Xbox One (Durango) Technical hardware investigation

[deathindustrial]

Xbox CVP Marc Whitten:

It seems that this will be the full X1 devkit experience, eventually.

http://beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1768333&postcount=5486

Since none of this actually exists at this point they can say whatever they want. Maybe it will be awesome or maybe it will be the same deal as cross game chat on the PS3 (i.e. vapourware).

The obvious question is if what they are saying is true, why have dedicated dev kits at all?

Cheers

 

[AzBat]

Since none of this actually exists at this point they can say whatever they want. Maybe it will be awesome or maybe it will be the same deal as cross game chat on the PS3 (i.e. vapourware).

The obvious question is if what they are saying is true, why have dedicated dev kits at all?

Cheers

There's a reason why they call it a dev KIT. It's more than one item. So it's more than just the system. There will be varying degrees of the kits with varying kinds of hardware & software tools. The kit itself will basically determine the complexity of your game & how you're able to debug & test it. Bigger/more expensive kit will allow more options for development. This isn't new. It's how it's already worked across 360 & PS3.

Tommy McClain

 

[(((interference)))]

I don't know yet if the new final kits have 12 GB or not.

We know the alpha kits definitely had 12 GB but I don't think we've had any confirmation that the beta kits had 8 or 12.

Doesn't seem sensible. Would they suggest that indie games are also limited to some of 2 CPU cores and 10% GPU? I don't see so much value in flipping between indie and AAA games, as opposed to apps and games.

When the System OS is in the foreground (and the Game OS is backgrounded) it has access to 4 CPU cores.
Virtualisation makes it trivial for the hypervisor to fold the six cores used by the Game OS (when it's in foreground) down to four without any issues.

2) Constrained: The game is loaded in memory and is still running, but it has limited access to the system resources. The game is not rendering full screen in this state; it either is rendering to a reduced area of the screen or is not visible at all. The user cannot interact with the game in this state. System resource limits in this state are four CPUs, 5 GB of memory, and 45 percent of GPU power if the game is rendering to a reduced area of the screen, or 10 percent of GPU power if the game is not visible.

http://kotaku.com/the-five-possible-states-of-xbox-one-games-are-strangel-509597078

 

[Rangers]

I don't know yet if the new final kits have 12 GB or not.

We know the alpha kits definitely had 12 GB but I don't think we've had any confirmation that the beta kits had 8 or 12.

Yeah, the alpha kits that were just a PC had DIMM slots and so it was easy to have 12GB.

If the final dev kits look just like a retail box inside and out and have 12GB, it would seem they found a way to architect 12GB easily so it might be a hint of final retail. If they have 8GB and are truly final then I guess that's that.

 

[eastmen]

All I know is the dev kit I'm told about from right around E3 has 12 gigs of ram and that Ms was asking the dev with the kit a bunch of questions about changes to the system. One of them was the gpu clock speed increase and one of them was ram increase.

 

[Themrphenix]

Microsoft have already made their choices off the developers feedback,and everything is pretty much sit in stone now!That what my source at Microsoft told me...and no I can't elaborate no more on that statement!The next month or two going to be fun!;-)

 

[eastmen]

I don't know about that. My friend hasn't heard anything else about it since he was asked. Work on the game continues as is with the current specs in mind. You could be right but I don't know

 

[smerfy]

Microsoft have already made their choices off the developers feedback,and everything is pretty much sit in stone now!That what my source at Microsoft told me...and no I can't elaborate no more on that statement!The next month or two going to be fun!;-)

Aw, you're not gonna CBOAT up a post and make it hardly readable?

hints are more than welcome too

my ex-coworkers have basically lost access now to the higher level areas...so no more fun conversations about NDA-breaking things that i couldn't talk about anyways xD

i thought they were full of it when they mentioned a GPU upclock. guess we'll have to wait and see with this now...

EDIT: Eastmen...wouldn't that put it at least past the Alpha kits? If they're still running 12GB past alpha that throws some red flags in my brain.

 

[Cjail]

Let me quote bkilian here:

I'll go out on a limb and suggest the beta and forward dev kits only have 8GB in them. The system reservation allows them to accomodate debug code by just modifying the game VM parameters to allow more of the 8GB to be used. This was not possible on the 360, thus the need for more memory in the devkits.

Given the recent statements form MS this is even more plausible.

After all why should MS have 12Gb devktis, that cost thousands of dollars, when every retail kit can be a devkit?
Also the white devkit, form what I can see, looks very much like the retail units in therms of shape and case (power button is different), while PS4 devkits are completely different.

 

[BeyondTed]

After all why should MS have 12Gb devktis, that cost thousands of dollars, when every retail kit can be a devkit?

