Pricing Discussions around AMD VEGA *over-flow*

[Deleted member 13524]

You make it sound like that's a god given fact.

Not at all. My previous post clearly said it was an hypothesis.
That post starts with the word "perhaps".

And even if that was true, it does not bode well that they are seemingly unable to send out the same speficiations for both locations. Heck, even I can do a CC on an e-mail.

Maybe they're too incompetent to "hit the CC button in an email", or maybe they adapted each package to each different factory in question to save costs and decrease time to market, with little to no practical consequence.


I find it a bit hilarious that apple dual sources an entire SoC from 2 different fabs with 2 different processes and people assume it was to meet high demand, but AMD dual sources the packaging and some people question if they can make a CC in an email.

 

[entity279]

Still 509€ for me..
I'm using Edge because I'm on my Surface in tablet mode, btw..

Are you not logged in to the site? Apparently it's a new thing - I've seen eshops display smaller prices to their loged in users

 

[Kaotik]

You make it sound like that's a god given fact. And even if that was true, it does not bode well that they are seemingly unable to send out the same speficiations for both locations. Heck, even I can do a CC on an e-mail.

A real fact is, they had time for inventory build up for weeks and months now with Vega FE as the high priced pipe cleaner and mining-deterrant.

Apparently the plan is that in retail Vega 56's are using the packaging plant which doesn't use filling, while Vega 64 uses filling

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Are you not logged in to the site? Apparently it's a new thing - I've seen eshops display smaller prices to their loged in users

Never logged in to that site. @CarstenS pointed out that the 509 appeared to him by following this promotions link, but I don't remember going through there:

https://www.mindfactory.de/Highlights/MindStar/main/true

 

[Kaotik]

Never logged in to that site. @CarstenS pointed out that the 509 appeared to him by following this promotions link, but I don't remember going through there:

https://www.mindfactory.de/Highlights/MindStar/main/true

Tested, it was 649e for me first, going through that site and it's now 509.

 

[CarstenS]

I find it a bit hilarious that apple dual sources an entire SoC from 2 different fabs with 2 different processes and people assume it was to meet high demand, but AMD dual sources the packaging and some people question if they can make a CC in an email.

Apparently and for some reason unknown, they either choose to have two different specifications for packaging with reports of different heights for the dies, which in turn leads to different requirement on cooler mounting, as Toms Hardware and others pointed out.

So either there's a good reason no one know about, the person responsible for sending out the specs indeed is incapable of using CC correctly or, as Kaotik pointed out and you liked, the option without filler material is used for the cheaper of the models sold in retail, Vega 56. Now, maybe I'm wrong again, but looking at it from a high level, it seems that using no filler would be cheaper compared to using filling. Which is what I was hinting at before - but you choose to go with the ridicule of email-CC, ignoring the glaringly obvious.

 

[Entropy]

They don't ship outside Germany.
Drats.
They did offer me to come fetch it though.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Apparently and for some reason unknown, they either choose to have two different specifications for packaging with reports of different heights for the dies, which in turn leads to different requirement on cooler mounting, as Toms Hardware and others pointed out.

So either there's a good reason no one know about, the person responsible for sending out the specs indeed is incapable of using CC correctly or, as Kaotik pointed out and you liked, the option without filler material is used for the cheaper of the models sold in retail, Vega 56. Now, maybe I'm wrong again, but looking at it from a high level, it seems that using no filler would be cheaper compared to using filling. Which is what I was hinting at before - but you choose to go with the ridicule of email-CC, ignoring the glaringly obvious.

They're using the cheaper and probably riskier packaging for Vega 56 because it uses cheaper memory from SK Hynix and a cheaper/salvaged GPU chip.

Other possible reason that you're proposing is they're too incompetent to hit the CC button in an e-mail..

 

[CarstenS]

They're using the cheaper and probably riskier packaging for Vega 56 because it uses cheaper memory from SK Hynix and a cheaper/salvaged GPU chip.

AMD told me a few days ago, they are only using Samsung as HBM2 supplier for RX Vega and Vega FE. The markings on the dies seem to support that as they match those from Samsungs PR photo.

Other possible reason that you're proposing is they're too incompetent to hit the CC button in an e-mail..

