The GT5 expectation thread (including preview titles)*

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I'm pretty much devieved by lately footage of the game, it's clearly beautiful as it should but it feels somewhat slow and loose/soft (I've an hard time translating the word "mou" from french).
 

Seems to me they`re still optimizing the engine, doesn`t seem to be as much screen tearing or rate drops compared to Prologue? Could be a number of factors of course, but im still hopeful they can get it nigh on 60fps with minimal refresh probs. My only gripe with Prologue to be honest. Everything else looks great, damage included.
 
My Gripe is 10 cars & a bit underwhelming damage ,Though I am still hopeful that PD have indeed improved upon their code further than the build they showed at GC.
 
Arwin's going to kill me.... but.... I... can't.... resist....... :oops:


I have to say that my interest in future Gran Turismo games has fallen below even of some of the competition. For one this is due, because I don't enjoy racing games as much as I used to (going to the 'real' track changed a lot).

On the other hand, it's just that it to me seems that the focus of Polyphony is to deliver an authentic experience with as many cars as possible, when for me, the only cars that would spark my interest are ironically the cars Polyphony seem to be lacking in their games. Verious Ferraris (getting better though), Lamborghinis and some of the other exotica such as the McLaren F1, perhaps a Veyron and so on. The second thing, which to me would even be more enticing then the cars, is a full damage model with some of the interesting exotica cars. Make the damage model realistic and brutal. Crash too hard, it's gameover.

This is obviously not possible when offering hundreds of cars, so my goal would be to stay at least consistent. Either ditch damage for all cars, or throw out most cars and implement full damage. Or over watered down visible damage on all cars (what ever licencing allows).

Right now, it just seems a caotic mess. Most cars won't have damage, some might even lack an interior, some tracks with less cars (rally probably), some with damage - then there are some of the idiotic class restrictions I hope we won't see return from GT4 (why wasn't the Caterham fireblade only allowed in Arcade mode??).

GT has always been about cars and being able to tune them. I'd be fine with 80 exotic cars, fully tunable with damage. Damage is the way forward IMO. Offering close to a thousand cars isn't (especially if you have 5 different versions of the same car).

The other aspects would be to have more tracks. Weather included would be brilliant. GT3's wet stage was awesome and it's sad to see it hasn't appeared again since. Having dynamic weather would also give endurance races a new edge to really spice up strategy (online or offline).

Right now, GT5 (even GT4 to an extend though given the time it came out on the PS2 logical) just seems like a huge unfinished package with nothing it really offers at its core that the competition isn't already doing.
 
As far as I know, Lambos and the Veyron are included, not sure about the Zonda but they were in GT4 so I guess they will be in 5 too.

As you know Ferrari have given PD a licence now so most Ferraris will be in GT5.
 
Then let me clarify (Arwin when you reply, please include this):

They might have Lamborghinis, Ferraris and so fort, but it's very likely that damage won't be included on those cars, most probably due to other manufacturers that don't allow it. Ironically, these manufacturers that are more concerned, are the ones that offer cars that offer significantly less appeal in such racing games.

In other words - I'd rather limit a game to manufacturers that allow damage rather than pack in all of them and have them limit the experience for all of them. Judging by games like Need for Speed, Forza etc having damage on their cars, it seems most exotica manufacturers don't see a problem or allow it to some extend.
 
Arwin's going to kill me.... but.... I... can't.... resist....... :oops:

I'm not going to kill you, just tell you that you're probably wrong on some accounts, and I personally would prefer to wait until TGS to know what GT5 is really going to be like. ;)

On the other hand, it's just that it to me seems that the focus of Polyphony is to deliver an authentic experience with as many cars as possible, when for me, the only cars that would spark my interest are ironically the cars Polyphony seem to be lacking in their games.

How shallow of you. :)

Various Ferraris (getting better though), Lamborghinis and some of the other exotica such as the McLaren F1, perhaps a Veyron and so on.

You'll very likely get almost all Ferraris, the Veyron is in, the McLaren F1 is in also. Even Lamborghini's are in. Just look at the PSP screenshots that are showing these, and remember that all 800+ cars in GT PSP will be in GT5. And that makes sense as even unlocking them in GT PSP should also unlock them in GT5.

