News & Rumors: Xbox One (codename Durango)

[Tap In]

No the rumors are pretty clear on the matter, there are other methods but those are not the ones MSFT were considering at a given point in time (as shown by the rumors which are reliable).

...The fact that MSFT wanted to go with those policies at some point in 2012 is not FUD. That was their plan, for all we no they could very well stick be their plan. No FUD here.

I understand your perception of the situation... but the bolded is what I am referring too.

It is one thing to say MS "may have been considering based on rumors" but it has transcended rumor to now being called fact and is being used to try and scare people away, because it's a stupid idea.

so if you don't think that is FUD, I don't know what is.

If they do announce their ideas and offer no way to play offline I will admit I was wrong (and that they are stupid) but until then these are just rumors to discuss as possibilities .... not facts.

 

[liolio]

Yes, rumors are clear, but we can't be sure if rumors are real. Even we don't know if Edge (or him contacts) are assuming things based on XDK info (missunderstanding).

We can't be sure if MSFT policies are exactly as Edge said.

No that is not the logical way to look at it, you can't be sure because MSFT hasn't yet to let us know its final decision on the matter.
The "main" plan look pretty pristine clear to every body hence all the reactions on the web (most of them including mine being pretty adverse).
The whole thing is not set in stone as hardware decisions for instance, it can be changed. Lot of people seems to hope they will. Will they? ~2 more months to wait.

 

[Tap In]

No that is not the logical way to look at it, you can't be sure because MSFT hasn't yet let us know its final decision on the matter.
The "main" plan look pretty pristine clear to every body hence all the reactions on the web (most of them including mine being pretty adverse).
The whole thing is not set in stone as hardware decisions for instance, it can be changed. Lot of people seems to hope they will. Will they? ~2 more months to wait.

so now, you are saying that if it is revealed that there IS offline play, that the FUD being spread and subsequent outrage has caused MS to maybe rethink this plan?

that's a fantasy not based in fact.

I have heard that a few times now and conveniently is an attempt to make MS look like they were trying to take something away from consumers but the uprising made them back down.

 

[XpiderMX]

No that is not the logical way to look at it, you can't be sure because MSFT hasn't yet let us know its final decision on the matter.

The "main" plan look pretty pristine clear to every body hence all the reactions on the web (most of them including mine being pretty adverse).

The whole thing is not set in stone as hardware decisions for instance, it can be changed. Lot of people seems to hope they will. Will they? ~2 more months to wait.

You, me and nobody, aside MS people, knows the MS plans, you only know rumors, but you can't be sure if rumors are real.

The fact that MSFT wanted to go with those policies at some point in 2012 is not FUD. That was their plan, for all we no they could very well stick be their plan. No FUD here.

How can you know it?

 

[wco81]

I don't know about always on. If it doesn't draw much power, no biggie. But if they want it to stay on for it to pop notifications or chirp (say your TV is not switched on the input that your Xbox is connected to), then it would be kind of annoying.

What would be slick is if you can use a mobile app or a web browser to have it download something to your Xbox while you're at work. Then the Xbox would turn itself on, download and turn itself off or go to some low-power mode.

The rumored used games restrictions are a bigger concern.

 

[Cyan]

Let's hope they allow purchased games to be played offline. I'm going to feel horrible for all those Comcast customers in trouble areas where there's an outage every week and your router needs to get reset for no good reason. It'll suck to be in the middle of a game and then the connection goes offline and now a purchased game can't be played. Unless I'm able to interact with other players online in most areas of the game there's little reason why I would need an active connection to play singler player content. It is entirely frustrating.

I live in one of those places -we have had bad weather this last winter, we have had rain 78 out of the 90 days of winter- and I can tell you that if the console is "online only" I seriously doubt I'd buy it.

It makes no sense. It is very limiting and weary!

What if you want to bring the console to a friend's house? Setting up a darn online only device would be a nightmare, with passwords and NAT and the like.

Aside from that, Microsoft would become dependent, totally dependent.

It would be the first time in history where the failure of a console would depend on the ISP, the router, the XBL servers and so on.

