Predict: The Next Generation Console Tech

[N2O]

I want to be clear. Whomever has told me about this last couple weeks announcements(E3 Twitter) and that some devs were going to leak and so forth has been right on times and dates. BUT, and this is a big but, I have pointed out ENDLESSLY in the Neogaf thread that they are 1 to 2 steps removed from particular elements. They did say BC was in. But others here, who know more about specs and system ability and ALL that jazz, seem to think it may not be. One thing I will always question is information, even if the person has been proven right on one thing means he may have old data on that. Or crossed wires. Or something.

That should not negate others and what they have said on either side of the fence. I am just saying that mine...isn't the normal tech person. Thus what I usually post about.

Well,i already said everything are rumors until official announcement,right now just "I believe this","he believe this","this guy believe this",no one know which one is right yet

 

[XpiderMX]

If the kits have a 1-1.5 TF GPU in them, it's unlikely that the final product will be shipping with high end GPUs with 3TF+ as the 8800 series are.

This AMD China rumour contradicts everything we've heard from bgassassin,lherre and bkilian on here

Why good evidence do we have that he is to be trusted anyway?

Bkilian also said your BC claim was bogus, so maybe these sources you are pushing shouldn't be trusted

bgassassins only said 1+TFlop (the + is unknown), and Lherre has not said anything about flops.

 

[Rangers]

Actually, he did more than that, he called into question my belief that the box would have a GPU around 2TF.

This and bgassassin's original statement (which was only ever contradicted by the leaked devkit pics, so it makes sense to reinstate him now that speculation was incorrect) that Durango was 1+ TF means I'm more inclined to go with a HD7770.

The 7850 at 1.76 TF is too close to the PS4 1.8TF GPU, and so would give no reason for lherre and bgassassin sources to say Durango had more RAM, cores etc but weaker GPU.

And now aegies has said that the AMD China guy is inaccurate we can ignore that info as well.

I'm still waiting on someone to do a compilation of all the info leaked by sweetvar as he seemed legit.

I mostly agree but still hopeful for that 7850. It would seem so shortsighted to try to skimp literally a few dollars on a GPU that is going to affect your product in the most key way for years and years.

Anyways it's funny how fast this thread is moving lately. The new year brought rumors in earnest, I like it. And e3 imo is a hard cap on when we must get good info no later than.

 

[Bagel seed]

There's conflicting rumors here.

For both consoles 2.5TF will be achievable, more than 3 will be a surprise, near or above 4 will be fucking miracle [but... possible if they really want it].

No and no. Besides Tflops is not really that "important", I mean theoretical "peak" performance ...

I think this was posted before but what can we imply from it? 1.5-2TF should be a safe bet. Might seem low, but real world performance will be much better due to HSA, increased bandwidth and custom bits.

 

[bkilian]

Does 360's OS use 32 MB of RAM all the time? Or is that just the system overhead when in game and when in the main dash it uses more?

System reservation on the 360 is there all the time. The dashboard is not part of the reservation, it's actually a full-blown title, just like a game. The reservation contains things like OS services, background downloads, party and private chat, Dolby encoding, and the mini-dash that comes up when you hit the Xbox button.

 

[(((interference)))]

There's conflicting rumors here.



I think this was posted before but what can we imply from it? 1.5-2TF should be a safe bet. Might seem low, but real world performance will be much better due to HSA, increased bandwidth and custom bits.

Good work, I forgot that post by lherre.

Since we know that PS3 is 1.8 and bg, lherre etc have said Durango has a weaker GPU, I think 1-1.5 TF is what we're looking at.

 

[bkilian]

No his not quoting my BC talk,his quoting my Kinect talk
http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?p=1690385#post1690385
http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?p=1690386#post1690386
http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?p=1690469#post1690469

Karak guy also said BC is happening.

No, I'm referring to your BC talk. The idea that the team has tested over 300 games for BC on the new system is bogus. It was not a statement on whether BC is happening or not, simply that there is no way they have run 300 games through the new console, or even ten games.

 

[N2O]

No, I'm referring to your BC talk. The idea that the team has tested over 300 games for BC on the new system is bogus. It was not a statement on whether BC is happening or not, simply that there is no way they have run 300 games through the new console, or even ten games.

Yeah right,let us wait and see.
Btw it's 200

Good work, I forgot that post by lherre.

Since we know that PS3 is 1.8 and bg, lherre etc have said Durango has a weaker GPU I think 1-1.5 TF is what we're looking at.

You too,and i believe the new rumors for now-both are powerful,not one will have "weaker GPU" to 1-1.5 TF level.(not saying you must wrong,still,wait and see)
And wait, "we know that"?

Well,it's pretty long time to wait,if both announce at summer...

 

[(((interference)))]

System reservation on the 360 is there all the time. The dashboard is not part of the reservation, it's actually a full-blown title, just like a game. The reservation contains things like OS services, background downloads, party and private chat, Dolby encoding, and the mini-dash that comes up when you hit the Xbox button.

I thought as much, so there really is no reason to expect the 720 to reserve 3GB just for this background OS type stuff.

