Sony Playstation Meeting September 7 2016 [PS4 Slim, PS4 Pro, Rumors, Speculations, and News]

[sebbbi]

Was that ever in question? Checkerboard rendering is native rendering after all. Unless people somehow considered the last Rainbow Siege as not natively rendered, and I haven't seen anyone anywhere making that claim .

Some (misinformed) people considered Killzone Shadow Fall interlaced rendering equal to 960x1080. Checkerboarding is an improved version of interlacing. Interlace pattern only differs. Both techniques render 50% of pixels per frame, reproject last frame to fill the gaps and interpolate occluded pixels.

But nobody questions whether 1080p Blu-ray movies are native or not. But modern video compression codecs reproject up to 90% of previous frame pixels. It's a waste to store or calculate a pixel again if it hasn't notably changed since the last frame.

We will see similar techniques in games as well. Calculate variable amount of new data per frame and not use evenly spaced sampling grids. Place new samples where it counts the most.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

But nobody questions whether 1080p Blu-ray movies are native or not.

If you bought a BRD and it was soft and you found the data was stored at 900p, you'd probably be rightly pissed!

But modern video compression codecs reproject up to 90% of previous frame pixels. It's a waste to store or calculate a pixel again if it hasn't notably changed since the last frame.

The difference with video is you know how much change there is on a pixel and can choose to calculate/compress it or not. Reconstruction isn't skipping unchanged pixels but skipping pixels that could need to be calculated, certainly when the camera is moving. Reconstruction is instead trying to 'cheap out' on the rendering in the hopes that the interpolated value is sufficiently close to the value it should be to not be noticeably different. And in most cases it probably is (not noticeably different), and in most cases it's probably a very good idea.

 

[sebbbi]

The difference with video is you know how much change there is on a pixel and can choose to calculate/compress it or not. Reconstruction isn't skipping unchanged pixels but skipping pixels that could need to be calculated, certainly when the camera is moving. Reconstruction is instead trying to 'cheap out' on the rendering in the hopes that the interpolated value is sufficiently close to the value it should be to not be noticeably different. And in most cases it probably is, and in most cases it's probably a very good idea.

I was talking about more advanced methods (no fixed sampling grid).

First, you could simply render (refresh) every pixel that failed reprojection (never interpolate). This would be simple, but not efficient to implement if you are rasterizing your image with hardware ROPs (stencil buffer masking small areas is not fast and doesn't reduce vertex processing cost). Pure compute shader based renderers could do with high efficiency (point clouds, SDF, etc). This would solve the occlusion case.

Perfect error metric is impossible to calculate at runtime as you don't know the exact goal (frame is not yet rendered). You'd have to render a full frame to calculate perfect error. Obviously not worth it. But you could estimate the error by various means and/or boost error metric artificially to improve quality on areas where errors are most likely seen (high contrast, geometry edges, shadow edges, motion vector discontinuities, etc). I believe we will eventually get pretty close to the reuse factor of video codecs.

 

[orangpelupa]

Break into warping thread?

 

[mpg1]

Just realized how super sleek and nice looking the Glacier White PS4 Slim is. Best looking console of "this gen" imo.

 

[ProspectorPete]

It's even more amazing when you put it next to an Xbox One S, it's so small!

 

[BRiT]

It's even more amazing when you put it next to an Xbox One S, it's so small!

But the Ps4 Slim has so much junk in the trunk; it may be narrower but it's deeper.

 

[bunge]

But the Ps4 Slim has so much junk in the trunk; it may be narrower but it's deeper.

I'm not sure that's true:

"The dimensions of the PS4 are 275 x 53 x 305mm, compared to the 265 x 39 x 288mm of the PS4 Slim."

http://www.valuewalk.com/2016/11/ps4-pro-vs-ps4-slim-vs-ps4/

 

[BRiT]

I'm not sure that's true:

"The dimensions of the PS4 are 275 x 53 x 305mm, compared to the 265 x 39 x 288mm of the PS4 Slim."

http://www.valuewalk.com/2016/11/ps4-pro-vs-ps4-slim-vs-ps4/

ScorpioPete was comparing PS4 Slim to Xbox One S, not the PS4; 11 x 10 x 1.5 inches for PS4 Slim and 11.6 x 8.9 x2.5 inches for Xbox One S. Hence my saying PS4 Slim has more junk in the trunk (than the Xbox One S).

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/console-specs-compared-switch-ps4-pro-xbox-one-s-a/1100-6443665/

 

[wco81]

Only 1.1 inch deeper?

Volumes seem comparable.

 

[bunge]

ScorpioPete was comparing PS4 Slim to Xbox One S, not the PS4; 11 x 10 x 1.5 inches for PS4 Slim and 11.6 x 8.9 x2.5 inches for Xbox One S. Hence my saying PS4 Slim has more junk in the trunk (than the Xbox One S).

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/console-specs-compared-switch-ps4-pro-xbox-one-s-a/1100-6443665/

Good thing I'm OK with junk in the trunk....

 

[Rikimaru]

Only 1.1 inch deeper?

Volumes seem comparable.

PS4 Slim is more than 50% smaller by volume compared to XBO S.

 

[ProspectorPete]

Only 1.1 inch deeper?

Volumes seem comparable.

Err... PS4 Pro is much closer in volume to the Xbox One S, than the PS4 Slim is in volume to the Xbox One S. With the Slim being much smaller, obviously

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Beyond3D Console forum. Focussing on the important technical issues.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

But the Ps4 Slim has so much junk in the trunk; it may be narrower but it's deeper.

12.36% deeper, and that's in the z-axis so you don't tend to see it. y-axis delta is 40% less than XBOS in one of the two higher priority dimensions. Total volume is 63.93% of XBOS. PS4 Slim Glacial White is objectively far smaller than One S. It's also 15.44% whiter than XBOS, while the blacks are only 3.73% less black, meaning contrast in the styling is overall more than 10% greater in the PS4 Glacial White Slim.

PS4 White Glacial Slim has better numbers. Objective facts (other facts are available).

Beyond3D Console forum. Focussing on the important technical issues.

I've tried!

 

[ProspectorPete]

It's also 15.44% whiter than XBOS, while the blacks are only 3.73% less black

Could you write down your method of measurement? I think you used DCI-P3 and BT.2020 for each values. Black should be 3.11% less black (at max) if you measure using the same color space.