Sunset Overdrive: From Insomniac Games [XO]
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Silent_Buddha
Legend
Watched some gameplay from this on one of the YouTube channels I frequent, and I went from vaguely interested to fairly interested.
Here's hoping for a PC version as I will no longer buy an action game if it runs at less than 60 FPS. Shame they couldn't do 60 FPS on the XBO.
Regards,
SB
Here's hoping for a PC version as I will no longer buy an action game if it runs at less than 60 FPS. Shame they couldn't do 60 FPS on the XBO.
Regards,
SB
Don't be a wimp.
shredenvain
Regular
You are entitled to your opinion. Since when is Insomniac games ever been known for making 60 fps a priority on console exclusive titles? Sure if SSOD releases on Pc you will be able to run it at whatever your rig is capable of, but Im pretty sure if this game was a multiplat console title they would still be aiming for 30fps on both consoles. This game is not your typical action platformer or 3rd person shooter. It is Insomniacs first open world title and the screen is filled to the brim with NPCs, particle effects and giant boss like characters.
To me the most important things they must nail with this are controls and consistent frame rate.
Before 2009, 60 fps was pretty much a given.
Problem for Insomniac is that 60 fps didn't prove to be much of a game seller. But then again going 30 fps hasn't worked to help Insomniac sell more titles either.
I really love the game design this game went for, and what it is trying to be, but from all video footage I've seen, I get the feeling it falls a bit short of its ambitions.
I just feel like they didn't nail the whole fluid momentum thing 100% (very hard to do in fact)
The gameplay feels a bit stiff in some ways. I hope to be wrong, I need to play it myself, but so far, I'm skeptical.
I just feel like they didn't nail the whole fluid momentum thing 100% (very hard to do in fact)
The gameplay feels a bit stiff in some ways. I hope to be wrong, I need to play it myself, but so far, I'm skeptical.
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I missed it by I've watched some videos at IGN and I enjoy the graphics and art style a lot, and I hope they also create a Ratchet 3.
shredenvain
Regular
They have another team working on Rachet and Clank for the Ps4 right now.
shredenvain
Regular
As far as I know the Resistance series is 30fps, Right? I was under the impression that Ratchet & Clank as well as Resistance have been extremely successful for Sony as well as Insomniac. I know they didnt have much success with their last multiplat release, but everyone can hit a speed bump in life.
Have you actually get played it or not?
That's answered in the post.
I sometimes feel sorry for some devs. They want to put all their creative effort and express their inspirations. But unfortunately no matter how much creative and skillfull they are, how great their game may be, often their creation may not appeal to enough people to pay back their effort.
It must be disheartening and discouraging
It must be disheartening and discouraging
But milk claims that the "gameplay feels stiff". Can he tell that from videos?
This seems like a game where the controls would greatly benefit from a higher frame rate. But instead we will probably get the most motion blurred game of the generation impacting both motion resolution and controls.
Yes. He gave his opinion, his interpretation of what he saw in video. He then said he may be proven wrong when he gets to play it. What's wrong with that? We have opinions on all sorts of game videos, from 'looks dull' to 'looks great' to 'looks complicated' etc.
Yes, you can look at things from videos but you can't (to the best of my knowledge) FEEL things from videos. That why I was confused and asked.
"Feel" in this context means "get a gut sense, an expectation not founded on carefully obtained fact but on first impressions." eg. "The guy seems nice enough but I feel he's hiding something."
Refactored:
Refactored:
milk said:
This may be a bit late to mention, but at the time R&C came out for the PS2 I always felt that despite it being a native 60fps game, it never felt as snappy as J&D that came out more or less at the same time and was perhaps the most similar in style and gameplay. Someone that wants to play a snappy-oh-god-this-is-how-a-platformer-should-feel-like should play J&D (the first one). No idea of course how SO will play, given it's 30fps, but it's something that I felt all Insomniac platformer games suffered a bit. No idea why, maybe design choice... never really thought too much about it at the time and just loved the games for what they were - brilliant entertainment and a very solid platformer.
As far as SO goes; I really hope they have some success with this game. As I said before, if this were out for PS4 - I'd be right in line to get it on day one.
May I try to develop my thoughts more thoroughly.
I like games in which the player charcater has that highly physcial movement, snappy response yet with some influence of momentum, spring-like motion and bouncy-ball colisions. I have never developed a 3d platformer, but based on how few games achieve even a couple of these things perfectly, I see it can't be easy. Yet, I hope some day we get that perfect game. The opposite of that, is a stiff game, where motions are too linear and robotic. I woundn't say Sunset IS stiff, its pretty fluid compared to majority, but its not as much as I had hopped (again all based on videos, All that might change once I play, and I do want to give it a try, otherwise I wouldn't be even talking about it )
I can't tell how the controls feel themselves, but from video, I can see somewhat what the 'physics' of character movement are like, and it looks extremelly ratchet-like. Though I know many love those games, they feel to me what I called stiff. Not so much compared to less plataformy games like third person shooters or brawlers, but compared to something like jak and daxter (which I find to be some of the most fluid like platformers made so far) they don't have the same feel.