Porsche won't be unfortunately, they just made a new exclusive deal with someone else.

The second thing, which to me would even be more enticing then the cars, is a full damage model with some of the interesting exotica cars. Make the damage model realistic and brutal. Crash too hard, it's gameover.

Well we have no idea yet what the extent of damage is going to be like. It won't be Burnout Paradise I reckon, but an option to have your car crash be fatal doesn't seem out of the question, either at launch or in an update. We'll see - here's one thing where I'd suggest waiting until TGS.

This is obviously not possible when offering hundreds of cars, so my goal would be to stay at least consistent. Either ditch damage for all cars, or throw out most cars and implement full damage. Or over watered down visible damage on all cars (what ever licencing allows).

That's why they initially made the choice to support damage on race cars only. My current understanding would be that we get 170 race cars which have damage modelling, and I think that's a good choice. But reports on this are currently confusing and contradictory, also on the cockpits (that comment on full damage and cockpit was really confusing - especially with the PSP version also having a cockpit view, though not with a completely modelled cockpit, but still. So again, let's wait for TGS.

Class restrictions will be gone mostly I reckon, in favor of the kind of thing we've seen in Prologue online races. You may find a combination of drive train restrictions together an upper limit of your car's performance index (similar also to Forza's system).

That said, I still think damage is highly overrated, if all you care about is competitive racing where winning is more due to skill than to chance. The penalty system and auto-ghosting of spinning users

The other aspects would be to have more tracks. Weather included would be brilliant. GT3's wet stage was awesome and it's sad to see it hasn't appeared again since.

You forgot about Tsukuba wet in GT4 already? ;)

Having dynamic weather would also give endurance races a new edge to really spice up strategy (online or offline).

Definitely. But for me much more important is that we get good tire wear, fuel consumption and pit stops, and most importantly as options in online races. That's something I'm looking forward to much more. It's fine if they add weather conditions, but it's not vital for me personally. If the fuel, tire wear and pit stops work great in combination with online, then I'll be a happy camper.

Right now, GT5 (even GT4 to an extend though given the time it came out on the PS2 logical) just seems like a huge unfinished package with nothing it really offers at its core that the competition isn't already doing.

That what competition isn't already doing, exactly? All competition combined?
 
But i think many would dissagree with you on what makes GT great. To me the cars that are most important to include are the every day cars, not the exotics. I want to be able to drive the car i own and ones i have hope to afford at some point, not just supercars that i have no hope to ever own. Of course this is all a matter of personal prefference and is why GT offers such a broad range of cars, there is something for everyone. The amount of cars is a significant reason for the current success of the franchise, without them it would take away a major part of what GT is and would loose a lot of its appeal.
 
Well of course the idea for Gran Turismo is to have a very wide appeal, but since it's been the best looking game for such a long time everybody wants it to be their ideal game. ;) Which is fine of course, but there will always be sacrifices. Forza 3 will for instance have a hard time looking as good as GT as long as GT doesn't support custom decals, and Forza does. GT may be able to do 16 cars on screen, but that number might decrease if we want damage or weather effects, and so on, and so forth.

But yes, for me too, the charm of being able to take a regular car and drive it on a track is definitely something that appeals to me, whether that's a friend's Subaru WRX STi, my own Prius, someone else's Seat Leon, etc. In fact, I want to kick my colleagues butt driving my Prius, showing them the power of a drivetrain that doesn't involve shifting. ;) (though handling wise, well, turns aren't as great in the thing as in its competitors ... ;) ). And of course be able to marvel at how well the GT simulates that real car, that I actually know inside out and have driven in. Lots of people I know love to be able to drive those existing cars.

That said, driving the Ferraris in GT5 Prologue in Professional mode with no traction control at Suzuka is one of the most exciting driving experiences I've ever had. It's driving at the edge of grip, and yet it feels (and for once, sounds) practically perfect.

 
ShadowRunner & Arwin:

I guess you're right and that certainly appeals to me too (although there's still no sign of my car in the game despite it being on the market since 2004! - but you can't deliver everyones hopes) - on the other hand though, note that the appeal of ordinary cars on the track are very much limited and get bored rather quickly.

Most everyday cars (I'd say over 50% of GTx's library) aren't suited for the track and feel overstrained on that wide track and far too slow, especially compared to the quicker cars. They are optimal as a 2nd purchase, to get you some credits for the quicker cars. Once you get into the sportscar league, you won't be spending much time playing the slower cars anymore - that's really the sad truth. Also, once you enter the more rewarding classes, you'll be spending more time racing the quicker machinery anyway.

Of course, tuning expands the appeal of ordinary cars significantly - but with most cars, there is a hard limit to how far you can tune them. At some point as you progress in the game, I reckon most racing is done using the more exotic car range.

From what I've heard, it seems that the manufacturers really limiting damage in sim-racers are not the exotica ones, but the ones that target the more "casual" mainstream market. BMWs, VWs, Mercedes, Audi etc.

Polyphony seem to have an extraordinary gift in crafting an excellent game in a perfectionist manner and that's why, I would love to see them do a racer with fewer cars (the more interesting ones) with all the features one could hope in their usual perfectionist manner. That includes a full damage model, dynamic weather and brutal physics.

I look at Forza and I think that they might have an advantage at some point. They might not have the name yet, but they are certainly carrying less baggage. If Polyphony launch a game without most ordinary cars and reduce their package to exotica, there would be an uproar. Thus they are also limited to the various licencing agreements. If only one of all the manufacturers refuse to have damage included, the whole thing falls apart. Forza on the other hand has less to deal with, so as a result, it's easier for them to (r)evolutionize the genre with a more complete damage model, features etc.

I may be jumping the gun a bit (and I am perhaps a bit more argumentative for the sake of sparking a discussion to have me survive my bored afternoon at work...), but 170 damagable cars and 630 normal cars.... seems like it's pointing in that direction. I'm not sure if I'd rather have them commit to only 170 cars with full damage and then include that into their entire game then have a wishwash.

Instead, the series has gone from hundreds of cars, to nearly thousands. Not that that's enough, they've included TV features, obtained licences to WRC, TOCA, Nascar... all seems great on first glance and probably great for them to expand the series even more. As the hardcore gamer though, I wish, they would focus on fewer things and make it exceptionally great. I don't want them to be the best in delivering the most conent (I stopped caring about the content/amount of cars after GT2), I want them to not only wow us with attention to detail in visuals, but attention to details in its driving model and damage (and not only a fifth of the cars).


PS: You're right, I did forget about Tsukuba wet, but that was kind of a watered down version of what we got in GT3. There weren't more than a few events that featured that track AFAIR and the night track in GT3 was just far more memorable and impressive, especially considering its time...
 
Your right in terms of the single player game, part of the natural progression is to upgrade to more powerful and exotic cars. This changes in online mode though, for me anyway. I find online races much more fun with the slower cars.
 
But i think many would dissagree with you on what makes GT great. To me the cars that are most important to include are the every day cars, not the exotics. I want to be able to drive the car i own and ones i have hope to afford at some point, not just supercars that i have no hope to ever own. Of course this is all a matter of personal prefference and is why GT offers such a broad range of cars, there is something for everyone. The amount of cars is a significant reason for the current success of the franchise, without them it would take away a major part of what GT is and would loose a lot of its appeal.

I feel the same.

I want to drive cars I can actually touch myself and push them to the limit because thats something that I can not do in real life with my car on a real track unless I want to risk my car or want to get arrested.

The exotic cars are rare, and feel mostly like a "dream" than reality because we can not have the chance to try them. In terms of feel and driving they are too different too than what we experience and want to experience more.

Car fans will discuss for hours about "normal" cars and their engines. These super exotic cars dont get such a usual mention. Because they are like the "freaks" of the show, super expensive to buy, different in handling than anything out there, unavailable in many cases for the masses and are technologically unreachable.

Its like us discussing what Guerilla achieved on the PS3 with Killzone 2 and ND with Uncharted 2 and less about what Crysis can do on a super expensive exotic PC to achieve 1080p, 120fps, MSAA with full effects.
 
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