mckmas8808
Legend
scooby_dooby said:
Get a clue buddy the Blu-ray prices that you've seen are not going to be the lowest prices that you will see on the market this year either. Again get a clue buddy.
Microsoft announces external HD-DVD drive for Xbox 360
- Thread starter BlueTsunami
- Start date
Get a clue buddy the Blu-ray prices that you've seen are not going to be the lowest prices that you will see on the market this year either. Again get a clue buddy.
expletive said:
Hm ? It's not a 1 or 0 digital thing you know. It's a "scale" thing.
expletive said:
MS is showing off their HD-DVD work. There are tons of things inside Windows that are outsourced (e.g., Terminal Service is OEM'ed from Citrix, USB stack is OEM'ed from somewhere else, ...). On the technical side, there is nothing stopping a third party from providing Blu-Ray support for Vista. It is just a driver. Period.
Now on market side (e.g., bundling), we have been there before. Remember Java VM bundling ? Remember offering choices like unbundling Windows Media Player to consumers on the Windows platform (Something MS claims on the Xbox 360 even
) ? And yes, you can continue to love Blu-Ray for offering choices to you too.
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scooby_dooby
Legend
xbdestroya said:
I believe he works for one of the movie companies, is in the HD-DVD camp, but certainly seems honest and has extensive inside information.
What I'm gathering is the OPU for BR is a completely new product, it costs in the hundreds of dollars. The OPU for HD-DVD is just an adapted DVD opu so it's much cheaper.
Maybe that's part of the reason we're seeing the $500 gap in pricing...
mckmas8808
Legend
Sis said:
Yep your right.
scooby_dooby
Legend
mckmas8808 said:
So you just switch arguments cause your last one was pathetic? PS3 will not be undercutting HD-DVD standalones this holiday season. What happened to that argument?
If you want to make the argumenent that BR standalones will ALSO be sub-PS3 pricing, then go ahead, but that's a new discussion. I consider it a possibility, but with a $1000 starting point and a 3month delay, I would not expect much less than $500 by holiday 06. HD-DVD should easily be at $300 or less by then if it is launching at only $500.
sis - it just bugs me cause his arguments are never fully thought out, he never looks at both sides and weighs probable outcomes. Just pick a side, and try and come up with as many arguments for 'your side' as you can, it's lame.
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patsu said:Hm ? It's not a 1 or 0 digital thing you know. It's a "scale" thing.
MS is showing off their HD-DVD work. There are tons of things inside Windows that are outsourced (e.g., Terminal Service is OEM'ed from Citrix, USB stack is OEM'ed from somewhere else, ...). On the technical side, there is nothing stopping a third party from providing Blu-Ray support for Vista. It is just a driver. Period.
Now on market side (e.g., bundling), we have been there before. Remember Java VM bundling ? Remember offering choices to consumers on the Windows platform (Something MS claims on the Xbox 360 even
Whether its a driver or not to play BR discs is irrelevant, MS can choose to support BR in Vista or not, period. Im not talking just play a movie, im talking ALL the functionality that Vista will offer as it relates to the HD optical format. By your argument, MS backing HD-DVD means nothing, and clearly it does.
scooby_dooby said:
I wouldn't use Amirm as a valid example, as he apparently has his hands in one side's cookie jar. Look at his posting history for examples of his bias. Sure, he may have information and sometimes will share it, but he may not share the best case information for both sides.
(Unless I'm thinking of someone else, but I'm pretty sure its Amirm -- maybe someone can correct me that has paid more attention to him).
scooby_dooby said:
Hmmm... well, whatever! If that's the case that's the case. I'm not sure why an optical pickup unit would cost so much more Blu-ray to HD-DVD, but at the same time I'm in no position to challenge it either. If true, that sounds like a cost that should drop rapidly with production ramp-up, but indeed could present a wall to the Blu-ray camp at least initially in terms of range of prices they're able to offer.
Any more information that can be gleaned on this is of course appreciated, but I'll take it at face value for now.
scooby_dooby
Legend
Well, at the very least we have to question this assumption that the BOM is similar for the two.
Amir has said the OPU's are within that pricerange, so unless you think he's flat out lying, that gives alot of weight to the opinion that BR drives are signifigantly more costly.
Amir has said the OPU's are within that pricerange, so unless you think he's flat out lying, that gives alot of weight to the opinion that BR drives are signifigantly more costly.
mckmas8808
Legend
scooby_dooby said:
Okay I will say it again. The PS3 will more than likely be priced lower than the standalone HD-DVD players. Did you even notice that the $500 HD-DVD quality is really really low? But you are right the HD-DVD player will go down by 40 something percent.
And if I use your numbers I think it's better for Blu-ray if they have $500 stand alone players and a $400 PS3 to push the format than a $300 stand alone HD-DVD player only.
expletive said:
That's right. MS backing HD-DVD on PC platform means they are working on it and make sure it does well using their own resources. This also means HD-DVD has an early start where integration is concerned. Technically, it also doesn't mean someone else cannot offer the same thing or better on Windows. Have you tried google's photo management software on Windows ?
Vista is an open platform to support different drivers. As a monopoly, they have to be careful about preferential treatment for their own stuff. You can read up more from business sites.
The main lock-in is built into the source material. i.e., if it's a HD-DVD disk, then you can only play it on HD-DVD players. That's why content is king in this regard.
I wonder if consumers are ready to go buy a game console if all they want to do is watch HD movies though. I mean, yeah we in here understand that its cheaper to buy a PS3 instead of a $1k player to get basic BR playback but i wonder if consumers are ready to break out of that 'stand alone' mold and do the same. They may still have the perception as BR=1k, HD-DVD=$500...
expletive said:
Yeah but Expletive I mean I would just be *shocked* if they actually went towards actively crippling Blu-ray on Vista. It's one thing to give HD-DVD a boost, but scorched earth policies are just not cool. It might hurt Blu-ray just as they would intend, but it would rub a lot of consumers and companies the wrong way.
What HD-DVD functionality are we anticipating anyway such that it could be cut from Blu-ray? Streaming? I mean what else is there?
patsu said:
Well when that 'somethign else' can offer the installed base that vista/HD-DVD will have, then you may have a point. Until then youre tlaking about something thats not going to be integrated into the UI and will be something 'more' customers will have to download, install, launch, pay for, etc.
xbdestroya said:
Its not 'scorched earth' all these CE manufacturers are choosing to support a single format in their stand alone palyer arent they? Why cant MS choose the same? Not to mention the fact that with this HD-DVD subsidy 'coupon' it amounts to people paying 'extra' for BR, which is a disadvantage right off the bat.
scooby_dooby said:
No I don't think he's flat out lying or anything, though I think I remember some posts of his in the past being overly HD-DVD cheerleader back in the day. But that doesn't matter to me. It's just if Deadmeat's numbers are 'closer than we might think,' does that mean that the Philips OPU-81 is indeed $450, or some lower number close to $450? Because if these numbers are out there somewhere, well that's good stuff to know.
