All purpose Sales and Sales Rumours and Anecdotes [2021 Edition]

Discussion in 'Console Industry' started by BRiT, Feb 5, 2021.

  1. iroboto

    iroboto Daft Funk
    Legend Regular Subscriber

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2014
    Messages:
    13,686
    Likes Received:
    16,922
    Location:
    The North
    The rate of increase is massive for Game Pass.
    It went from 10M users to 18M users in 6 months. That's nearly a doubling in 1/2 a year.
    Most things don't double annually, let alone 1/2 a year.

    Most companies expect a 5% growth on their subscribers year over year. They're getting nearly 300% if they kept that rate if they are at 30M users today (which likely they have not, that's just way too ambitious).

    I'm mentioning things like the stock market because, as you say, you have a company with a variety of incomes, interests and so forth. That alone are the same reasons why everyone isn't subscribed to the service.
    Some people don't want variety and yet some people want variety
    Some people want to play exactly and only 1 game
    And some people want to play them all.

    Some people have families that like all different things, and some people have families that aren't interested in gaming at all.

    You can make game pass free and still not get infinite sign ups. Many F2P games out there, and I'm fairly positive you didn't sign up and play all of them and it's free.
    You can't force someone to like something that they don't want or like.
    Game Pass being of good value has nothing to do with whether or not someone wants it. They put the service out there and people that want it are signing up. And everyone else that doesn't want it can stick with the traditional method.

    There's an implication here that the service is not successful because it hasn't monopolized the market. That's just an impossibility for any service and it's not in any way respective of real goals for a company. No company builds a product forecasting it to be the next sliced bread.

    That's like saying AMC or GME are not impressive stocks (to watch) because they didn't hit $1000 in share price to short squeeze, but ignoring that they are both over 1000% in gains in under a year.
     
    Johnny Awesome, AzBat and goonergaz like this.
  2. Silent_Buddha

    Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Messages:
    18,145
    Likes Received:
    8,431
    Eh?
    • 10 million subscribers in April of 2020
    • 15 million subscribers in September of 2020
    • 18 million subscribers in January of 2021
    • 23 million subscribers by April 20, 2021
    PS+
    • 20.8 million subscribers in Sony's FY15 Q4 report
    • 36 million subscribers in February of 2020
    • 45 million subscribers in August of 2020
    • 38.8 million subscribers in February of 2021
    • 47.6 million subscribers in March 2021
    Those are different types of services, but this is just to show the growth of the 2 services. One is a mature service that has been available since the PS3, the other is a service that has only been around for 4 years for Xbox Only and 2 years for PC.

    Netflix
    • 2001 - 456,000 subscribers
    • 2006 - 6.31 million subscribers
    • 2011 - 26.2 million subscribers
    That's not directly comparable to Game Pass either because of different time frames, but Game Pass is growing MASSIVELY faster than Netflix when it launched. :p I doubt Game Pass will ever reach the 207+ million subscribers that Netflix sits at now, but who knows? /shrug.

    Regards,
    SB
     
    #342 Silent_Buddha, Jun 2, 2021
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2021
    Johnny Awesome and goonergaz like this.
  3. zed

    zed
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2005
    Messages:
    5,616
    Likes Received:
    1,549
    I did see your reply about not slowing down which is an anecdote about some ppl not slowing down
    mine slow down is based on actual data.

    short US ferderal government page about it, with a lot of links
    https://safety.fhwa.dot.gov/intersection/roundabouts/

    On the other side Im sure you can find the opposite, though the difference is these will not be studies but will be some dude on the internet giving his opinion :p Just teasing you mate

    Anyways this is OT

    I was gonna write this before, but you obviously can not compare the time periods the world was much different in 2001 than 2017 (the internet had only just started)
    compare it to something more from the same time period eg disney+

    launched 18 months ago so a lot newer than gamepass but currently has 103 million subscribers, so its growing approx 10x quicker than gamepass
     
    goonergaz likes this.
  4. goonergaz

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2005
    Messages:
    4,394
    Likes Received:
    1,628
    Ah, thanks for clarifying...that (kind of) makes sense now
     
  5. Silent_Buddha

    Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Messages:
    18,145
    Likes Received:
    8,431
    But the same goes for that, comparing something launched by Disney to something launched by MS. I still remember when Disney VHS tapes of their animated movies would go for hundreds and sometimes thousands of dollars on Ebay. Disney movies + Star Wars franchise = instant explosion in popularity of just about anything they do.

