RSX exists (as does PS3 Reference Tool)

[ROG27]

let me reiterate the latter part of my question...

Another thing...PS3 reference tools may not yet have been distributed externally ... could Sony internal dev teams be the guinea pigs until production of the SKDs kicks up and kinks worked out? Is this not a reasonable assumption?

Is this not the normal process for distributing SDKS....internal first...then external distribution?

If this is the case, the Guerilla dev might not have been dancing so much as giving an ambiguous (for his own good) but loaded hint.

 

[Joe DeFuria]

Rog...

Instead of continually grasping at more and more desparate straws, why don't we just wait....

 

[Alpha_Spartan]

I'll set my expectations low. The RSX is basically a GTX at 450 MHz.

There. The worst that could happen to me is that I'm right. If I'm not, I still win because the RSX will exceed my expectations.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Yes, I take this as a legitimate "hint" about the size / "rackmount" formfactor of the current kits:

I call shenanigans. The quote above is like saying a meat pie from Old Trafford is 'something like a fine steak dinner'.

Along with

Infact, comparing even the current crop of CEB-20x0 units against a rackmount is something only Stevie Wonder could do with a straight face.

Again, this says nothing about RSX itself....but it does tell me that the "PS3 Reference Tool" we have come to know from that power point presentation is just not out there in developers hands.

Do we know when Dean mentions CEB-20x0 he's talking about the thin rackmount or the prior SDK (I forget their names. Evaluation and Reference and something else). I read it as Shezad saying they have a large grey box and calling it a rackmount, and Dean saying that's crazy talk. If CEB-20x0 = the Reference box, then you're right.

Just found this

CEB-1020 :

CEB-2030 :

Unidentified Reference Kit :

And

Actually, the original CEB-1020 "Shreck" systems started shipping in very small numbers in the middle of Jan. 2005 and the last Shreck systems were phased out in march when the CEB-2030 "Cytology" kits started shipping in their place.....

The Cytology kits will be shipping to developers until December when the SPCH-CEB900 PS3 Refrence Tools start arriving....

from here
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/archive/index.php/t-564455.html

 

[j^aws]

My gut feeling is that the change of plans for the forth coming Feb event, has something to do with RSX availability. Could be positive or negative...

 

[Carl B]

Good find with those model numbers Shifty! Didn't realize that they were on the images themselves.

Also good find with the AVS forum post with the 'reference tool' model number, but that December estimate on ship-date doesn't help us much as it's from July and things still may have fallen behind schedule, depending on Blu-ray/RSX.

In fact, seeing as Blu-ray isn't finalized until AACS at the minimum, perhaps there's a bridge kit out right now? Cell, RSX, but lacking the BD drive? Hmmm.....

 

[BlueTsunami]

And
from here
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/archive/index.php/t-564455.html

So the Reference Kit hes commenting about (the SPCH-CEB900) has to be the unindentified kit that has the RSX....right?

 

[ROG27]

All investigators seemingly grasp at straws...sometimes there's a bull-ox attached to the other side. If you pull gently enough with enough persistence, sometimes they'll budge.

Not that we know if the SDKs changed since that slide show, but I do believe Devs have openly stated they have the 3.2 GHz version of Cell...if the slides are correct the only thing we can derive is that there's an RSX in there as well. Unless a later iteration of Cytology included the 3.2 Ghz CELL.

 

[ROG27]

My gut feeling is that the change of plans for the forth coming Feb event, has something to do with RSX availability. Could be positive or negative...

I don't believe there is a change of plans for that event...IGN corrected themselves about reporting the cancellation of that event months ago.

 

[DeanA]

Do we know when Dean mentions CEB-20x0 he's talking about the thin rackmount or the prior SDK (I forget their names. Evaluation and Reference and something else).

The 'x' in CEB-20x0 can be any number.. there have been a number of revisions, with different CELL types (DD2, DD3, DD3.1), different clock speeds (2.4Ghz and 3.2Ghz) and different graphics cards (TypeB, TypeC). CEB-20x0 series all look like that CEB-2030 picture you have.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

So the Reference Kit hes commenting about (the SPCH-CEB900) has to be the unindentified kit that has the RSX....right?

The Reference Kit is the slimline rackmount unit with final hardware, Cell+RSX. If it exists, RSX exists. I doubt Sony will waste time creating a slimline rackmount 2030, BUT Dean mentions a 20x0, which suggests multiple variations of the PS3 evaluation system without RSX. Maybe. Nothing's at all clear from what the devs say, which is always the way as it's more than their job's worth. I've no idea really what the state of RSX is, though I assume it's fine as the CES showed 'supposedly' a PS3 rendering a BluRay movie with RSX doing stuff. The only thing I'm certain of is there's nothing to be certain about!

