Console Maker's OS
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The devkit angle debugger / dev tools limit makes sense to me. I'd been wondering if Sony might be making plans to bring Android apps to PS4, and I could see needing a good bit of space for the full Android environment, especially if they just bring over the Android variant Linux kernel to run on a VM.
Would that make sense? That would depend on whether Google is ever successful with a TV apps ecosystem, and whether or not Sony feels the need to respond to Microsoft's Windows-Apps-Everywhere initiative on XBox One, but it's something that I could see potentially becoming important.
If it's 2016 and you can get 50k apps for XBox One vs. 50 for PS4, that could really hurt Sony.
Would that make sense? That would depend on whether Google is ever successful with a TV apps ecosystem, and whether or not Sony feels the need to respond to Microsoft's Windows-Apps-Everywhere initiative on XBox One, but it's something that I could see potentially becoming important.
If it's 2016 and you can get 50k apps for XBox One vs. 50 for PS4, that could really hurt Sony.
It doesn't even do that right. Which explains a lot about the state of the ps4 software right now. Not that I really care, I love my new baby and I'm not a sharer. But still...
For TV apps
* Do you really need to run them during games?
* Wouldnt it make more sense to just run apps on your TV if you really need this functionality?
I see the potential of running an "Android VM", but Im not sure having apps running during games is something Id like. Definitely not if it means grabbing substantial amounts of RAM, but not even without that.
Should be possible to suspend/resume the Android VM.
* Do you really need to run them during games?
* Wouldnt it make more sense to just run apps on your TV if you really need this functionality?
I see the potential of running an "Android VM", but Im not sure having apps running during games is something Id like. Definitely not if it means grabbing substantial amounts of RAM, but not even without that.
Should be possible to suspend/resume the Android VM.
Only if console buyers want them. If the apps don't make any significant difference to the consumers' experience, it won't affect sales. The 'app on console' future is an unknown at this point, not least because the competition for app devices is extraordinarily high.
Also I don't see how people can go "OMG APPS!!!" on something that goes through the TV, in the same way they revolutionised mobile devices. There will always be a limit to what one can do on a TV versus a mobile phone - a lot of mobile apps work because they're on a mobile. The same does not necessarily translate to a console+TV.
Think of it this way.
Chromecast has apps. A lot of them and more will be added. What are the resources and capabilities of that thing? Does it need to have them running all at the same time? No. Is it successful? Yep.
Ps4 really just needs to do what Chromecast can do, maybe with a little more multitasking, and it's non-gaming capabilities will be sorted. Does it need 3.5GB of RAM to do that? We'll see.
Indeedy. A lot of the value in millions of apps comes from them being useful and wanted just when you need them, which is typically out and about. The activities one would be interested in while sat around the TV are very different. Social feeds is one possiblity, overlaid on the TV screen (the incredible plot-twist having to take a back seat to what Steven Fry thinks of pot roast), and there's the old post-TV/movie check on IMDB to see what else that guy was in. But a calculator, or calorie counter, or list-of-90-best-apps...? There's a fundamental mindset associated with the TV that doesn't want or need apps IMO. It's a full screen, focussed experience. It's playing a game and concentrating on it, or watching a movie and concentrating on it (save for the social media obsession that sees people check their phones every two minutes to see what they're friends are eating...), or sitting with friends/family and sharing an experience. Mobiles are extremely personal and immediate and adapt to the circumstances to provide support as needed, which is in part why the mini app exploded there and not on PC. Hence conventional apps aren't important. Services and features like Netflix are, and these are the apps (applications) that the console users will want.
Whatever apps they are reserving this memory for, it has to be more than just the current trend of clients for media providers.
I'm curious what kind of people would buy a console specifically because of Plex, or Youtube, or even Netflix, if they already have devices that can do these things.
Many among my friends and coworkers bought a chromecast dongle for like $30. There's no way they'll even look at media providers apps when buying a console. Chromecast have an open API, so nobody has to wait for the benevolent console maker to make a deal with the content provider, allowing them to make an app for their platform. Plex simply became available on it without fanfare... but for consoles it's "OMG Plex might be coming eventually! They allowed them to start development!". It's a good indicator that most people are aware that nimble app development doesn't, and will not happen on console OS.
I'm curious what kind of people would buy a console specifically because of Plex, or Youtube, or even Netflix, if they already have devices that can do these things.
Many among my friends and coworkers bought a chromecast dongle for like $30. There's no way they'll even look at media providers apps when buying a console. Chromecast have an open API, so nobody has to wait for the benevolent console maker to make a deal with the content provider, allowing them to make an app for their platform. Plex simply became available on it without fanfare... but for consoles it's "OMG Plex might be coming eventually! They allowed them to start development!". It's a good indicator that most people are aware that nimble app development doesn't, and will not happen on console OS.
Alternatively, why would I spend $30 on a chromecast dongle if the console I already own could do all of the same things?
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The Guardian newspaper has a wonderful pledge tracker for the UK coalition government, that details which promises were made when the coalition was created and follows what has actually been kept, in progress, not kept, etc.
I wonder whether it'd be worth creating a pledge tracker-lite for both of the console manufacturers. It can include 'instant on' and all that kind of stuff. In actuality, it's probably something that one of the gaming websites should have a go at. I'd give it a go myself if I had more time.
Would be fun to see whether all of the promises are actually kept. Could possibly include third-parties too, as I'm fairly sure there are a few shills out there.
