Microsoft announces external HD-DVD drive for Xbox 360

[expletive]

I wonder if multi-disc games could both be loaded in each drive, removing the need for swapping?

 

[AlphaWolf]

x360 hd-dvd drive v. 2.1

Now you're getting somewhere.

 

[nmyeti]

edited... out of date as of November when HP joined the BR camp. Man this stuff changes fast!

Back to lurk mode, and I’ll try a google search on this first next time before opening my mouth.

 

[Carl B]

As I sit on my couch surfing on my media center/gaming pc hooked up to my 50 inch Samsung DLP display, I can say without a doubt that I prefer the HD-DVD standard over blue ray (no matter the superiority of BR as a storage format) simply because the HD-DVD standard will allow me to make a legal copy of a movie that I own and stream it to media centers or extenders all around my house. If I am upstairs in my bedroom watching on the plasma, I no longer have to leave the room to get a movie that happens to be sitting on the shelf downstairs. I can simply fire up my media center PC and stream the movie off my media server. With an Xbox 360 in the living room I could likely stream the same material to yet another TV all while the actual HD-DVD disk is hidden away on a shelf with little fear of scratching or loosing my new copy of LOTR HD.

Well, the BDA has already announced support for 'managed copy,' which is what you're talking about - so not too sure if that should be your defining issue at this point.

 

[nmyeti]

Well, the BDA has already announced support for 'managed copy,' which is what you're talking about - so not too sure if that should be your defining issue at this point.

You're right. A quick Google search reveals that this was announced on November 16th. Just goes to show how quickly this stuff changes and how quickly you can become out of date.

 

[Hardknock]

Well, the BDA has already announced support for 'managed copy,' which is what you're talking about - so not too sure if that should be your defining issue at this point.

Do they work fundamentally the same though? Doesn't HD-DVD use iHD (made by MS) and Blu-Ray use Java or some sort? Wouldn't the MS supported one be more compatible with Windows and Media Center Extenders?

I don't know, just asking if you have any insight.

 

[Carl B]

You're right. A quick Google search reveals that this was announced on November 16th. Just goes to show how quickly this stuff changes and how quickly you can become out of date.

LOL, no prob.

With your particular setup, managed copy support would have been a vital part of my buying decision also, and I thought your reasoning made a lot of sense. So hey - we all learn something new everyday.

 

[Carl B]

Do they work fundamentally the same though? Doesn't HD-DVD use iHD (made by MS) and Blu-Ray use Java or some sort? Wouldn't the MS supported one be more compatible with Windows and Media Center Extenders?

I don't know, just asking if you have any insight.

They'll both work fine - well, that's my estimation - but Microsoft will build in the functionality into Vista, whereas it seems Blu-ray will require a driver disc or some-such (should come with the drive/PC) to get it working. Which no doubt has been discussed at length here (or some other thread, can't keep track of which is which anymore).

But as long as the medium supports it - in this case Blu-ray - Vista/the PC should be able to deal with it no prob as long as the content adheres to the industry DRM standards, blah blah...

MS *did* take issue with the Java-based solution Blu-ray is using, but the fact is it's really not a big deal. Even Intel's gone neutral on the subject since the managed copy has been announced.

 

[Asher]

What's the point? Why not just buy a separate HD-DVD player? This doesn't make any sense to me.

I'm assuming it will be cheaper as an Xbox 360 addon.

I also only have 2 HDTV (component) inputs on my TV, I'd prefer not to get a switchbox...

HDTV DVR + Xbox 360 w/ HD-DVD sounds good to me.

 

[Hardknock]

I'm assuming it will be cheaper as an Xbox 360 addon.

I also only have 2 HDTV (component) inputs on my TV, I'd prefer not to get a switchbox...

HDTV DVR + Xbox 360 w/ HD-DVD sounds good to me.

You know what? that reminds me... It seems every single rumor about 360 has come true. From the Harddrive being seperate, to the specs, to the HD-DVD add-on... One thing is still left, I wonder if they'll add a Tivo type add-on (included with a bigger harddrive)? I'm not sure if that would gel with their whole 'media center extender' plans. But everything else that was rumored about has come to pass, so....

 

[Carl B]

You know what? that reminds me... It seems every single rumor about 360 has come true. From the Harddrive being seperate, to the specs, to the HD-DVD add-on... One thing is still left, I wonder if they'll add a Tivo type add-on (included with a bigger harddrive)? I'm not sure if that would gel with their whole 'media center extender' plans. But everything else that was rumored about has come to pass, so....

Well, in Microsoft's vision the Media Center PC *is* the DVR. And it doesn't matter that it's in a different room or anything; any TV with an extender attached (aka 360) will be able to take advantage of the DVR functionality.

PS - Forgot to mention in the blu-ray managed copy stuff above, but there is some concern as to whether the BD+ aspect of Blu-ray's anti-piracy protection scheme might cause some headaches on the managed copy front. No idea, because not much has really been said about the issue thus far.

 

[Nicked]

(included with a bigger harddrive)

Since they're charging $100 for 20gb(13gb usable (? wasn't really up-to-date whether you could get the other space back)), I shudder at how much a larger HDD and TiVo functionality would cost.

 

[AlphaWolf]

Since they're charging $100 for 20gb(13gb usable (? wasn't really up-to-date whether you could get the other space back)), I shudder at how much a larger HDD and TiVo functionality would cost.

That's like saying I shudder to think what ps3 is going to cost if they are charging $1000 for standalone blu-ray players. They could increase the size of the hdd for almost nothing, remember that they are charging $100 more for the premium package over the core, which includes a lot more than just the HDD.

 

[Nicked]

That's like saying I shudder to think what ps3 is going to cost if they are charging $1000 for standalone blu-ray players. They could increase the size of the hdd for almost nothing, remember that they are charging $100 more for the premium package over the core, which includes a lot more than just the HDD.

No its not. MS are charging $100 for WiFi (peanuts to manufacture) and $100 for 20gb (even custom enclosure and slim form, huge markup), they aren't going to be generous anytime soon. And it was a tongue-in-cheek comment anyway.

 

[AlphaWolf]

No its not. MS are charging $100 for WiFi (peanuts to manufacture) and $100 for 20gb (even custom enclosure and slim form, huge markup), they aren't going to be generous anytime soon. And it was a tongue-in-cheek comment anyway.

Sounded more like a cheapshot at microsoft than a tongue in cheek comment to me, perhaps you should work on your use of the emoticon.

 

[scooby_dooby]

My 360 already is acting as a DVR, i have media centre with a capture card. it actually works great, very handy and it comes with the built in guide info, and all the sheduling software all integratedfor free. the software is superior to all the 3rd party software i've used in the past, like BeyondTV.

 

[Carl B]

Scooby you never got to answering my XP games/software/drivers on Media Center question.

 

[scooby_dooby]

???

 

[Carl B]

Post #352 of this thread.

 

[Phil]

When did I say they were pricing their perihpherals aggresively? Did you miss my post where I speculated the price would be $200+ for the add-on because of MS's ridiculously high peripheral pricing? If you are going to try and 'label' my posts, at least read them ALL. Nowhere am I using rose-coloured glasses, I full y expect their peripherals to remain expensive, but I also fully expect them to battle Sony HARD for market position, and to take advantage of the price difference to really gain marketshare. This means sub $200 core as soon as possible.

They ARE cost reducing, they are cost reducing the CORE GAME MACHINE. it's smart because they can get this CORE GAME MACHINE into more homes, more quickly, due to the lower price.

Perhaps, maybe because you've been rambling and going on for the last several pages arguing - allow me to quote:

already failed? 6 million consoles sold by the time PS launched? 8-10 by the time it hits US shores? That is not a failure my friend, it's a huge advantage.

- and your general concious that this add-on is going to make any difference towards PS3 sales or Blu-Rays strong presence.

I find this all too amusing really. Before this announcement, we've had the very same people that are going on and on about how huge of an advantage this announcement is, arguing that Blu-Ray in PS3 will not make a huge impact on Blu-Rays success as a whole. And now that Microsoft decided to jump on the bandwagon with a more than likely expensive add-on, it suddenly will make a big difference?

But this isn't the crux of the entire issue. This is. Sony isn't just a computer company like MS, it is a media company; a film producer, a music giant etc. etc. etc. They will may far more profit in being on the licensing board for BR (every player remember is money to them, as it is for MS and HD DVD) yet they will make far more on every disk they themselves produce and ship. We all know how music industry pricing works and where the money ends up, the studios pockets, and guess who is the studio.

I'm not arguing that with greater risk != greater reward. Sony will make more money from BR tahn MS from HD-dvd, but they also take a much higher risk.

If, and this is an/the if Sony, have done some decent research and, can see that they can afford to put a loss on the raw hardware and, get returns through the games/other divisions, they can rule MS right out of this pricing game. They have the advantage of an inbuilt next-gen video format, pre-existing production of all prehipherals at a largely cut price relative to MS, and are intending to put a lot of the 'special' Premium features of the X360 into their vanilla PS3. By directly targetting the middle-ground between you're Premium and Core in the case of a price war (again pricing just below the cost of the media-add on) they can really hit MS where it hurts as, to both propective sets of customers (aside those who buy solely the plain X360, which looking at many shops - not just forums - doesn't appear to be many at all) from your high-end buyers to Joe who wants a cheap BR player and a few games, you now have a solution that satisfies both with losses recoupped on your monopoly of every media outlet and device that you support.

There are either two scenarios in the very end:

1.) Blu-Ray wins and HD-DVD looses
Then obviously, Sony will be making a lot of money on many fronts (Movie production, possibly Music productions if they go for an audio format on BD eventually) while also bringing down costs in their other devisions that are selling Blu-Ray devices (Sony Blu-Ray stand-alone players etc). We can see the stake and the potential there, so it would make a lot of sense to see Sony already pricing their PS3 very competitive and taking on larger initial losses in order to make sure BD succeeds and ultimately will bring them money on all fronts.

2.) HD-DVD wins abd Blu-Ray looses
Sony will have to keep using Blu-Ray in PS3 and take on the costs of producing the disks since they'll likely be the only ones with a product that they will have to keep supporting for the next 5 - 10 years. They may decide to try and make an audio format out of it (as they've done to an extend with Super-Audio-CD) to get something into the market. The sheer volume of games that will be produced for PS3 (which is obviously dependant on the success of the console) could also bring down costs eventually.

At the moment though, Blu-Ray still has the upper hand and most likely the content as well and we can see as outlined by Kryton where the advantages for Sony are if they make sure Blu-Ray succeeds. It makes sense that they will do everything that's neccessary to ensure exactly that. Given all the factors we know today, I don't see how this announcement for Xbox360 making any larger dent into the larger picture that is, that Blu-Ray has the advantage by technology, by the content support and hardware companies backing it. The cost advantages you are touting for HD-DVD are a smaller issue since it takes a little investment (as does every new transistion to a new medium) and costs of the discs and the potential sales and success will make it a non-issue after it's been out for 10 years.