 

[j^aws]

I don't believe there is a change of plans for that event...IGN corrected themselves about reporting the cancellation of that event months ago.

I remember seeing a correction for the cancellation. But I'm sure the original event plans were changed with a new 'surprise' for gamers...?

 

[Carl B]

The 'x' in CEB-20x0 can be any number.. there have been a number of revisions, with different CELL types (DD2, DD3, DD3.1), different clock speeds (2.4Ghz and 3.2Ghz) and different graphics cards (TypeB, TypeC). CEB-20x0 series all look like that CEB-2030 picture you have.

Wait a minute, DD3 Cell, DD3.1? What's goin' on here!

Also Dean can you confirm that my theory a bridge unit including RSX and Cell would likely ship before the final reference including RSX, Cell, and BD due to the AACS hold-up?

 

[ROG27]

The Reference Kit is the slimline rackmount unit with final hardware, Cell+RSX. If it exists, RSX exists. I doubt Sony will waste time creating a slimline rackmount 2030, BUT Dean mentions a 20x0, which suggests multiple variations of the PS3 evaluation system without RSX. Maybe. Nothing's at all clear from what the devs say, which is always the way as it's more than their job's worth. I've no idea really what the state of RSX is, though I assume it's fine as the CES showed 'supposedly' a PS3 rendering a BluRay movie with RSX doing stuff. The only thing I'm certain of is there's nothing to be certain about!

That last part is something I noticed and noted myself...I believe some iteration of RSX exists...whether its wholey complete featurewise or at the final clockspeed...I don't even care about.

I just want to know there is a working chip based on the foundational architecure of RSX.

 

[DeanA]

Wait a minute, DD3 Cell, DD3.1? What's goin' on here!

I don't know.. I just saw mention of that on the world wide intertron... honest! ;-)

http://www.google.com/search?source...rls=GGGL,GGGL:2005-09,GGGL:en&q="PS3"+"DD3.1"

due to the AACS hold-up?

Isn't AACS just a software implementation? If so, I can't see why would it cause a delay on hardware?

Dean

 

[ROG27]

I don't know.. I just saw mention of that on the world wide intertron... honest! ;-)

http://www.google.com/search?source...rls=GGGL,GGGL:2005-09,GGGL:en&q="PS3"+"DD3.1"


Isn't AACS just a software implementation? If so, I can't see why would it cause a delay on hardware?

Dean

I knew I heard somewhere there were versions of Cytology with the 3.2 ghz CELL.

 

[Carl B]

I don't know.. I just saw mention of that on the world wide intertron... honest! ;-)

http://www.google.com/search?source...rls=GGGL,GGGL:2005-09,GGGL:en&q="PS3"+"DD3.1"

That is some craziness, hopefully info on the revision differences makes it's way back here sooner rather than later.

Isn't AACS just a software implementation? If so, I can't see why would it cause a delay on hardware?

Dean

Well... still though, it seems to be causing a hardware release lag, not only in the standaloneplayer market, but Kutaragi has indicated PS3 has to wait on it also. I wouldn't imagine the reference tools exempt on this front, though maybe the fact that they're primarily for content other than movies might circumvent that whole situation.

 

[ROG27]

I remember seeing a correction for the cancellation. But I'm sure the original event plans were changed with a new 'surprise' for gamers...?

Well if it's a new surprise for gamers....I'd assume it's got to be good. In marketing terminology...surprise always implies 'added value'.

 

[ROG27]

That is some craziness, hopefully info on the revision differences makes it's way back here sooner rather than later.



Well... still though, it seems to be causing a hardware release lag, not only in the standaloneplayer market, but Kutaragi has indicated PS3 has to wait on it also. I wouldn't imagine the reference tools exempt on this front, though maybe the fact that they're primarily for content other than movies might circumvent that whole situation.

SDKs are only for game related content....Blu-ray is only the medium...if you can emmulate transfer rates and capacity (which I'm almost certain you can)...you don't even need the physical blu-ray drive to work on development of games.

 

[Carl B]

SDKs are only for game related content....Blu-ray is only the medium...if you can emmulate transfer rates and capacity (which I'm almost certain you can)...you don't even need the physical blu-ray drive to work on development of games.

No of course not, which is why I've been talking about a 'bridge' kit with RSX and Cell. But without the Blu-ray, you still can't call it the 'reference,' so it still won't be the final iteration of the SDK's.