Edit: http://www.theguardian.com/politics/interactive/2010/aug/12/coalition-pledge-tracker
I wonder whether it'd be worth creating a pledge tracker-lite for both of the console manufacturers. It can include 'instant on' and all that kind of stuff. In actuality, it's probably something that one of the gaming websites should have a go at. I'd give it a go myself if I had more time.
Would be fun to see whether all of the promises are actually kept. Could possibly include third-parties too, as I'm fairly sure there are a few shills out there.
Edit: http://www.theguardian.com/politics/interactive/2010/aug/12/coalition-pledge-tracker
Because you already own the apps on your i/Android device and won't have to rebuy them? Chromecast only streams content from your mobiles to TV. Plus there's not much of an argument for reserving 25% of RAM for apps to save every console owner $30 of Chromecast or similar purchase.
I agree it's a good thing to have and I'm glad they're adding them, as long as it's free. Nobody is deciding whether to buy a console or a chromecast, and I don't think these apps have a big impact on sales. Supposing the added apps are reducing the memory available for games, it's not a reasonable compromise (admittedly, we don't really know). Wouldn't we rather have more memory for games instead of these always-on apps?
The only thing I need is DLNA, but Sony is being really slow on this. 
Not a big problem, I still have my PS3 since there's no BC, and I might give up and get a chromecast if they don't add DLNA soon. If I needed Plex however, I would have already bought one because waiting a year just won't cut it.
Not a big problem, I still have my PS3 since there's no BC, and I might give up and get a chromecast if they don't add DLNA soon. If I needed Plex however, I would have already bought one because waiting a year just won't cut it.So ignoring all of the other apps that might come out and be useful, and ignoring any more affordable alternatives to Chromecast that may become available as apps, then yes, you might be right. But that's ignoring a lot.
I agree it's a good thing to have and I'm glad they're adding them, as long as it's free. Nobody is deciding whether to buy a console or a chromecast, and I don't think these apps have a big impact on sales. Supposing the added apps are reducing the memory available for games, it's not a reasonable compromise (admittedly, we don't really know). Wouldn't we rather have more memory for games instead of these always-on apps?
The only thing I need is DLNA, but Sony is being really slow on this.
I won't know until I see what apps are available, but I'm honestly totally fine with the games we have right now, so I don't really care if a chunk of memory is locked up for the OS + app ecosystem.
So assuming there is no other app you could possibly want on your tv (productivity, video/photo editing, sound editing, game companion apps, Google Earth or maps, sports, movie information, social media etc) other than a Chromecast replacement, and that you wouldn't rather use Plex or some other media sharing software, then buying a Chromecast dongle is probably the best choice.
Also, keeping them resident is nice so you can switch back and forth between those activities without having to reload all your shit. It's nice to be able to jump back and forth between watching a movie and a game seamlessly. I imagine it would be the same with an app. If I'm half way through doing something and a friend invites me to join a game, it would be nice to be able to jump into the game without having to worry about finishing up first.
Also, keeping them resident is nice so you can switch back and forth between those activities without having to reload all your shit. It's nice to be able to jump back and forth between watching a movie and a game seamlessly. I imagine it would be the same with an app. If I'm half way through doing something and a friend invites me to join a game, it would be nice to be able to jump into the game without having to worry about finishing up first.
Well if you're the sort of person who jumps from video editing to sound editing to a movie to social media so readily that you couldn't bare some tens of seconds of load time, and you feel these activities are well suited to a console controlled on a TV from your viewing distance instead of a touchscreen or KB+M, then yes, 2+ GBs of RAM in the console dedicated to supporting your ideal use scenario would be a good investment.
One question though - how many console buyers do you think are similarly minded to justify having every console owner sacrifice 25% RAM to being able to switch from video editing to photo editing to Google maps and back to game?
Or putting it another way, no-one's saying consoles shouldn't have apps. The question is the justification for 3 GBs of them. A 1GB mobile can do most of what you'd ask except productivity, for which I doubt the console is any good, and for which you could use full on programs anyhow. eg. Kinect Minority-Report-Styled music and video editor. Have it as a program, not an on-demand app. What apps are there that the console is going to want 3GBs for? What is the value proposition of a console fixed against a TV providing apps compared to the already ubiquitous mobile devices running apps?
Chromecast does runs the Plex client. The phone app is just a remote. Same for all the other services. It's also instant switch between your game console and your dongle.
Unless the consoles OS are changed to be much more open, there's no way they can compete with a $30 devices for streaming media purposes. The interface on consoles will not get the same prompt updates as the mobile OS interfaces do, because on consoles they have to go through a complicated approval process for each update. Also if I have 3 TVs I can control 3 different streams. Watch something in the living room, enter the bedroom, swipe my current netflix to the bedroom TV, continue watching. $30 per room, with an invisible dongle instead of a huge 399/499 console on each TV (one of them with a power brick the size of 100 dongles).
I imagine the 3GB number is there because they figure it's easy to reserve it now and give back later, where the reverse you're basically screwed. I also have no idea what people will and will not want to do with their tv. For a lot of people it's probably the biggest and best screen in their home. Will they want to do some basic photo touchups or make a powerpoint presentation on their tv? Maybe. If I had all the answers I'd probably be a millionaire. Adding support for bluetooth mice for apps would probably be a good idea. I know bluetooth keyboards already work.
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