    Regards,
    SB
     
    Johnny Awesome likes this.
  6. DSoup

    DSoup Series Soup
    Legend Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2007
    Messages:
    15,380
    Likes Received:
    11,491
    Location:
    London, UK
    Your comparison of Game Pass to PS+ is like comparing Xbox Live Gold to PS Now. Or Oranges to apples, i.e. they are different things.

    The last figure I saw from Microsoft floated ~100 active Xbox users so the current 24/25 million Game Pass subscribers does seem a bit low for how people rave about how good value it is. I can't help but also be aware that an awful lot of people who are proponents of Game Pass do seem to be getting their subscription über cheap or through rewards. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    If people who genuinely love the service won't front-up cash for Microsoft for the service, what hope is there for the wider Xbox audience? :runaway:
     
    goonergaz likes this.
  7. goonergaz

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2005
    Messages:
    4,394
    Likes Received:
    1,628
    Yeah, this is where I'm at - I can totally get it's grown well, but with all the deals and lockdown I'd say it's kind of a given. And whilst PS+ 'only' saw an increase of 30%ish over a year that's pretty impressive considering it's not offering a fraction of what GP does, Sony are not giving it away, and it's a pretty mature and saturated market which serves one specific audience. Likewise lockdown to blame if you ask me.

    My main thing was I'd be expecting a good high percentage of Xbox gamers to get GP without really thinking about it if it were such a great deal as put forward by folk on 't web.
     
  8. Silent_Buddha

    Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Messages:
    18,145
    Likes Received:
    8,431
    The same with how I can't understand why people think it's so low when the service wasn't even fully online until ~2 years ago. Prior to that it was limited to an install base (of consoles) of ~40-50 million.

    Myself, I'm amazed it has as many subscribers as it does for the limited time it's been around. /shrug

    In the interests of disclosure: I pay full price for the service. :p

    Personally, I'm interested to see if the growth rate continues through this year and next. That would mean potentially between 35-50 million subscribers by April, 2022 and up to 100+ million by April 2024.

    However, I don't believe that more than doubling the subscriber base every year is sustainable, so it's likely to be far less than that by 2024.

    Regards,
    SB
     
  9. iroboto

    iroboto Daft Funk
    Legend Regular Subscriber

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2014
    Messages:
    13,686
    Likes Received:
    16,922
    Location:
    The North
    Need it for multiplayer.

    That's a functional requirement to play. It's just not the same any way you slice it.
    If all you play is Call of Duty, or GTA V Online, Minecraft, Roblox or select some other online title, you need Gold/PS+. You don't need gamepass.

    If you only play FIFA, or other sports game that you buy only 1 copy of those games each year.
    And you play those online, you need Gold/PS+ and not game pass.

    If backing up saved games is critical component for you, you need PS+. You don't need game pass.

    If you only want to play F2P games, you need neither.
     
    #349 iroboto, Jun 2, 2021
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2021
    Johnny Awesome, DSoup and goonergaz like this.
  10. goonergaz

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2005
    Messages:
    4,394
    Likes Received:
    1,628
    I suppose when you look at it like that for napkin maths 50M consoles with 25M subs looks good...be interesting to see how many subs don't have an Xbox but I'd imagine it's quite small?
     
  11. BRiT

    BRiT (>• •)>⌐■-■ (⌐■-■)
    Moderator Legend Alpha

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    19,290
    Likes Received:
    22,139
    There's rumblings that Xbox Gold requirement will be entirely removed for Multiplayer Gaming but not until GamePass subscriber count is somewhere North of 50 Million. They won't remove the one revenue stream until its superceded by the other.

    No idea how accurate that is, but its not entirely out of left field.
     
  12. goonergaz

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2005
    Messages:
    4,394
    Likes Received:
    1,628
    Oh yeah I get that, but it's still a saturated and mature market vs gamepass. In fact I'd expect PS+ sales to maybe even drop as we come out of lockdown...I'm just not expecting GP sales to double next year...and yes you can quote me :p
     
  13. goonergaz

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2005
    Messages:
    4,394
    Likes Received:
    1,628
    Remove it or wrap it into GP?

    Not being funny MS have only just removed the paywall from FTP so seems unlikely to just be dropped.
     
  14. iroboto

    iroboto Daft Funk
    Legend Regular Subscriber

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2014
    Messages:
    13,686
    Likes Received:
    16,922
    Location:
    The North
    yea i'm not expecting antoher growth like this. It should slow down around 30m. I can't imagine them hitting 40M by end of 2022. I would say that would be very successful. Unless the market is expanded somehow, annual game pass is still 200+ dollars and gold is only 60. If you are on a budget, or just like to save money, game pass is not likely for you.

    GP has perhaps 1 last potential big growth left in it, and if MS proves it's first party output, then we will see it happen by end of 2022. People will sign up and stay onboard. If they fail, I can't see it getting any larger than this.
     
    AzBat and goonergaz like this.
  15. BRiT

    BRiT (>• •)>⌐■-■ (⌐■-■)
    Moderator Legend Alpha

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    19,290
    Likes Received:
    22,139
    Rumblings indicate it being removed entirely, so then paid games operate like F2P games from MultiPlayer perspective without needing gold.

    From what I understand, with the way the Gold APIs are baked into so many titles at different points it was a bit of a delicate operation to get the F2P exclusions put into place. Possibly even getting into sections no one has touched since forever ago. It should be substantially quicker to "flip the switch" to turn the requirement entirely off now.

    There might still be a bit of a cleanup or behind the scenes needed for all the Xbox One Games with Gold entitlements checks, since those still perform a Gold check every so often before startup of the game.
     
    AzBat and goonergaz like this.
  16. BRiT

    BRiT (>• •)>⌐■-■ (⌐■-■)
    Moderator Legend Alpha

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    19,290
    Likes Received:
    22,139
    US prices:
    $30 EA Play
    $60 Gold
    $120 GamePass Console
    $120 Game Pass PC, includes EA Play
    $180 Game Pass Ultimate include EA Play, Gold, Console, PC and bonus xCloud

    I think if they didn't have Gold requirement then GamePass Console would be more appealing to broader market.

    Oh, and who knows how things change if and when Ubisoft+ service is added.
     
    AzBat, goonergaz and iroboto like this.
  17. iroboto

    iroboto Daft Funk
    Legend Regular Subscriber

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2014
    Messages:
    13,686
    Likes Received:
    16,922
    Location:
    The North
    sorry beaver GPU prices lol.
    yea, US is going to be cheaper for sure.
     
  18. megre

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2018
    Messages:
    157
    Likes Received:
    77
    I can't help but think that GP subscriber number reached 20+ million because of the Xbox Live Gold conversion. Basically, all XBL Gold members converted because there's no reason not to. The 20M+ sub we're seeing now is the number of XBL Gold subs converted to GPU. Wasn't there around 20M XBL Gold the last time MS made the number public?
     
  19. BRiT

    BRiT (>• •)>⌐■-■ (⌐■-■)
    Moderator Legend Alpha

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    19,290
    Likes Received:
    22,139
    No. Far more gold than that number. The increase didn't happen all at once but paced close to 1 Million a month.
     
  20. AzBat

    AzBat Agent of the Bat
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2002
    Messages:
    7,628
    Likes Received:
    4,595
    Location:
    Alma, AR
    I feel like that's a slight to the people who are in-tune with deals & not being ignorant of what's available. Just because there are those who don't or haven't paid for it, doesn't mean that they also wouldn't pay full price for it. I definitely love the service & I will pay full price when MS finally sunsets Rewards or other deals. I will also continue to recommend to anybody I know that Game Pass is worth the $10 or $15/mo too. I will just make to sure to let them know that if they're interested in saving money there are legit ways to do that. Most people would just rather connect their credit card to their account or buy a pre-paid card at retail. Time is money as they say. So just because you see accounts of people not paying for it doesn't mean that's the majority. I know you just got your first Xbox, but these are things we've been harping in this forum for years.

    Tommy McClain
     
    DSoup likes this.
Loading...

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...