Pricing Discussions around AMD VEGA *over-flow*

Discussion in 'Architecture and Products' started by pharma, Aug 17, 2017.

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  1. pharma

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    The mindfactory link is different now .... never saw anything this crazy!
    Edit: Oops, @CarstenS posted above.
     
  2. Ethatron

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    Sure, but the whole system has super high latency, you don't fix the problem by adding your own decision latency on top. Hence, if I see problems after 2 weeks into packaging (which is say 3 month before shipment), I evaluate and based on the severity I look for a backup plan. When stuff get's released there are two companies involved, yes. You only have so many chips, and if you give 50% to the first and the other one executes perfectly, you still only have 50%+some of the chips on the market, and that might well be a severe shortage. I don't want to cement the numbers, just show that the timeline of events makes it totally plausible to have 2 packaging companies and a shortage too. Real life can be unpredictable. :)
     
  3. CarstenS

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    We will see. But of course you pick the facts or rumors you want to believe anyway.
     
  4. ToTTenTranz

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    I'm not choosing what to believe. I'm trying to find a scenario where both you and the tomshardware article are correct.

    Choosing what to believe would be to say I believe the article is wrong/lying, or you're wrong/lying.
     
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  5. digitalwanderer

    digitalwanderer Dangerously Mirthful
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    Yeah, when speculating it is considered rather rude to do that. Good on you Totz!
     
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  6. 3dilettante

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    The difference in height from the HBM and GPU in the no-fill Vega 56 package is 40um.
    The Vega FE/64 package with equal-height GPU and HBM is 100um thinner.

    That may point to a difference in substrate or interposer, but the diagrams in AMD's comparison seems to indicate the GPU is physically thinner. If the pixels in that slide are taken at face value, even the stack is potentially a bit shorter.
    I'm not sure which target system needs the extra .1mm, or possibly the full mounting surface offered, although I suppose a more tightly specified Mac may need the height and full contact area.

    If Samsung's HBM2 is going into the packages with filler, the height difference may also mean Samsung and Hynix stacks are different in height. HBM2 is supposedly .72mm in z-height.
    Thinning the die and/or stack could require filler for mechanical stability afterwards, or it could be there as the package is being thinned for stiffness and possibly to keep debris out of the gaps.
    That could contribute to a cost difference in packaging.

    Perhaps this is reminiscent of AMD's marketing for Polaris 11 having lower z-height, although it had a height reduction of .4mm versus Bonaire.
     
  7. CarstenS

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    Vega 56 available for 409 Euro at mindfactory.de.
     
  8. seahawk

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    and gone in minutes.
     
  9. CarstenS

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    It's back again. Maybe because of their jumpstart.
     
  10. Mize

    Mize 3dfx Fan
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    Haven't seen any here in the US using NowInStock site.
     
  11. ToTTenTranz

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    Overclockers UK is still accepting pre-orders for the Vega 56 at £370, but it says "launch only price".
     
  12. Kaotik

    Kaotik Drunk Member
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    Obviously they have to hold true to Gibbos claims. I wonder what they'll say when they get new shipments of the card-only SKUs, or do they just pocket the extra money they can get from them :roll:
     
  13. sir doris

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    Scan.co.UK (one of the other major UK retailers) also have stock of the single cards at £380 but also list the price as "offer", just as they did for the £450 Vega 64's
     
  14. ToTTenTranz

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    The "timed offers" obviously refer to the rebates that AMD is giving away to sell at SEP.

    The question here is if the cards without rebate sold at SEP actually mean the e-tailer has to sell at a loss (as per Gibbo's statements) or not.
    Also if AMD is the one forcing low margins on these cards or the distributors are simply taking a larger than usual piece of the pie before they get to re/e-tailers, given the current climate of general inflation.


    Regardless, there seems to be a significantly larger number of pack-less Vega 56 cards available at launch than there were with Vega 64 which sold out everywhere within the first hour.
     
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  15. Malo

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    Based on what? Everything that I'e seen so far today indicated they were sold out very quickly. Any posts made on other forums about a 56 being in stock was noted as out of stock 10-15 minutes later.
     
  16. CarstenS

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    I don't know about significance and every individual definition of it, but in our forums over at PCGH alone 4+ people reported in, that they got a card for the low price (399 or 409). I remember none edit: from our forums who successfully clawed away a V64 from the first batch. One guy though got one from the weekend's resupply it seems.

    edit to clarify what I meant.
     
    #377 CarstenS, Aug 28, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2017
  17. sir doris

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    As of right now there is stock of the standalone MSI and PowerColour V56's at Scan for £384 and £390 respectively.
     
  18. Malo

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    Well the people who bought a 64 won't really be buying a 56, unless they're buying them for mining (which so far seems doubtful). So you've got a lot less folks wanting to buy that the initial launch. You're not competing with the same amount of people.
     
  19. ToTTenTranz

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    The Vega 56 got a lot more praise in reviews than the higher end model. AMD also asked reviewers to prioritize Vega 56 because they were aware of its competitiveness. IMO there's little doubt the Vega 56 would have more demand.

    Also, there were (are?) still some stores with stock several hours after release. The Vega 64 disappeared within the first 30min.


    I'm one of the few who got a card from OCUK in the first batch of pack-less cards.
    Ironically, I've been away from home on vacation for the last 2 weeks and will be for yet another, so it's just standing there in my work office, unopened.
     
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