 

[bkilian]

Yeah right,let us wait and see.
Btw it's 200

Dude, I was _in_ the team that would have been responsible for providing some of the compatibility layers to make such a thing possible. Code to do that wasn't even on our horizon when I left. Added to the fact that running a single game through BC testing (from Xbox to 360 days) takes about 40 hours on average, we're talking 4 man years of work or more. In the 360, we accomplished this by hiring hundreds of outside contractors to plod through the games. There is no way in hell that the Xbox team would do that at this point in the development cycle, it's a security nightmare.

So, unless multiple teams got retasked immediately after I left, and MS disclosed a significant amount of info about an unannounced device to hundreds of low-payed individuals not known for their discretion, your info is bogus.

 

[ERP]

I thought as much, so there really is no reason to expect the 720 to reserve 3GB just for this background OS type stuff.

If they are only doing the same thing no.
But I think you'll see a shift in what is always available when running games and that will require "dramtically" more memory than the current systems.
Though 3GB still sounds like a lot to me it wouldn't stun me.

 

[N2O]

Dude, I was _in_ the team that would have been responsible for providing some of the compatibility layers to make such a thing possible. Code to do that wasn't even on our horizon when I left. Added to the fact that running a single game through BC testing (from Xbox to 360 days) takes about 40 hours on average, we're talking 4 man years of work or more. In the 360, we accomplished this by hiring hundreds of outside contractors to plod through the games. There is no way in hell that the Xbox team would do that at this point in the development cycle, it's a security nightmare.

So, unless multiple teams got retasked immediately after I left, and MS disclosed a significant amount of info about an unannounced device to hundreds of low-payed individuals not known for their discretion, your info is bogus.

You seems very seriously about this,but you know,it's not like one of us need to leave B3D forever if me or you is wrong,but i believe him,ok?ok.Time will tell the truth.

And maybe karak also seriously about this,you should talk to him.

 

[(((interference)))]

Dude, I was _in_ the team that would have been responsible for providing some of the compatibility layers to make such a thing possible.

So, unless multiple teams got retasked immediately after I left, and MS disclosed a significant amount of info about an unannounced device to hundreds of low-payed individuals not known for their discretion, your info is bogus.

Sorry bkilian, I'm afraid that N2O knows far more than you do about Durango, you're completely out of your depth.
Yes, I know you may have worked on it, but so what, that means nothing when you have the AMD China guy and a 'friend' at MS...

 

[karak]

You seems very seriously about this,but you know,it's not like one of us need to leave B3D forever if me or you is wrong,but i believe him,ok?ok.Time will tell the truth.

And maybe karak also seriously about this,you should talk to him.

Nah. The person I talk to is about 2-3 steps removed from anything BK is saying. If he was there, he is going to know more.

 

[N2O]

Sorry bkilian, I'm afraid that N2O knows much more than you do about Durango.
You may have worked on it, but so what, that means nothing when you have AMD China guy and a 'friend' at MS...

Do you really need to make a reply like this?i'm not saying "no you're wrong" or something,i just said wait and see.

Nah. The person I talk to is about 2-3 steps removed from anything BK is saying. If he was there, he is going to know more.

It's ok,no one how will it ends,maybe MS and Sony will show us something we never discussed about,who knows.

 

[(((interference)))]

If they are only doing the same thing no.
But I think you'll see a shift in what is always available when running games and that will require "dramtically" more memory than the current systems.
Though 3GB still sounds like a lot to me it wouldn't stun me.

Yes, but as Shifty said earlier, even if they're doing apps, web browser, Skype, DVR running in the background, is it really going to need 3GB all the time?
100x more than 360? Maybe 1 GB, even 2 GB, but 3?

 

[bkilian]

Nah. The person I talk to is about 2-3 steps removed from anything BK is saying. If he was there, he is going to know more.

And like I said before, my statement was not a statement about whether BC is going to be in or out, it was simply that the idea that they had already tested hundreds of games for BC is impossible. In any case, it would be pointless to even attempt it unless you had at least beta hardware with all the actual chips. An alpha kit would not cut it for determining whether a BC game could be played.

 

[Brad Grenz]

Yes, but as Shifty said earlier, even if they're doing apps, web browser, Skype, DVR running in the background, is it really going to need 3GB all the time?
100x more than 360? Maybe 1 GB, even 2 GB, but 3?

It doesn't have to need that much all the time, they reserve as much as the most they think it will ever need. And since you're using lots of cheap RAM, might as well ere on the side of caution.

 

[Proelite]

Good work, I forgot that post by lherre.

Since we know that PS3 is 1.8 and bg, lherre etc have said Durango has a weaker GPU, I think 1-1.5 TF is what we're looking at.

Lower flops doesn't mean it's weaker.

 

[ImaginaryInsider]

Aegies comment was in reference to people speculating that the leak was dev-kit specs...he merely said they weren't dev-kit specs aka these are some vague varation of what the actual console has. Proelite chimed in that dev-kit specs are a lot crazier, Aegies reiterated that point later on.