Because it was possible over a year earlier to build a PC with 12GB, 7970, 8 Core Sandy Bridge-E. The plan (was most likely, 99.99% likely) there from day one (couple years ago) to use the retail (case, ps, SoC, heatsink, PCB, screws, everything) to make the later dev kits for quantity and cost. (Like 360.) Just took much longer.

Also the white devkit, form what I can see, looks very much like the retail units in therms of shape and case (power button is different), while PS4 devkits are completely different.

Don't know anything about history of PS dev kits. But Xbox One dev kits follow in the pattern of the 360 kits. 360 started with available tower (Power Mac) then the retail based kit. Same with Xbox One. They seem to be just doing what worked well (again).



But if the report of memory (on both sides of the board) on the final dev kits is true (kits that look like Wired photos (with the alpha LEDs inside the case where no consumer will ever see them) then they are not 8GB. You don't put $0.50 of alpha numeric LEDs inside of a case for a consumer version. Not went you make 100,000,000 making that 50 million dollars to light up the inside of a dark box.



But would love to see a real confirmation.



Finally "really interesting" for the next couple months hardly seems to suggest nothing changed...

...also looking at the power supply in the FCC filing (you know which one) and 100W seems pretty good right now.

 

[Rangers]

pretty good in what way?

 

[warb]

When the System OS is in the foreground (and the Game OS is backgrounded) it has access to 4 CPU cores.
Virtualisation makes it trivial for the hypervisor to fold the six cores used by the Game OS (when it's in foreground) down to four without any issues.



http://kotaku.com/the-five-possible-states-of-xbox-one-games-are-strangel-509597078

So resource for apps is also flexible, or would they be fixed and low power?

 

[Cali3350]

At PAX Australia yesterday Microsoft once again said 8GB of ram, and nothing else. I think we can put the 12GB rumor to rest personally. Seems silly they wouldnt have solidified specs by now and would mention it otherwise.

 

[Themrphenix]

At PAX Australia yesterday Microsoft once again said 8GB of ram, and nothing else. I think we can put the 12GB rumor to rest personally. Seems silly they wouldnt have solidified specs by now and would mention it otherwise.

Would it be a lie if Microsoft said 8gb,but that's for games and other memory resources for OS?

The post I posted last night was a copy and paste.......my source wrote that statement and wanted me to paste it like that so I couldn't screw anything up with translation.......so no I don't think he was trying to do a cboat job.

 

[AzBat]

If the scuttlebutt that Microsoft was upset that the self-publishing news was leaked ahead of Gamescom, then I could see them also holding off on the 12gb announcement until then too. The 12gb news would be more megaton than the self-publishing news. So it would make sense to keep those details super secret until Gamescom. Personally I hope it's true, but I only see it being about a 1-in-3 chance at this point.

Tommy McClain

 

[Kb-Smoker]

If the scuttlebutt that Microsoft was upset that the self-publishing news was leaked ahead of Gamescom, then I could see them also holding off on the 12gb announcement until then too. The 12gb news would be more megaton than the self-publishing news. So it would make sense to keep those details super secret until Gamescom. Personally I hope it's true, but I only see it being about a 1-in-3 chance at this point.

Tommy McClain

I thought the 12GB was just wishful thinking on here. I have not seen this reported anywhere else. It was just people saying the dev kit have 12GB so they could roll that into retail xbone.

 

[Cjail]

The upgrade to 12Gb is possible...but is also possible that it did/will not happen at all

 

[DrJay24]

I thought the 12GB was just wishful thinking on here. I have not seen this reported anywhere else. It was just people saying the dev kit have 12GB so they could roll that into retail xbone.

1. Alpha dev kits had 12GB (triple channel DDR, 6 or 12 are the possibilities).
2. ??
3. XB1 retail has 12GB

Of course Alpha kits also had AMD 7970s which led to all kinds of wishful thinking for the GPU too.

 

[Bagel seed]

The upgrade to 12Gb is possible...but is also possible that it did/will not happen at all

I say it's still possible. They may be waiting for more fan feedback like with the DRM situation and indie support before going ahead with the upgrade.

If they really wanted to be aggressive they could launch with 8gb and simply offer upgrades for early adopters to the 12gb unit a few months later.

 

[Scott_Arm]

I say it's still possible. They may be waiting for more fan feedback like with the DRM situation and indie support before going ahead with the upgrade.

If they really wanted to be aggressive they could launch with 8gb and simply offer upgrades for early adopters to the 12gb unit a few months later.

That's not even remotely financially viable. Would you have to pay for the upgrade? How much. Do people that don't upgrade get cut off at some point? If they give them the upgrade free, they're losing an absolute truckload of money, potentially hundreds of millions of dollars.