6800.................so i'd say you are wrong?

exactly he said 40% faster and than any cards coming out this generation.

 

[Gunhead]

I'm pretty sure that article is misquoting Gabe, but I'm not positive.

EDIT:

"In terms of performance, it's pretty fast," said Gabe Newell, president of Valve Software, the developer of Half-Life II. "When I say 'pretty fast' I mean that its 40 percent faster in internal testing, faster than any next-generation parts that are coming out. That's a huge advantage in developing a game."

I interpreted this as 40% faster than the previous ATI hardware they were using as well as X% faster than the NV4X hardware.

Just reiterating that this reporting of Gabe's words clearly states what Ninelven summed up: 40% over their previous ATI, unspecified amount over NV40.

So you can dump the "Gabe said 40% faster than 6800U in HL2" theme now

 

[L233]

look at the shadermark results.

Oki.
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.html?i=2044&p=9

$500: ATI wins
$400: NVidia wins

Or did I miss something?

 

[AlphaWolf]

Just reiterating that this reporting of Gabe's words clearly states what Ninelven summed up: 40% over their previous ATI, unspecified amount over NV40.

So you can dump the "Gabe said 40% faster than 6800U in HL2" theme now

No, he clearly states

"In terms of performance, it's pretty fast," said Gabe Newell, president of Valve Software, the developer of Half-Life II. "When I say 'pretty fast' I mean that its 40 percent faster in internal testing, faster than any next-generation parts that are coming out. That's a huge advantage in developing a game."

That can easily be interpretted both ways. I expect we will find out when it ships.

 

[AlphaWolf]

look at the shadermark results.

Oki.
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.html?i=2044&p=9

$500: ATI wins
$400: NVidia wins

Or did I miss something?

Other than the XTPE having 30% more fillrate. I don't think so.

 

[Evildeus]

um, they are talking about compared to the 6800.................so i'd say you are wrong?

No he is not, he is talking of the 9800XT.

 

[Nick Spolec]

Note to Gabe Newell: Spend less time eating twinkies, more time developing your game.

 

[Evildeus]

That can easily be interpretted both ways. I expect we will find out when it ships.

I don't think so.

 

[Stryyder]

look at the shadermark results.

Oki.
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.html?i=2044&p=9

$500: ATI wins
$400: NVidia wins

Or did I miss something?

Actually NVIDIA loses at $400.00 because as far as I am concerned with only 3 or 4 people actually having actually seen the 6800 Gt and te fact that you can order the X800 Pro for $340.00 today, and add the fact that the 61.11 drivers that are the only drivers that support the 6800 GT are questionable, in my mind NVIDIA doesn't win crap at $400.00 but thats just me. At best $400.00 is undetermined.

My question is Anand says that the chart reflects 60.72 Driver results when we have been told that the 6800 GT is only supported on 61.11 what is with that. And why are there about 7 tests that cannot be run on the NV40 series of cards??

 

[Gunhead]

its 40 percent faster in internal testing, faster than any next-generation parts that are coming out

That can easily be interpretted both ways. I expect we will find out when it ships.

Actually, looking at it sharper, you're right. It can just as well refer to NV40.

Carry on, folks. Plenty of time to argue before HL2 ships (I don't suppose somebody could just ask Gabe to clarify.)

 

[Althornin]

um, they are talking about compared to the 6800.................so i'd say you are wrong?

No he is not, he is talking of the 9800XT.

no, he is not.
re-read the quote.
At the very least, admit the ambiguity of the quote.

 

[Jabbah]

um, they are talking about compared to the 6800.................so i'd say you are wrong?

No he is not, he is talking of the 9800XT.

no, he is not.
re-read the quote.
At the very least, admit the ambiguity of the quote.

Well, I got my girlfriend to check out the quote (shes a language degree graduate) and she reckons its very ambiguous.

I personaly would hope its more than 40% faster than the 9800XT, but would also be surprised if it was 40% faster than the 6800. Time will tell, and by that point there will be new drivers etc so probably wont hold anyway.

 

[saf1]

um, they are talking about compared to the 6800.................so i'd say you are wrong?

No he is not, he is talking of the 9800XT.

no, he is not.
re-read the quote.
At the very least, admit the ambiguity of the quote.

Does it matter? Honestly?

