Sony PS6, Microsoft neXt Series - 10th gen console speculation [2020]

[Charlietus]

Looking at the Nvidia texture compression demo, acknowledging that it doesn't tell us it's usefulness in a actual game, it tells me that next gen consoles could actually launch with the same 16GB of ram as the current ones (+4gb of DDR5 for the OS?).

 

[Johnny Awesome]

My thoughts after finally catching up...

I think what is expensive is raw power, raw bandwidth, large amounts of memory, and big rasterization.

Therefore I agree with those who think that the way forward for 10th gen consoles is bespoke specialized, but not too specialized, hardware that delivers on screen IQ without too much of the above expensive items.

So ML based frame-gen, RT, DLSS-type upscaling, etc.... that can "mimic" what a high end GPU can do without actually doing the brute force work.

So on PC maybe you use brute force sometimes, but rely on the bespoke hardware for consoles to get by without the raw power.

That way you can have a $599 Xbox Prime (base model that is the new minimum standard), but devs can still target higher end PC GPUs as well, some of which could end up in a 3rd party higher end Xbox, which is essentially a fixed config PC that trades flexibility for price.

I wouldn't be shocked if a base Xbox Prime only has twice the raster, bandwidth, and TF of an XSX and only 24GB of RAM, but with lots of ML FG, RT, and Upscaling bespoke hardware to enhance that.

 

[vjPiedPiper]

Well here was my prediction form about a year ago

"I predict the PS6 will be 1 CPU die of 16 Zen7c cores, 2 x custom RDNA 6 GPU cores, all on a 256Mb X3D cache layer acting as a unified system cache, connected to 32Gb main GDDR.
2TB SSD."

I've probably changed my thoughts in the last 12 months a bit.

Primarily I think we will see a bit more of a divergence between MS and Sony next gen,
both in actual hardware supplied, and in overall platform strategy.

Sony - PS6, then in 2-3 years, a Deck style console, w PS5 compat, and some PS6 compat, then in another 2-3 years s PS6Pro.
PS6: 16 Zen7c Cores ( probably slightly customized as Sony likes to do ) with GPU similar to RX 11070 ( ie. 9070 equivalent but in 2 more generations ) 24Gb GDDR.


MS - A Deck style low end console, maybe something like the switch, that can be docked and played handheld?
Also the ability for 3rd parties to offer Xbox, consoles, in either deck or real console format.
But basically, always some variant of AMD APU's, maybe an actual PC, but moving away from a shared memory environment is a big change.

I suspect we might see a Xbox Deck/Switch console first, based of something like Strix Halo, or possible next Gen of Strix Halo, and providing XSS or similar level of performance.
But 8 Zen6 cores, 16 threads. 40 x first Gen UDNA cores + but with extra Neural Rendering grunt + all clocked a bit lower. Similar quad channel memory config to Strix Halo has now.
Not Cheap, but in many ways better than a PS5, especially if looking at 1080p output.
Then i think we get an official MS Xbox Prime, and at the same time at least 2 other MS endorsed 3rd Party XBox prime consoles.
1 higher spec, 1 lower spec than the MS Prime console.

The MS Prime console probably cones in pretty similar to the PS6, but again with maybe double the Neural rendering cores / tensor cores.
and we have the 3rd parties come in above and below that.

Lets see how i go in another year eh?

 

[Charlietus]

Well here was my prediction form about a year ago

"I predict the PS6 will be 1 CPU die of 16 Zen7c cores, 2 x custom RDNA 6 GPU cores, all on a 256Mb X3D cache layer acting as a unified system cache, connected to 32Gb main GDDR.
2TB SSD."

I've probably changed my thoughts in the last 12 months a bit.

Primarily I think we will see a bit more of a divergence between MS and Sony next gen,
both in actual hardware supplied, and in overall platform strategy.

Sony - PS6, then in 2-3 years, a Deck style console, w PS5 compat, and some PS6 compat, then in another 2-3 years s PS6Pro.
PS6: 16 Zen7c Cores ( probably slightly customized as Sony likes to do ) with GPU similar to RX 11070 ( ie. 9070 equivalent but in 2 more generations ) 24Gb GDDR.