 

[liolio]

You have no idea about the reason why MSFT would change its mind on what seems a well defined plan, could really well be unrelated to your considerations:
For example they could (/should looking at their plan) be negotiating with various ISP and TV services providers on the main territories they are targeting, they may have a number of deals they need to land so they think that their policies are applicable (/ the pro outweigh the con). They may not need to have deals every where though.
Ultimately negotiations may not turn out well and they don't reach their objectives and so go with an hypothetical plan B. Overall it would have nothing to do with some people showing concerns on the internet and your views on the topic. There are more important considerations in the gran scheme of things.

What you know is that you don't like what has been leaked, neither do I.

EDIT
Oops turned out that I was too slow to answer, I was answering your post Tap In

 

[liolio]

How can you know it?

Well from early leak docs as Yukon, always on/always connected seems part of the plan all along, leaks proved quiet accurate.

Anyway, I won't continue to answer here, not that interested on the topic and emotional charge seems to prevent people to have a sane pov on the matter.

 

[XpiderMX]

Well from early leak docs as Yukon, always on seems part of the plan, leaks proved quiet accurate.

"Always on" is on XDK too, but always on and "always connected" are not the same than "online only".

Just thing about it, the XDK doc (seen on vgleaks) is for devs, not to users. If "online only" was a real thing at 2012, why not to said that to devs?

Anyway, I won't continue to answer here, not that interested on the topic and emotional charge seems to prevent people to have a sane pov on the matter.

Ok, but I just said that you can't assume things as facts thanks to rumors.

 

[liolio]

But the SDK don't said "Online only", it said "always connected".

lol, I give up.

 

[bkilian]

"Always on" is non XDK too, but always on (and "always connected") is not the same than "online only".

"Always Connected", not "Connected most of the time", not "Connected only when a game starts". "Always Connected".

If I, as a dev, read that, I would assume that means I could write a game that offloads some of it's processing to the cloud, or connects you to a persistent online world, or saves only to the cloud, or plays all it's FMVs directly from the net. _Always_ connected.

 

[XpiderMX]

lol, I give up.

Maybe you know something about MS plans that I don't, but without real evidences, for me, rumors are rumors. XDK, As I said, talked about "always online" not "online only".

"Always Connected", not "Connected most of the time", not "Connected only when a game starts". "Always Connected".

If I, as a dev, read that, I would assume that means I could write a game that offloads some of it's processing to the cloud, or connects you to a persistent online world, or saves only to the cloud, or plays all it's FMVs directly from the net. _Always_ connected.

If I said you "it is always connected", yes, but the XDK doc, at least the page posted in vgleaks, clarify that it is because the user can, automatically, get updates for games and system.

With this ‘Always On, Always Connected’ design, users will quickly and easily enjoy their connected entertainment experiences, with no waiting for the console to restart or install updates.

 

[Cyan]

"Always Connected", not "Connected most of the time", not "Connected only when a game starts". "Always Connected".

If I, as a dev, read that, I would assume that means I could write a game that offloads some of it's processing to the cloud, or connects you to a persistent online world, or saves only to the cloud, or plays all it's FMVs directly from the net. _Always_ connected.

I hope it just means that the console always try to go and stay online, pretty much like the Wii connect 24 and so on.

 

[Tap In]

You have no idea about the reason why MSFT would change its mind on what seems a well defined plan, could really well be unrelated to your considerations:
For example they could (/should looking at their plan) be negotiating with various ISP and TV services providers on the main territories they are targeting, they may have a number of deals they need to land so they think that their policies are applicable (/ the pro outweigh the con). They may not need to have deals every where though.
Ultimately negotiations may not turn out well and they don't reach their objectives and so go with an hypothetical plan B. Overall it would have nothing to do with some people showing concerns on the internet and your views on the topic. There are more important considerations in the gran scheme of things.

What you know is that you don't like what has been leaked, neither do I.

EDIT
Oops turned out that I was too slow to answer, I was answering your post Tap In

you are correct. it would not affect me based on my 10 years experience with online and Live in my house but I can see how it would affect my step son when he goes to his dad's house without internet or on vacation and others worldwide who have even more substantive issues with online.

so if it is true that offline gameplay is impossible, yes I'd be surprised and disappointed unless the reason behind it and subsequent overall scheme was well worth the loss of some of those users. Would have to be a hell of a payoff though.

