NPD March 2009
- Thread starter RobertR1
- Start date
Yes but how many copies of software can sell a system with 8 milions of users and an average of 200-250k of console per month hit 700k only on holiday? Honestly...the selling aren't phenomenal but not even so bad. And yes, types of games is a big problem for ps3 users. Will see when jrpg coming out.
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No argument there, but in 18 days GTA:CW sold <90K when analysts were expecting between 200K and 400K in the first month. Heck, if GTA4 didn't bomb so hard on PC I'm sure a PC version of GTA:CW would have sold more in 18 days.
I doubt the game did any better in the other markets as it would appear NA is the most welcoming to GTA titles.
Ask high Voltage (the Conduit)
Anyway, 1)it cost less, 2)with so many consoles out there probably there is a market to any kind of games (even if not as big), as long as it is good, 3) less competition, 4) no market saturation, 5) it can be a lower risk, 6) no need to sell as many games to make proffit, 7) so many unexplored possibilitys make it a good place to get a big hit, 8) meybe an audience even more open to new ideas and not just to a new FPS (KZ2...
There is more ways of doing a game than investing a small (?
Well, I think L4D is a very good example why, if devs don't have mega-budgets, they don't have to necessarily target the DS-Wii. The PSP is out because of piracy and PS2 is probably on the way out. I do think the lower dev costs is a draw but they could achieve the same thing with PC which has a bigger potential market and wider audience than even the Wii with no royalties.
Is piracy that bad on PSP? I haven't seen any numbers or anything regards PSP piracy apart from the old custom firmware battles. There's also the option of download only titles - is that easier or harder to pirate? I guess Sony have got their act together and the PSP downloads are encrypted for individual units, otherwise game sharing would be rife!
The newer PSPs haven't been cracked yet that I know of, though games downloaded from PSN have. No idea if it's more involved than dumping a game from UMD like it was for old CFW'd PSPs.
I have my doubts as to the real impact of piracy: piracy on the DS is only slightly less trivial than it is on the PSP. I've heard people blaming GTA:CW's failure on piracy, but I find that hard to believe, as the platform better-known for piracy (the PSP) had no trouble selling over a million games. And depending on the market (particularly Japan), the PSP seems like a better target for PS2-level games than the Wii, though lots of developers are hedging their bets and going for both.
If you are refering to GTA on PSP, remember Liberty City Stories was bought by most people because it had one of the original exploits that broke open piracy for the PSP.
Not sure about Vice City Stories, but I remember something about it having the same exploit.
But so did Lumines.
It is quite possible, as well, that a GTA game would sell well even on PSP. That's generally how GTA games do. Chains of Olympus and Crisis Core also sold well, and by then you could just get yourself a pandora battery and a friend with CFW.
If the original question is whether piracy has hurt (even decimated) PSP software sales then the answer is without question yes.
Has it also hurt DS sales? Yes.
My point was that even the highest selling PSP title only sold as many as it did because it enabled piracy.
Not sure what other point you are trying to make.
And my point is that you can't say that, you have no evidence. It's just as possible that a strong IP sells on PSP, just as we saw with the few other strong franchises with games on PSP that released last year (GoW and FF7). Using piracy to explain poor sales is bad enough, but using piracy to explain good sales is too much.
This is not some obscure, unknown issue we are talking about here, is it? Maybe because at the time I was working on a PSP title I was very aware of the issue, but surely everyone knows about the GTA:LCS situation, (namely it's exploit and it's popularity amongst the "homebrew" community)? Or do you mean I have no evidence that piracy hasn't harmed software sales on the PSP?
Finally, do you find it hard to believe that people would buy one game so that they could subsequently get many for nothing?
No argument there, but in 18 days GTA:CW sold <90K when analysts were expecting between 200K and 400K in the first month. Heck, if GTA4 didn't bomb so hard on PC I'm sure a PC version of GTA:CW would have sold more in 18 days.
I doubt the game did any better in the other markets as it would appear NA is the most welcoming to GTA titles.
Meybe in one month they could still get near 200k WW. If that is case the meybe it is just the case that consumers arent so hyped for a +/-2D GTA (? I dont know the game).
Anyway, assuming it will not, then it is a a stranger case because there is in fact many hardcore gamers with DS. It could be the case that after experiencing GTA on consoles/PC they do see such a version as an inferior gaming experience? That is the way I look at most ports of PC/HD games for PS2 and Wii (I dont look at the same way for good Wii originals). Or gamers just want another kind of gaming in the DS (GTA sold well in the PSP?)
Personally I always think of Wii/DS as needing their own games (that is why you need something else to play too), meybe that felling is more generallized than I thought?
Actually I think that if L4D would have been released (assuming its gameplay is close to the HD version) EXCLUSIVELY on Wii, would have sold very well (althought I doubt as well as the 360 version, left alone the combined HD versions).