MS - A Deck style low end console, maybe something like the switch, that can be docked and played handheld?
Also the ability for 3rd parties to offer Xbox, consoles, in either deck or real console format.
But basically, always some variant of AMD APU's, maybe an actual PC, but moving away from a shared memory environment is a big change.

I suspect we might see a Xbox Deck/Switch console first, based of something like Strix Halo, or possible next Gen of Strix Halo, and providing XSS or similar level of performance.
But 8 Zen6 cores, 16 threads. 40 x first Gen UDNA cores + but with extra Neural Rendering grunt + all clocked a bit lower. Similar quad channel memory config to Strix Halo has now.
Not Cheap, but in many ways better than a PS5, especially if looking at 1080p output.
Then i think we get an official MS Xbox Prime, and at the same time at least 2 other MS endorsed 3rd Party XBox prime consoles.
1 higher spec, 1 lower spec than the MS Prime console.

The MS Prime console probably cones in pretty similar to the PS6, but again with maybe double the Neural rendering cores / tensor cores.
and we have the 3rd parties come in above and below that.

Lets see how i go in another year eh?

Developers can barely max out 6 cores and a half, 15 usable cores would be a complete waste.

 

[Charlietus]

I find some of those predictions to be excessive for what next gen needs to be. Here is a rtx 4060 8gb running cyberpunk with path tracing at 1440p dlss performance (tnn model) at 30-40 fps.

This is a 160mm die (PS5 slim for reference is 260mm) with 288gb of bandwidth (PS5 has 448gb), sold at around 300$ (with Nvidia really high margins) with technology from 2023.
And it's offering a generational leap in graphics technology compared to current gen consoles. A PS5 would run this at 4 fps or something, the difference in ai and ray tracing efficiency is staggering.

You don't need 32GB of ram, 16 cores, 250mb of 3d vcache and a 500mm die to do what a PS6-xbox reference design need to do. Don't expect the 500$ offering to get any of the above, it's just not happening.

 

[Nesh]

I find some of those predictions to be excessive for what next gen needs to be. Here is a rtx 4060 8gb running cyberpunk with path tracing at 1440p dlss performance (tnn model) at 30-40 fps.

This is a 160mm die (PS5 slim for reference is 260mm) with 288gb of bandwidth (PS5 has 448gb), sold at around 300$ (with Nvidia really high margins) with technology from 2023.
And it's offering a generational leap in graphics technology compared to current gen consoles. A PS5 would run this at 4 fps or something, the difference in ai and ray tracing efficiency is staggering.

You don't need 32GB of ram, 16 cores, 250mb of 3d vcache and a 500mm die to do what a PS6-xbox reference design need to do. Don't expect the 500$ offering to get any of the above, it's just not happening.

What's the CPU and RAM requirements?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

And it's offering a generational leap in graphics technology compared to current gen consoles.

Not sure what you mean by a 'generational leap in tech'. They look very much of the same generation




Contrast that to Killzone PS3 vs PS4.

 

[Charlietus]

What's the CPU and RAM requirements?

The PC running this has a mid range Intel CPU from the 11000 series and 32gb of DDR5 ram (you don't need more than 16gb). It could probably run close to 60 fps if it wasn't GPU limited.

 

[Charlietus]

Not sure what you mean by a 'generational leap in tech'. They look very much of the same generation
View attachment 13130

View attachment 13131

Contrast that to Killzone PS3 vs PS4.

It's a generational leap in graphics technology, how much of an improvement it is for the eyes is more subjective.

But there are areas were it is a generational leap like those we used to get, as shown in this video someone shared here some time ago:

 

[QPlayer]

If MS goes the PC-console route, here's an interesting PC that follows the latest form-factor:

Incredibly overpriced, like everything in the current form-factor PC segment... Starting price is $1750. However, I think this formula could achieve this performance or even better for around $600 today if it were mass produced.

They should copy this model and mass produce it at an affordable price. I think this form is the new generation of PCs.