Predict: The Next Generation Console Tech

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Well we can already assume that durango will have EDRAM, Microsoft has benefited wildly from that this gen. Of course Sony went with something completely different for PS3 after PS2's run in with EDRAM, but in that case they were trying something completely new, this is still a relatively normal set up

So we can assume since MS benefited from eDRAM with the Xbox 2 they will use it in the Xbox 3. We can also assume that since Sony benefited from eDRAM in the PS2 and they did not use it in the PS3 MS will not use it in the Xbox 3. And as the Xbox 1 was the most traditional and did not use eDRAM and todays traditional PC GPUs do not use eDRAM, the Xbox 3 will not use eDRAM. But many traditional consoles like the GameCube, PS2, and Xbox 360 used eDRAM so the Xbox 3 will use eDRAM. But many traditional consoles like the PS1, Xbox, and PS3 did not use eDRAM so the Xbox 3 will not use eDRAM.

Ass/u/me. :LOL:
 
Given how satisfied 3rd parties were in working with 360 I'm sure they wouldn't mind or even wanted them to continue with the big unified pool plus edram setup. Makes it even easier on them for their engine development. Also, the all knowing Charlie confirmed it ;)
 
which is better? did he say for xbox only? I think skysony also mentioned eSRAM

From bgassassins:

I figure I've sat on this tidbit long enough. It seems Xbox 3's final GPU will have eSRAM instead of eDRAM. I made sure to confirm eSRAM wasn't a misspelling. I don't know the amount though.

I should also add he clarified at that time that the "1+ TFLOP" was an estimate from someone else.
http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1661595&postcount=13968

EDIT: From vgleaks:

The Alpha kit uses a discrete graphics card similar in capability and speed to the GPU that will be included in the final design. The card does not have the ESRAM that the final design GPU will.
 
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I don't think we need to bring back old rumors since looks like a lot of things changed(maybe even RAM type also changed)
 
Has there been a discussion about the actual advantage of edram in the 360, versus if they had used the same die budget for a 262mm2 GPU, and a larger bus width that this larger chip would have allowed?
I mean do I understand that the "paper" specs of the bigger chip would have been huge, but the lower specs they chose was better in real world?
 
What is the difference between esram and edram??

Add the "e" for embedded:

Difference Between SRAM and DRAM



SRAM vs DRAM
There are two types of Random Access Memory or RAM, each has its own advantages and disadvantages compared to the other. SRAM (Static RAM) and DRAM (Dynamic RAM) holds data but in a different ways. DRAM requires the data to be refreshed periodically in order to retain the data. SRAM does not need to be refreshed as the transistors inside would continue to hold the data as long as the power supply is not cut off. This behavior leads to a few advantages, not the least of which is the much faster speed that data can be written and read.
The additional circuitry and timing needed to introduce the refresh creates some complications that makes DRAM memory slower and less desirable than SRAM. One complication is the much higher power used by DRAM memory, this difference is very significant in battery powered devices. SRAM modules are also much simpler compared to DRAM, which makes it easier for most people to create an interface to access the memory. This makes it easier to work with for hobbyists and even for prototyping.
Structurally, SRAM needs a lot more transistors in order to store a certain amount of memory. A DRAM module only needs a transistor and a capacitor for every bit of data where SRAM needs 6 transistors. Because the number of transistors in a memory module determine its capacity, a DRAM module can have almost 6 times more capacity with a similar transistor count to an SRAM module. This ultimately boils down to price, which is what most buyers are really concerned with.

Because of its lower price, DRAM has become the mainstream in computer main memory despite being slower and more power hungry compared to SRAM. SRAM memory is still used in a lot of devices where speed is more crucial than capacity. The most prominent use of SRAM is in the cache memory of processors where speed is very essential, and the low power consumption translates to less heat that needs to be dissipated. Even hard drives, optical drives, and other devices that needs cache memory or buffers use SRAM modules.
Summary:
1. SRAM is static while DRAM is dynamic
2. SRAM is faster compared to DRAM
3. SRAM consumes less power than DRAM
4. SRAM uses more transistors per bit of memory compared to DRAM
5. SRAM is more expensive than DRAM
6. Cheaper DRAM is used in main memory while SRAM is commonly used in cache memory

http://www.differencebetween.net/technology/difference-between-sram-and-dram/
 
What is the difference between esram and edram??