I mean that you have no evidence that the game sold millions because it enabled piracy. You have two pieces of evidence: that these games sold over a million pieces of software and that LCS enabled piracy. You're drawing a cause-effect relationship there when at best you can establish a weak correlation.
No, I don't. I do doubt two other factors: that enough PSP owners are tech-savvy enough that a million, or nearly a million of them will attempt the unlock themselves and that they would each buy the game. Has Twilight Princess Wii exploded in popularity since the hack?
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Ask high Voltage (the Conduit)
High Voltage's theories are just that, theories, until they sell a lot of Conduit copies
Compare current PS3 sales to 360 sales when the 360's userbase range from 4 million to 9 million and that will answer your question. Outside of FF, what jrpgs are suppose sell better then the high profile games we've seen release to a lukewarm reception?
Please take this as my opinion only.
I believe the lackluster sales of the PS3 and Killzone2 is a direct result of the economy affecting the people who purchase these materials. I will explain below.
It is my belief that the PS3 is marketted and being sold to individuals who are being hit with the current economic crisis harder then those who own the Wii and 360.
I don't want to place everyone into groups but I would assume that mass amount of 360s being/have been sold have been to 15-24yr olds. This group of people while you would assume would not have much disposable income have enough to purchase games regularly. If they are not in school they probably only have a car payment and drinking money to worry about. Their parents if young enough could be suppliying them with disposable income. They could be using some of the budget money from student loans in college (as if it doesn't happen) to buy games etc etc. They could still be living at home until they get a good enough job to move out and rent an apartment. Or they could be living with others all chipping into paying rent and buying games.
While a vast majority of those who have purchased a PS3 could be those individuals who are slightly older, possibly out of college and paying student loans. Possibly trying to make mortgage payments or other individuals who are still young and growing into their "adult" life style of paying bills and owing money for things.
The majority of people that I know who own the PS3 are older (28+), don't own a 360 and have either started a family or already have a family. While the majority of people I know who own a 360 are just out of highschool, don't have a family of thier own (single, no kids) or still in college.
Of all the family members I have who own a PS3, only 1 of them have children below the age of 17! That family members kids also have a 360 and a Wii; however it is my Uncle who plays the PS3 or/and uses it for Blu-Ray and streaming in the living room, while his kids play the others in thier bedrooms.
It is my belief that the current economic conditions of the past 6 years is what is the driving force behind the lackluster sales of the PS3 as compared to the 360 and Wii. If we were to have released these machines during the PS2's hayday only replacing the current economic conditions of now vs then; I think the PS3 would be selling much better and possibly even surpassing the 360 and Wii.
I know from personal experience that I just don't have the disposable money I used to have back when I owned the PS2. I was out of highschool; working with nearly no bills; no medical bills, no mortgage and a half way decent job. Now I'm married with a kid on the way and trying to balance a Mortgage payment with car payments, gas, electric, medical bills and food and clothing. My disposable income has shrunk to "rentals" of most games and serious budgetting efforts needed to purchase the PS3 to begin with. My situtation seems to echo with many people I know who own the PS3 as compared to those who own the 360.
How many people who purchased the PS3 are being hit harder with the current economy as compared to those who purchased the 360? Am I right in assuming that the vast majority of people who own a 360 have more disposable income then those who have purchased the PS3? Do more 14-18 year olds own more 360's then those who own PS3's? If what I am saying is correct then it would explain the lackluster sales as compared to the 360 and Wii on all fronts.
Was the PS3 marketted to an audience that was to be hit harder by the economic downturn as compared it its rivals?
As I said before this is just my opinion.
I believe the lackluster sales of the PS3 and Killzone2 is a direct result of the economy affecting the people who purchase these materials. I will explain below.
It is my belief that the PS3 is marketted and being sold to individuals who are being hit with the current economic crisis harder then those who own the Wii and 360.
I don't want to place everyone into groups but I would assume that mass amount of 360s being/have been sold have been to 15-24yr olds. This group of people while you would assume would not have much disposable income have enough to purchase games regularly. If they are not in school they probably only have a car payment and drinking money to worry about. Their parents if young enough could be suppliying them with disposable income. They could be using some of the budget money from student loans in college (as if it doesn't happen) to buy games etc etc. They could still be living at home until they get a good enough job to move out and rent an apartment. Or they could be living with others all chipping into paying rent and buying games.
While a vast majority of those who have purchased a PS3 could be those individuals who are slightly older, possibly out of college and paying student loans. Possibly trying to make mortgage payments or other individuals who are still young and growing into their "adult" life style of paying bills and owing money for things.