A lot of it is just presentation though, getting animation just right, and character body movent that reflects all different sorts of motions, or getting a slighly lazier camera on big falls or tall jumps, to make the player feel like his movements were larger then they were.
My biggest nitpicks are the wallrunning and the rails grinding here. It is always jarring to me and a bit rythim breaking when game character interupt their vertical movement when you wall run, and they lock into a canned wall-running curve. -god, somethings are hard to express verbally- A good exemple of wallrunning done RIGHT is overgrouth, though that game is not finished, I played the beta multiple times and it just feels correct. It's handling of charcter motion is not completely acurate, but it feel physically-correct to some extent. Something mister Disney would call "plausible-impossible"
The rail grinding is a hard one. I understand the mechanic is important to keep the constant movement idea Insomniac went for. I see they want to incentive players to use it often, and don't want it to be too hard to control so they can aim and shoot and think about where they want to hop to next while at it. I can't imagine what solution would be better, but to my view the solution they found is not there yet. The velocity is too constant to feel as exiting as it could do. It feels more like slow train ride than rollercoaster if you will. The way sharp 90 degree angle turns and direction reversal were handled also kill any feeling of real speed. I know introducing actual momentum and gravity based velocity into the griding could lead to players avoiding it, and it being too hard to be usefull, or players often coming to a halt very often making the game feel slow. Finding that sweet-spot for those things is trully hard, but regardless, to me, this game just didn't.
I know other players are not as sensitive to that stuff as me, and I'm glad that they can enjoy the game for what it is. But I'm afraid it won't be my cup of tea. I say all this not to bash on Isomniac, but to discuss game design in general and see if other people sare similar views or can even understand what I'm trying to convey here.
Bizarrely, I feel like the spyro games had found that sweet-spot. The range of movements was very limited, but for what that game did, it did well. Playing spyro feels like you are constantly within a certain flowing rythim that is very satisfying. I never got that same feeling out of R&C though.
I like games in which the player charcater has that highly physcial movement, snappy response yet with some influence of momentum, spring-like motion and bouncy-ball colisions. I have never developed a 3d platformer, but based on how few games achieve even a couple of these things perfectly, I see it can't be easy. Yet, I hope some day we get that perfect game. The opposite of that, is a stiff game, where motions are too linear and robotic. I woundn't say Sunset IS stiff, its pretty fluid compared to majority, but its not as much as I had hopped (again all based on videos, All that might change once I play, and I do want to give it a try, otherwise I wouldn't be even talking about it
)I can't tell how the controls feel themselves, but from video, I can see somewhat what the 'physics' of character movement are like, and it looks extremelly ratchet-like. Though I know many love those games, they feel to me what I called stiff. Not so much compared to less plataformy games like third person shooters or brawlers, but compared to something like jak and daxter (which I find to be some of the most fluid like platformers made so far) they don't have the same feel.
A lot of it is just presentation though, getting animation just right, and character body movent that reflects all different sorts of motions, or getting a slighly lazier camera on big falls or tall jumps, to make the player feel like his movements were larger then they were.
My biggest nitpicks are the wallrunning and the rails grinding here. It is always jarring to me and a bit rythim breaking when game character interupt their vertical movement when you wall run, and they lock into a canned wall-running curve. -god, somethings are hard to express verbally- A good exemple of wallrunning done RIGHT is overgrouth, though that game is not finished, I played the beta multiple times and it just feels correct. It's handling of charcter motion is not completely acurate, but it feel physically-correct to some extent. Something mister Disney would call "plausible-impossible"
The rail grinding is a hard one. I understand the mechanic is important to keep the constant movement idea Insomniac went for. I see they want to incentive players to use it often, and don't want it to be too hard to control so they can aim and shoot and think about where they want to hop to next while at it. I can't imagine what solution would be better, but to my view the solution they found is not there yet. The velocity is too constant to feel as exiting as it could do. It feels more like slow train ride than rollercoaster if you will. The way sharp 90 degree angle turns and direction reversal were handled also kill any feeling of real speed. I know introducing actual momentum and gravity based velocity into the griding could lead to players avoiding it, and it being too hard to be usefull, or players often coming to a halt very often making the game feel slow. Finding that sweet-spot for those things is trully hard, but regardless, to me, this game just didn't.
I know other players are not as sensitive to that stuff as me, and I'm glad that they can enjoy the game for what it is. But I'm afraid it won't be my cup of tea. I say all this not to bash on Isomniac, but to discuss game design in general and see if other people sare similar views or can even understand what I'm trying to convey here.
Bizarrely, I feel like the spyro games had found that sweet-spot. The range of movements was very limited, but for what that game did, it did well. Playing spyro feels like you are constantly within a certain flowing rythim that is very satisfying. I never got that same feeling out of R&C though.
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