... which of course was the ridicule. And you jumped on it.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

AMD told me a few days ago, they are only using Samsung as HBM2 supplier for RX Vega and Vega FE. The markings on the dies seem to support that as they match those from Samsungs PR photo.

Of course they are. Vega 56 isn't in the market yet and as mentioned above the review units are probably engineering samples, so whatever you saw may not be production units.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-vega-package-problem,35281.html

As we were getting ready to publish this, we learned from a reliable source that Radeon RX Vega 56 likely only uses HBM2 from SK hynix.

... which of course was the ridicule. And you jumped on it.

Ever heard of Poe's law?

 

[homerdog]

I'm not too familiar with what's going on but what are people giving AMD a hard time about? They can't control what Newegg charges for their cards, all they can do is set the MSRP. Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price. GPUs in general are way overpriced right now, of course this brand new card in low supply is not immune.

 

[Pressure]

They do ship to Denmark

 

[Deleted member 13524]

I'm not too familiar with what's going on but what are people giving AMD a hard time about? They can't control what Newegg charges for their cards, all they can do is set the MSRP. Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price. GPUs in general are way overpriced right now, of course this brand new card in low supply is not immune.

IMO the only addressable concern is that OCUK's Gibbo and others accused AMD of setting retailer margins for that MSRP so low that selling the cards at those prices would result in a loss for retailers (margins < operating expenses).
If true, then the $100 vouchers AMD gave to some retailers to sell at SEP for the first batch only would indeed mean the SEP was a deception for reviewers to erroneously compare the cards to the GTX 1070/1080 competitors.

In the meantime, other sources have come out saying Gibbo's accusations aren't true, so no one without a NDA (official or honourable) really knows what's going on.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

They do ship to Denmark

So is it Germany only or not?

 

[CarstenS]

Of course they are. Vega 56 isn't in the market yet and as mentioned above the review units are probably engineering samples, so whatever you saw may not be production units.
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-vega-package-problem,35281.html

Neither me nor AMD did discriminate between Vega 56 and 64 in our Question and Answer on this matter.

Ever heard of Poe's law?

No, I had to wikipedia it. So you really did fall for it. LOL.

---
The mindstar special offer is gone, but you can still go via the listing of the radeon packs:
https://www.mindfactory.de/Highlights/AMD_Radeon_RX_Vega

 

[Anarchist4000]

Apparently and for some reason unknown, they either choose to have two different specifications for packaging with reports of different heights for the dies, which in turn leads to different requirement on cooler mounting, as Toms Hardware and others pointed out.

There should be different specifications based on memory capacity with 8-Hi being physically taller. With binning there could exist a mismatch with GPUs designed for 16GB in pro markets being sold to consumers with 8GB and height difference. Just need to see if the die height difference is equal to that of 4-Hi and 8-Hi.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Neither me nor AMD did discriminate between Vega 56 and 64 in our Question and Answer on this matter.

Meaning you're not sure of what the information you got refers to. If you didn't ask, they might have commented only on products that are on the market, and they could even not be cleared to give specific info on products that aren't on the shelves yet.

No, I had to wikipedia it. So you really did fall for it. LOL.

If no clear indication is given, it's impossible to tell apart an extreme view from a parody of said view. It's a very good law.
So yes, of course I fell for it.

 

[homerdog]

IMO the only addressable concern is that OCUK's Gibbo and others accused AMD of setting retailer margins for that MSRP so low that selling the cards at those prices would result in a loss for retailers (margins < operating expenses).
If true, then the $100 vouchers AMD gave to some retailers to sell at SEP for the first batch only would indeed mean the SEP was a deception for reviewers to erroneously compare the cards to the GTX 1070/1080 competitors.

In the meantime, other sources have come out saying Gibbo's accusations aren't true, so no one without a NDA (official or honourable) really knows what's going on.

OK thank you. That would be pretty slimy if true.

 

[Entropy]

They do ship to Denmark

Oh FFS! They required a VAT-something mumble from me. UST-id was the term. And for the life of me, I can't produce a valid one. I've NEVER been requested for something like that, ever, when shopping online.

 

[Kaotik]

Oh FFS! They required a VAT-something mumble from me. UST-id was the term. And for the life of me, I can't produce a valid one. I've NEVER been requested for something like that, ever, when shopping online.

They stopped shipping to Finland because our tax collector got too interested in if they're paying all the necessary fees