The majority of people that I know who own the PS3 are older (28+), don't own a 360 and have either started a family or already have a family. While the majority of people I know who own a 360 are just out of highschool, don't have a family of thier own (single, no kids) or still in college.
Of all the family members I have who own a PS3, only 1 of them have children below the age of 17! That family members kids also have a 360 and a Wii; however it is my Uncle who plays the PS3 or/and uses it for Blu-Ray and streaming in the living room, while his kids play the others in thier bedrooms.
It is my belief that the current economic conditions of the past 6 years is what is the driving force behind the lackluster sales of the PS3 as compared to the 360 and Wii. If we were to have released these machines during the PS2's hayday only replacing the current economic conditions of now vs then; I think the PS3 would be selling much better and possibly even surpassing the 360 and Wii.
I know from personal experience that I just don't have the disposable money I used to have back when I owned the PS2. I was out of highschool; working with nearly no bills; no medical bills, no mortgage and a half way decent job. Now I'm married with a kid on the way and trying to balance a Mortgage payment with car payments, gas, electric, medical bills and food and clothing. My disposable income has shrunk to "rentals" of most games and serious budgetting efforts needed to purchase the PS3 to begin with. My situtation seems to echo with many people I know who own the PS3 as compared to those who own the 360.
How many people who purchased the PS3 are being hit harder with the current economy as compared to those who purchased the 360? Am I right in assuming that the vast majority of people who own a 360 have more disposable income then those who have purchased the PS3? Do more 14-18 year olds own more 360's then those who own PS3's? If what I am saying is correct then it would explain the lackluster sales as compared to the 360 and Wii on all fronts.
Was the PS3 marketted to an audience that was to be hit harder by the economic downturn as compared it its rivals?
As I said before this is just my opinion.
Interesting theory, ageing consumer base may have different priorities that very true, they are more likely to be hit by crisis and even if not they can (like me) be more reasonable (just in case) and put some money aside till the emplyement situation gets better. The bright part is that when thing are better they have more buying power.
It would be interesting to have data in this regard (sadly we won't.)
It would be interesting to have data in this regard (sadly we won't.)
I don't think the theory is entirely without merit, but your anecdotal observations don't gel with mine.
I don't notice any difference between education level / age on PS3/360 in broad strokes. But at least in people I know, with one exception everyone who owns a PS3 also owns a 360. But lots of people own 360 and no PS3. The one exception was a guy who had no university degree (and potentially no high school diploma), as he was a mover who was moving me a couple weeks ago -- he only had a PS3.
In my observations and experiences, the PS3 is purchased after a 360 as an auxiliary game console/bluray player. People treat it as more of a luxury item, to enable them to play all games, like I do. The 360 remains their core gaming machine, while the PS3 is a "nice to have" extra.
This, too, would explain why PS3 sales suffer and 360 sales remain strong. The 360 is, for all practical purposes, most people's primary gaming console while the PS3 is a secondary console. At least this is the case with people I know here in Canada, with a heavy bias towards 20-40 year old technology professionals and their friends.
I don't notice any difference between education level / age on PS3/360 in broad strokes. But at least in people I know, with one exception everyone who owns a PS3 also owns a 360. But lots of people own 360 and no PS3. The one exception was a guy who had no university degree (and potentially no high school diploma), as he was a mover who was moving me a couple weeks ago -- he only had a PS3.
In my observations and experiences, the PS3 is purchased after a 360 as an auxiliary game console/bluray player. People treat it as more of a luxury item, to enable them to play all games, like I do. The 360 remains their core gaming machine, while the PS3 is a "nice to have" extra.
This, too, would explain why PS3 sales suffer and 360 sales remain strong. The 360 is, for all practical purposes, most people's primary gaming console while the PS3 is a secondary console. At least this is the case with people I know here in Canada, with a heavy bias towards 20-40 year old technology professionals and their friends.
High Voltage's theories are just that, theories, until they sell a lot of Conduit copies
True, but, in my defense, if those are more than theory (true or false) there would be no reason for the question.
Dregun,
from my anecdotal evidence my friends who own a PS3 tend to be the younger crowd (sub 28 years old), while my friends owning 360s vary in a quite a broad range. As for game buying habits, I find that the younger guys tend to buy more games while the older ones are more selective even in regards the 360. Of the 8 guys that own a 360, only 3 of us also own a PS3 (me included) and 1 also has a Wii.
from my anecdotal evidence my friends who own a PS3 tend to be the younger crowd (sub 28 years old), while my friends owning 360s vary in a quite a broad range. As for game buying habits, I find that the younger guys tend to buy more games while the older ones are more selective even in regards the 360. Of the 8 guys that own a 360, only 3 of us also own a PS3 (me included) and 1 also has a Wii.
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/3999/npd_behind_the_numbers_march_2009.php?page=3
Some more data on numbers:
Some more data on numbers:
