Rumor: MS and Bungie splitting
- Thread starter RobertR1
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Buy outs typically happen to underperforming units or the company as a whole is in financial trouble. Neither is the case with MS as its no where near financial troube and Bungie is responsible for the most successful gaming franchise in the history of MS in terms of popularity and profits.
Wholesale migration is not going to happen as there will be talent within Bungie who will be enticed by opportunities of promotions created by the departures, if a part of the Bungie team leaves to create a new studio.
MS is more likely to spin out a newly created first or second party dev house stock with Bungie talent and give more creative and overall control to those heading up the dev. This would give provide all the desires of those within Bungie and still allow MS to benefit at the same time.
archangelmorph
Veteran
That's Bioware.
archangelmorph
Veteran
Ah thanks for the clarafication!
Well, you use the word 'typically,' but what about this whole thing sounds typical? We can't just try to ramrod every transaction that occurs out there into a sort-of generic plan for M&A and spinoff activity. There are plenty of exceptions of profitable units being sold or spun-off to serve the business interests of the various involved parties.
Whatever happens (if anything), the real question I am most curious about is: What should have MS done to prevent any shakeup that prevents MS from leveraging the Bungie asset (by far their most valuable)? Bungie is pretty significant in preaching and establishing their platform vision. Bungie established MS as a serious gaming platform with Halo, validated and solidified their position as the online market space leader with Halo 2, and have clearly branched deeper into social gaming with Halo 3 and finally, after all these years, have not just the Xbox blockbuster but the industry blockbuster.
Rare, Digital Anvil, FASA... MS has a horrible trend with their internal studios. All the talk of new IPs, profit sharing, management of the Halo franchise, etc could have all been easily accomplished with no drama or spinoffs. Creative control and funding also should be nominal issues for a studio of Bungie's status. If they have had issues in these areas MS's top management needs to immediately resolve these issues within MGS. Bach, Kim, Satchell, etc are all replacable.
MS has only one Bungie.
Rare, Digital Anvil, FASA... MS has a horrible trend with their internal studios. All the talk of new IPs, profit sharing, management of the Halo franchise, etc could have all been easily accomplished with no drama or spinoffs. Creative control and funding also should be nominal issues for a studio of Bungie's status. If they have had issues in these areas MS's top management needs to immediately resolve these issues within MGS. Bach, Kim, Satchell, etc are all replacable.
MS has only one Bungie.
That is worth repeating!
It reminds me of the advertising industry. Most I know in it change jobs every three years or so. It is also relevant in discussing the true value of a development studio. If the IP is not owned my the developer and its true assets are its employees whom are mobile (perhaps actively so), then where is the long term value?
From a business standpoint, MS should issue an IPO for it.
scooby_dooby
Legend
The founder of bungie who left created Stubbs the Zombie for example. Who knows what these guys have in their heads...
On the subject of Gears replacing halo, I think you're way off, but rather than getting into a long drawn out comparison I'll just make a couple points:
1. MS does not own the GOW IP. AFAIK they have rights to GOW2 and that's it. So even if your theory is true, and Gears continues to grow in an extremely popular franchise, GoW3 could easily end up on the PS3 as well.
2. Gears lacks the mass appeal Halo has. It was little more than a very nice looking shooter with excellent cover mechanics. The story was tied together with shoestrings and bubblegum, the combat lacked any real sort of tension for most of the game, and the variety in gameplay was virtually nonexistent (corridor or courtyard.)
I think it's obvious from your impressions of Halo that you immediately were not too enamored with the game. Don't make the mistake of thinking your opinion matches those of everyone else.
You can probably understand that many people value a good story, frenetic combat, tactical decisions and gameplay variety over nice animations, cutting edge graphics and lack of a HUD.
keyn said:
Many possibilities exist, like forming a new joint-venture for Halo only (or the other way round: Keep Halo with MS, and hosts Bungie in its truest form in a JV).
dobwal said:
I think it also depends on whether the Bungie guys want to, or not. It is no longer a "Microsoft wants this" or "MS can do that" thing. The Bungie people will probably gang together to improve their negotiation leverage at the moment.
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scooby_dooby
Legend
On the subject of this rumour, it sounds as if there's certainly fire here.
At this point it's really getting comical. MS is really on a self destruct path, could they really mess anything more up??
It's hilarious to me that they would strain the relationship with their #1 studio over E3!!?? Because E3 is really *that* important?? You gotta be kidding me...
This is the same conference they put that cheeseball Jeff Bell up, to play a fake demo of Madden 08?? Seriously?? And you guys are that worried about people's impression of the show, that was the best you could come up with??
Not sure who's running the show over there but wow, these guys sure have done a poor job of managing their assets. I also feel that Bungie is a little overrated, but at the same time, you don't kill your golden goose over a couple of pennies.
My prediction will be a win-win relationship here. Either MS will retain publishing rights to Bungie, or the company will split into two entities with MS retaining publishing rights for both.
At this point it's really getting comical. MS is really on a self destruct path, could they really mess anything more up??
It's hilarious to me that they would strain the relationship with their #1 studio over E3!!?? Because E3 is really *that* important?? You gotta be kidding me...
This is the same conference they put that cheeseball Jeff Bell up, to play a fake demo of Madden 08?? Seriously?? And you guys are that worried about people's impression of the show, that was the best you could come up with??
Not sure who's running the show over there but wow, these guys sure have done a poor job of managing their assets. I also feel that Bungie is a little overrated, but at the same time, you don't kill your golden goose over a couple of pennies.
My prediction will be a win-win relationship here. Either MS will retain publishing rights to Bungie, or the company will split into two entities with MS retaining publishing rights for both.
To some extent, perhaps. However, getting known as the guys who attempted to blackmail their corporate overlords and failed wouldn't be the best move to attract funding for future projects (even if you're the guys who created Halo). In the same vain, MS can't allow themselves to be known as the giant that got blackmailed by its own subsidiary.
scooby_dooby
Legend
Exactly, you kill it by being greedy (by forcing new Halo development).
Yes, the patented J Allard 'EA mentality'. It's unfortunate MS couldn't learn a few lessons from Sony in this regard, who have maintained strong relationships with developers for decades.
Allowing their developers to branch out seems to be essential to maintaining strong relationships.
Of course the constant turnover and relocation of Execs within MGS itself does nothing to help the situation...
Awesome info, I didn't know that. Thanks.
Bungie staff are very talented people, they added new features to the FPS genre and new life to console games. Hope MS doesn't get rid of Halo's series for Xbox because it's my favourite game.
Without knowing the actual situation and numbers, "Blackmail" is too strong a word.
It's about what works best, and keeping it real. In any case, it's not like they have a lot of Halo subsidiaries to worry about.
EDIT: Now that I think about it...
Seamus Blackley, Peter Moore and Ed Fries have all left the organization. J. Allard went to do Zune. Is it really bad for Bungie to re-evaluate their current situation ?
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I think the game is stunning from a technical point of view and I love Halo 3. It's a masterpiece, in my opinion.
This is not coming from a GeoW rabid fan but one thing is certain, though, having played Halo 3 it makes me appreciate more the amazing job Cliff Bleszinski did with Gears.
Epic managed to create an original game, gameplay and graphics wise (I'd rather prefer colorful environments like Halo but setting Vibrant graphics on the game looked "fine") and it is a very entertaining game.
Naturally, the game owes a lot to Halo as Mark Rein already pointed out.
Halo 3 and Gears of War are the showcases of the console's abilities. note: what's more, there is a new X360 Premium pack -HDMI output- consisting of the console plus Halo 3 and Gears of Wars and two X360 controllers for 380€. At the price it is a steal.
Back on subject, Halo 3 is the culmination of all things Halo, there are novelties (and a lot of them) while keeping the spirit of the franchise alive.
Perhaps Halo does need something new but this is the end of a trilogy and I'm pretty happy with the result.
I'm sure Bungie are making a lot of changes in the game, people are tired of the brutes and the flood I guess. In fact, I am.
After Halo 3 the good ol' Master Chief has reached worlwide icon status on videogames, imo, just like Mario and similar characters.
One of the elements I miss from Halo 2 that hurt the depth of the *bestiary* somewhat is the lack of different armours, like the Elites in Halo 2. Other than that, Halo 3 is a tribute to Halo 1 and 2 and enhances the experience.
I also LOVED the ending, it's not predictable, it's sober but charming and thank god it's not tear jerker.
[modhat]Can we kindly drop the GeOW and other title comparison chatter, before I either have to carefully prune out all the off topic stuff, or just wholesale hack long posts out. Whichever is the better title in your opinion has no baring on the whys and wherefores of Bungie possibly going indie. Thanks[/moddhat]
Maybe MS, with the success of Bioshock and GeOW, realized that they can get better bang for the buck with exclusive publishing deals, rather than buy a studio and have to haggle compensation issues with talented but demanding developers.
Isn't the deal for the Japanese games also publishing deals, not taking equity in the game or the studio?
Conceivably, these franchises in the future could appear on other platforms because MS signed exclusivitiy for certain titles but does not own them like they do Halo.
Oh and yeah I seem to recall that at least some Bungie people could have retired when MS bought the studio. Obviously they structured the deal so they'd stay on. Didn't some Rare people bail too at the time of the buyout?
Bungie had a cult followign but nowhere near the big hit Halo has become. They're unlikely to replicate that success again.
Isn't the deal for the Japanese games also publishing deals, not taking equity in the game or the studio?
Conceivably, these franchises in the future could appear on other platforms because MS signed exclusivitiy for certain titles but does not own them like they do Halo.
Oh and yeah I seem to recall that at least some Bungie people could have retired when MS bought the studio. Obviously they structured the deal so they'd stay on. Didn't some Rare people bail too at the time of the buyout?
Bungie had a cult followign but nowhere near the big hit Halo has become. They're unlikely to replicate that success again.
Microsoft is a publicly held company and the Bungie asset is absolutely a financially significant contributor to current value and future earnings. All of which is to say that Microsoft cannot just "let Bungie go" like it was a three date relationship that didn't work out to everyone's satisfaction.
Is there someone who would buy Bungie at market value that MS would be willing to sell to? Do the Bungie guys have enough money of their own to buy the company back with possibly an agreement to provide "x" more installments of Halo as part of the deal?
I dunno, neither of those feel all that likely to me.
Now, some kind of quasi-independance where MS still owns most/all of the company and yet Bungie gets to breathe a bit freer? I suppose I could see that happening.
Is there someone who would buy Bungie at market value that MS would be willing to sell to? Do the Bungie guys have enough money of their own to buy the company back with possibly an agreement to provide "x" more installments of Halo as part of the deal?
I dunno, neither of those feel all that likely to me.
Now, some kind of quasi-independance where MS still owns most/all of the company and yet Bungie gets to breathe a bit freer? I suppose I could see that happening.
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