Microsoft announces external HD-DVD drive for Xbox 360

[c0_re]

To bad Sony will undercut them by pricing the PS3 lower than the cheapest HD-DVD player.

Yea because Sony has a ton of money sitting around collecting interest to loose like Microsoft right, WRONG.

Thats right if it wasn't for the Playstation name Sony would be bankrupt right now. Sony cannot afford to undercut anyone or else they would be doing this in other sectors which they are not in fact it's quite the opposite.

On the flip side of that if Sony cuts enough employees(they've cut a bunch already) and drops a bunch of their worthless product lines AND delays the launch of the PS3(maybe until next XMAS) maybe they can afford to do some undercutting on the PS3 but I wouldn't get your hopes up the Japanese economy isn't going anywhere fast(not counting auto sector) with China,S.Korea and other low cost employment asian countries putting the smack down on em they are finding it quite difficult to compete just like we are in the states in the Auto industry.(GM will claim bankruptcy in the comming weeks)

 

[drpepper]

I wonder if consumers are ready to go buy a game console if all they want to do is watch HD movies though. I mean, yeah we in here understand that its cheaper to buy a PS3 instead of a $1k player to get basic BR playback but i wonder if consumers are ready to break out of that 'stand alone' mold and do the same. They may still have the perception as BR=1k, HD-DVD=$500...

It's an added bonus. Really, as long as it play Blu-Ray movies, the average consumer won't care if it had a cell processor, RSX graphics chip with 256 MB of XDR memory. All they will say is: hey look, a 500$ blu-ray player. And It plays games! Good chance they'll pick it up.

In fact they'd probably see the games playing capabilities as "an added value".

Not to mention its other non-gaming capabilities.

 

[Sis]

Well when that 'somethign else' can offer the installed base that vista/HD-DVD will have, then you may have a point. Until then youre tlaking about something thats not going to be integrated into the UI and will be something 'more' customers will have to download, install, launch, pay for, etc.

I don't believe this is true at all. I'm sure when Dell or HP release their Vista Media Centers with Blu-ray drives, the full functionality will be present.

It's a whole seperate matter whether a consumer can upgrade his PC by adding a Blu-ray drive, but I don't think that's the issue here.

.Sis

 

[Carl B]

Its not 'scorched earth' all these CE manufacturers are choosing to support a single format in their stand alone palyer arent they? Why cant MS choose the same? Not to mention the fact that with this HD-DVD subsidy 'coupon' it amounts to people paying 'extra' for BR, which is a disadvantage right off the bat.

The subsidy is ok in my book though. How about Firfox, is that not going to run on Vista either? That's more what I relate this theory of yours to. Or what about iPod? Why not toss compatability for that thing also. It's beause to my understanding, as long as a manufacturer can pass Windows validation, any piece of hardware will be supported, be that via an included driver disc or whatever.

 

[mckmas8808]

Yea because Sony has a ton of money sitting around collecting interest to loose like Microsoft right, WRONG.

Thats right if it wasn't for the Playstation name Sony would be bankrupt right now. Sony cannot afford to undercut anyone or else they would be doing this in other sectors which they are not in fact it's quite the opposite.

Yep your right the PS3 will be more expenisive that the $500 HD-DVD player. Too bad theirs no way Sony could count on something like 100 million units sold or anything.

 

[expletive]

I don't believe this is true at all. I'm sure when Dell or HP release their Vista Media Centers with Blu-ray drives, the full functionality will be present.

It's a whole seperate matter whether a consumer can upgrade his PC by adding a Blu-ray drive, but I don't think that's the issue here.

.Sis

So theres no advantage to MS supporting the HD-DVD format? As far as the HD-DVD consortium is concerned, they could ahve jsut as well sat on the sidelines for what they bring to the table? Is that what you all are arguing?

 

[scooby_dooby]

All they will say is: hey look, a 500$ blu-ray player. And It plays games! Good chance they'll pick it up.

no the only person in this situation is a parent, who wants a BR player, and has a child that wants the new PS3. Then they could justify the purchase a little more.

Most other people are gamers who will buy the PS3 as a gaming system primarily, or non-gamers who will just buy a standalone for less.

You won't see many non-gamers buying the PS3 for it's BR capabilities, and having games as an 'added bonus'. Especially when you consider PS3 will be completely sold out next x-mas, and by the following year standalones will be very cheap.

By the time PS3 is actually available to casuals who walk into best-buy(spring-summer 07), it will be sitting beside sub-$300 hd-dvd standalones.

 

[Carl B]

Let's not portray the Japanese economy as worse than it is c0_re.

Six year high's on the Nikkei and probably the hottest mature market to invest in right now period. Plus, growth that is outpacing the Euro-zone, so not too bad.

 

[mckmas8808]

Most other people are gamers who will buy the PS3 as a gaming system primarily, or non-gamers who will just buy a standalone for less.

Parents brought the PS2 for DVDs. And I think the PS3 will probably be the cheapest Blu-ray player in the world at release. If not....

 

[c0_re]

Yep your right the PS3 will be more expenisive that the $500 HD-DVD player. Too bad theirs no way Sony could count on something like 100 million units sold or anything.

How long do you think HDDVD players will really stay at 500.00$ not long I can garuntee you that, in fact I'd be willing to bet we'll see 300$ or less units within 6 mothes of launch.



So you really believe Sony is willing or even can for that matter afford to loose 200$-300$ per unit if they sell for 400$?

Anything more than 400$ is plain stupid people will not pay it period, I certainly won't and I can afford it.

 

[patsu]

Well when that 'somethign else' can offer the installed base that vista/HD-DVD will have, then you may have a point. Until then youre tlaking about something thats not going to be integrated into the UI and will be something 'more' customers will have to download, install, launch, pay for, etc.

Vista and HD-DVD install base is zero today. Both are not released yet... Who knows there may still be time for BRA to negotiate their way into Vista should they feel the need to. Also being a software solution, it means there'd always be patches/upgrades.

The other entry point is with the PC manufacturers like Dell, Sony and HP. They can pre-install additional bonuses on their PCs should they choose to.

I'm not trying to put you down, but think about it this way. Can Windows Media Player ever play Blu-Ray disk if I happen to get one as a gift ? Or do I have to launch a separate BR software player always ? What does that say about Windows' digital living room vision ?

Where Windows is concerned, MS is a platform player... not a vertical player like Apple.

 

[drpepper]

So theres no advantage to MS supporting the HD-DVD format? As far as the HD-DVD consortium is concerned, they could ahve jsut as well sat on the sidelines for what they bring to the table? Is that what you all are arguing?

Yes. They (MS) should have supported both. It would make sense for MS to support both, however that would only prolong the format wars IMO.

Some postulate that MS's support for HD-DVD in Vista was to steal the thunder from Blu-Ray which has a huge advantage for being bundled with the PS3.

Really MS could support any format they want, but really, supporting one over the other does not give Vista any more of an advantage, nor does it give Toshiba any tangible advantage.

 

[mckmas8808]

How long do you think HDDVD players will really stay at 500.00$ not long I can garuntee you that, in fact I'd be willing to bet we'll see 300$ or less units within 6 mothes of launch.



So you really believe Sony is willing or even can for that matter afford to loose 200$-300$ per unit if they sell for 400$?

Anything more than 400$ is plain stupid people will not pay it period, I certainly won't and I can afford it.

How many units do you think the (supposed) $300 HD-DVD players will sell? Now compare that to what the PS3 will do.

 

[expletive]

It's an added bonus. Really, as long as it play Blu-Ray movies, the average consumer won't care if it had a cell processor, RSX graphics chip with 256 MB of XDR memory. All they will say is: hey look, a 500$ blu-ray player. And It plays games! Good chance they'll pick it up.

In fact they'd probably see the games playing capabilities as "an added value".

Not to mention its other non-gaming capabilities.