"Always Connected", not "Connected most of the time", not "Connected only when a game starts". "Always Connected".

If I, as a dev, read that, I would assume that means I could write a game that offloads some of it's processing to the cloud, or connects you to a persistent online world, or saves only to the cloud, or plays all it's FMVs directly from the net. _Always_ connected.

ruh roh

assume that means I could write a game that offloads some of it's processing to the cloud

is that something that might help balance a shortcoming in the physical specs?

 

[XpiderMX]

I hope it just means that the console always try to go and stay online, pretty much like the Wii connect 24 and so on.

Current Xbox dashboard, if not connected to internet, is really empty. Yes, you can play games, and can play network content, but it is designed for online content.

I hope next xbox is something like that, but without the needed of turn it off (and logging off).

 

[liolio]

Last word for a while, it seems like a lot of people are concerned about this in a "vs" fashion, like "this will give Sony a conpetitive advantage, etc."

Actually it is not the way I look at it, in this greedy world I could see Sony hoping for MSFT to jump on the gun, not because it would provide them with a competitive advantage but because it would be way easier for them to match their policies (on way or another / let the editors do whatever they want and de facto making both systems behave (mostly) the same).

 

[Tap In]

Last word for a while, it seems like a lot of people are concerned about this in a "vs" fashion, like "this will give Sony a conpetitive advantage, etc."

Actually it is not the way I look at it, in this greedy world I could see Sony hoping for MSFT to jump on the gun, not because it would provide them with a competitive advantage but because it would be way easier for them to match their policies (on way or another / let the editors do whatever they want and de facto making both systems behave (mostly) the same).

agreed if that's the way it goes, I'd assume Sony will follow suit eventually or as you said each is waiting for the other to be the bad guy.

 

[liolio]

you are correct. it would not affect me based on my 10 years experience with online and Live in my house but I can see how it would affect my step son when he goes to his dad's house without internet or on vacation and others worldwide who have even more substantive issues with online.

I do see how it would affect me to begin with

I stated quiet some pages ago now that I'm to move back in France, more precisely in a pretty old house with outer wall made out of stones and inner made out of bricks... I'm not sure about how wifi is going to behave under those circumstances... And I don't think that house will have a proper ethernet /wired network either, pretty much I would have no choice about where the console should be without making more investments. It is bothering.
Thing is the same applies for my laptop, or phone.

If I go back to Cyan post about the possible "infrastructure issues" depending on where you live, I also see the issue.
But here is the catch, if the network is down plenty of your other CE devices don't work either (/ are close to useless). What is the most troublesome part for a household when network is down? That you have no Internet? No Tv? OR that the console no longer works? I would think that the 2 first choices comes first.
As console functionality are evolving toward a model more intricate with the outside world (/network) one manufacturer may think well if the network is down, first we can't do anything about it and secondly the fact that the console doesn't work should be a lesser concern vs lack of internet, tv, etc.

But let be clear I don't like the whole thing, like I don't like the fact that I could not play diablo3 on the go (though PC is a bit more complex because you have both PC and laptop and I use the later).
But I bough Diablo3 (mixed feeling about it, I don't support the model but there is not that many good ARPG out there and it is my favorite genre), people bough Sim City, I actually wonder if the resistance to such a model is a bit overstated. What would be the average Joe acceptance of a model where the console is another "connected device" as the TV (with all the implications that that has)? I don't know but it could be a non issue for the bulk of the potential costumers.

EDIT
I lied my last post was not my last post...

 

[XpiderMX]

But let be clear I don't like the whole thing, like I don't like the fact that I could not play diablo3 on the go (though PC is a bit more complex because you have both PC and laptop and I use the later).

I doubt that there are people who like it, it is insane and risky, but I will wait until the official info before assuming it is real.

 

[AlphaWolf]

I have a cable ISP, the TV part is almost never down. The ISP part is probably down once a week.