We all know it will run faster on ATI cards. Not because one is better than the other either. Just like D3 will run faster on the other brand.

Just a video game. Not like it makes you coffee or anything...

 

[L233]

Actually NVIDIA loses at $400.00 because as far as I am concerned with only 3 or 4 people actually having actually seen the 6800 Gt and te fact that you can order the X800 Pro for $340.00 today,

Doesn't matter in the long run if the X800 Pro is available a few weeks earlier. That doesn't determine which card is better. And where can you order the X800 Pro for $340?

and add the fact that the 61.11 drivers that are the only drivers that support the 6800 GT are questionable, in my mind NVIDIA doesn't win crap at $400.00 but thats just me. At best $400.00 is undetermined.

Ok, so the drivers are "questionable" - I doubt that can account for the huge difference in some of the tests. That's actually in line with the specs... the GT has 16 pipelines unlike the castrated XT that is sold as "Pro".

And why are there about 7 tests that cannot be run on the NV40 series of cards??

I wondered about that myself.

 

[ChrisW]

Gabe's statement does not mean jack squat without providing us with how he tested each card or providing us with the specific conditions needed to reproduce this. As far as I'm concerned, this is no better than nVidia's Doom3 benchmark they were in charge of and have been milking ever since. These are nothing more than tricks being used to sell cards. So far, it's being used to sell two generations of cards without providing us with a single way of verifying these tests.

 

[L233]

Gabe's statement does not mean jack squat

That applies to all of his statements. If Gabe stated the sky was blue I would rather double and triple check than taking his word for it.

 

[Scarlet]

The place is not exploding because noone really trust Gabe and are just in the wait an see mood.

JC is an other story or did you forget the infamous special doom 3 benchmark with Nvidia last may ?

My point is that i will never trust someone who GETS PAID by advertising his game as "running better" on a specific card, by the vendor of that specific card.
Even JC.

But ATI did not pay Valve to make HL2 run better on its product. Go back and look at what was actually said by Gabe and also by ATI in what? October?

I believe both parties claimed the only money that changed hands was for the right to bundle the game with boards. This is completely different from nV's TWIMTBP program, which is explicitly directed to pay developers to do the extra work to counter-act the weaknesses of the NV3x generation.

And if you are Newell's shoes, why would you really favor X800 over 6800? I mean it makes no sense at all. Why shoot yourself in the foot? I think Newell views himself as an engineer's engineer, and he just states the "facts" as he sees them. Of course in that mode he may take offense if anyone tries to get him to say something other than what he views as the facts. If anything Newell may be annoyed at nV's behavior last year (and has been showing it), but I really can't imagine him lifting a single finger to make his product run better on ATI HW than nV HW.

That would just be stupid and counter-productive.

As far as JC goes, I think he sees himself in much the same light as Gabe. I think he likes the extra wizzies nV habitually puts into its products (no matter how useless they are), and he exploits them (because after all he is an engineer). I bet he is glad to take those top-line dollars from nV, but I would be doubtful the dollars themselves motivate him to use those extra nV features. I think he does it because he likes them.

IMO, take their words as their view of reality and discount the effect that TWIMTBP dollars or bundling dollars have on what they say (however, if you really want to piss them off, accuse them of being "bought").

 

[Stryyder]

Actually NVIDIA loses at $400.00 because as far as I am concerned with only 3 or 4 people actually having actually seen the 6800 Gt and te fact that you can order the X800 Pro for $340.00 today,

Doesn't matter in the long run if the X800 Pro is available a few weeks earlier. That doesn't determine which card is better. And where can you order the X800 Pro for $340?

and add the fact that the 61.11 drivers that are the only drivers that support the 6800 GT are questionable, in my mind NVIDIA doesn't win crap at $400.00 but thats just me. At best $400.00 is undetermined.

Ok, so the drivers are "questionable" - I doubt that can account for the huge difference in some of the tests. That's actually in line with the specs... the GT has 16 pipelines unlike the castrated XT that is sold as "Pro".

And why are there about 7 tests that cannot be run on the NV40 series of cards??

I wondered about that myself.

My point was that the 6800 GT might never be available only 3 sites have reviewed them and noone knows when they will be available or it what quantaties as to the x800 cheap look here http://www.computers4sure.com/product.asp?productid=1909833&affid=933