Ya i mean we all understand that but is the regular 'ol consumer going to make that connection? I wonder if theyre still stuck in the stand alone mode.

 

[Dave Baumann]

I think what you'll probably find is that the device drivers/interface for HD-DVD drive functionality, and possibly even movie playback, is built into Vista so that its just a case of slotting the drive in and it works; it could also be the case that some/all of the IP costs are also eaten by MS as part of Vista so that full HD-DVD functionality is bult in - i.e. plug in the drive and Vista takes care of the rest. If this were the case then using a Blu-Ray drive can still be achieved but probably extra software will be required for the associated codecs and possibly device drivers (should there be extra drivers above and beyond the SATA interface required) and the associated IP costs will need to be bundled as part of the hardware cost (to the upgrader) or soaked up by the OEM that is providing the drive.

 

[c0_re]

Parents brought the PS2 for DVDs. And I think the PS3 will probably be the cheapest Blu-ray player in the world at release. If not....

You act like everyone is going to want a Blue-Ray player from day one, most poeple woni't even know what the heck they are.

Comparing the PS3 to the PS2 as far as DVD capabuilities and selling points and why the PS2 sold so many in the begining is not an apples to apples comparison not even close, when the PS2 came out we were at the hight of the DVD adoption craze, you really think Jim Bob sitting in his trailer home drinking Blatz light needs a HDDVD player for his 19 inch RCA?

As much as I hate to say it high def DVD player adoption will be VERY VERY slow for the first year or maybe 2 or 3. People are happy with DVD's the way they are now and are not willing to pay more for somthing that to them buys them nothing. DVD were great becasue they were convienent and they didn't loose quality over time like VHS making them an OK entertainmetn investment.

 

[Sis]

So theres no advantage to MS supporting the HD-DVD format? As far as the HD-DVD consortium is concerned, they could ahve jsut as well sat on the sidelines for what they bring to the table? Is that what you all are arguing?

Yes, as far as the consumer is concerned. From an OEM perspective, it's a different story. But nothing insurmountable or even unusual.

.Sis

 

[drpepper]

Ya i mean we all understand that but is the regular 'ol consumer going to make that connection? I wonder if theyre still stuck in the stand alone mode.

Maybe they are still in the stand alone mode. As in, they will go to the DVD player section of BestBuy to get a player. But if they start asking the sales rep guy, is there a cheap Blu-Ray player out there?, and he says, well the PS3 is cheap and it plays Blu-Ray discs, then there's little to sway the consumers opinion.

As soon as the prospective comsumer hears that there's a cheap Blu-Ray player in the PS3, nothing else matters. For all he/she cares, the PS3 is a cheap Blu-Ray player that can output 1080p.

Lets not forget the word of mouth effect.

 

[c0_re]

How many units do you think the (supposed) $300 HD-DVD players will sell? Now compare that to what the PS3 will do.

Thanks you just made my point for me, normal peolpe don't care of about High Def DVD's. most people probably still hvae their DVD players hooked up with composite cables.

 

[patsu]

I think what you'll probably find is that the device drivers/interface for HD-DVD drive functionality, and possibly even movie playback, is built into Vista so that its just a case of slotting the drive in and it works; it could also be the case that some/all of the IP costs are also eaten by MS as part of Vista so that full HD-DVD functionality is bult in - i.e. plug in the drive and Vista takes care of the rest. If this were the case then using a Blu-Ray drive can still be achieved but probably extra software will be required for the associated codecs and possibly device drivers (should there be extra drivers above and beyond the SATA interface required) and the associated IP costs will need to be bundled as part of the hardware cost (to the upgrader) or soaked up by the OEM that is providing the drive.

We will have to wait and see. The point is: BluRay Association can negotiate for bundling their core drivers and software into Vista (Whatever deem to be the basic BR user experiences) should they choose to.

As for other features you mentioned so far, it's part and parcel of the Windows user experiences. There are well-known APIs and registry values to do:
Plug and Vista take care of the rest, playing any disk pushed into a PC.