Embedded SRAM instead of embedded DRAM. Wikipedia can tell you what you need to know about it, but in a nutshell SRAM is less area efficient, uses less power, and is faster. In this case faster is strictly on a per-bit basis, meaning that it refers to latency and not bandwidth.

It seems like a really weird choice for a GPU because the higher latency can usually be scheduled around and the increased capacity is very much wanted. And if it saves a lot more on off-chip bandwidth the overall power savings can easily end up higher for the eDRAM.

The mobile GPUs that tile - pretty much all of them except nVidia's - do use SRAM for it and not eDRAM. But the tile space is so small that it's probably not worth it to opt for eDRAM for a variety of other reasons. I doubt XBox 360 will use a small tile tiler, unless MS shocks us all and reveals that they're using some extremely decked out PowerVR Rogue configuration. That I very strongly doubt will happen.

I'm actually not sure why anyone would call it eSRAM to begin with, since it's extremely typical for ICs to have some amount of internal SRAM and there's nothing special about the manufacturing for it. I think people just use the term to contrast it with eDRAM, although it's technically accurate.
 
So it's been hinted that CI is basically SI, and now with this HD 8000 being a rebrand of HD 7000 it looks like we won't see any major advances until VI... and any supposed insider who ever used that fake ass 75% performance gains chart was completely outed.

7870 (or 8870) gpu still seems to be the best hope then.
 
I see, so the only disadvantage of SRAM is smaller capacity compared to DRAM. I'm guessing if xbox3 really is using a big APU then they probably have enough SRAM. Either way, it sounds like an upgrade to me. I guess it will help if they go with DDR3 memory.
 
I'm still looking, but I haven't found ANY information about what the term eSRAM means in this context. If it's a large memory pool, it can't be real SRAM, because it would need 6 transistors per bit, versus 1 for DRAM. It could be something like the 1T-SRAM in the gamecube, which is called eDRAM anyway because that's what it is. I think the reason these embedded memories are really fast is because each row is a bank (isn't this what the 360's edram was already doing?). I can't find any hint about why they would have called it eSRAM instead of eDRAM this time around, maybe it has a better granularity? or maybe the 360 wasn't hiding the refresh but the new one is?

I'm actually hoping it's just a hoax... must... stop... looking :LOL:
 
EDIT: Ok, from Aegis (Polygon.com guy) said venus GPU. Now AMD:

AMD Radeon HD 8000M ‘Solar System’ Codenames

The AMD Radeon HD 8000 Mobile ‘Solar System’ parts have already been covered along with their codenames. Currently we have a mix of Mars and Sun variants soon to be followed by the faster Neptune and Venus chips. Let’s take a brief look provided by 3DCenter:

Mars (Similar to Oland based on older GCN achitecture, 384 shader units, including 24 TMUs and 16 ROPs 128-bit DDR interface)
Sun (Mainstream chip on base with GCN2-Bonaire-base replacement in the Radeon HD 7700m Series)
Neptune (Mainstream chip on base with GCN2-Bonaire-base replacement in the Radeon HD 7800m Series)
Venus ( Performance chip on GCN2-base on Hainan-base replacement in the Radeon HD 7900m Series)

http://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-hd-8000-sea-islands-solar-system-codenames/



http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=45987903&postcount=332
 
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Why are we throwing out these people's quotes? Do we know if they have any credibility or are legit, or just randomly talking and acting like they know things?
 
I see, so the only disadvantage of SRAM is smaller capacity compared to DRAM. I'm guessing if xbox3 really is using a big APU then they probably have enough SRAM. Either way, it sounds like an upgrade to me. I guess it will help if they go with DDR3 memory.

SRAM is much lower density than eDRAM. Around 3-6x lower. I don't see the attraction for this application, except that it's easier/cheaper to manufacture.
 
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