He won the Italian GP in 2008 in a Toro Rosso, which is hardly a competitive car, even if it was designed by Adrian Newey.
Formula 1 - 2013 Season
- Thread starter Dave Baumann
- Start date
He won the Italian GP in 2008 in a Toro Rosso, which is hardly a competitive car, even if it was designed by Adrian Newey.
Bourdais qualified 4th in the sister car. SEBASTIAN BOURDAIS. The team we're getting lots of help from the main Rbr team in there formative years they became a 'true constructor' as the Fia like to call it in 2010.
To imply the toro rosso was a bad car at that track is wrong. It had a good engine and good design.
People only harp on about it now because they either don't know what was happening back then or hope others don't.
I think there was even a rule created for 2010 which said all designs must be made by the team to stop Red bull running 4 decent cars. Check wikipedia For toro rosso Str3 and str5 and come back to me if you still think rbr had nothing to do with the cars design.
To summarise if you cannot be arsed to look. They we're red bull chassises with Ferrari engines.
To imply the toro rosso was a bad car at that track is wrong. It had a good engine and good design.
People only harp on about it now because they either don't know what was happening back then or hope others don't.
I think there was even a rule created for 2010 which said all designs must be made by the team to stop Red bull running 4 decent cars. Check wikipedia For toro rosso Str3 and str5 and come back to me if you still think rbr had nothing to do with the cars design.
To summarise if you cannot be arsed to look. They we're red bull chassises with Ferrari engines.
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Turkey back in 2013 - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/20614283
UniversalTruth
Veteran
A1-Ring in Austria would be nice, I would also like to see F1 at Laguna Seca in USA. F1 definately misses such type of circuits.
I vote for 15/20 races at Spa and the other 5 at Monaco. Why bother with lesser circuits?
I would vote for Monaco once every two years. In a 20 race calender I guess I can live with it once a year, but when the calender was 16 races it really frustrated me that we'd waste one of those at Monaco.
I get the history and the notion of it being "an ultimate drivers circuit" but as someone who is only ever likely to be able to watch this race on TV it frankly produces very uninteresting races to watch relative to other circuits. Montreal has some Monaco like qualities yet invariable produces some fantastic races.
I get the history and the notion of it being "an ultimate drivers circuit" but as someone who is only ever likely to be able to watch this race on TV it frankly produces very uninteresting races to watch relative to other circuits. Montreal has some Monaco like qualities yet invariable produces some fantastic races.
Nowadays it's sadly indeed gotten bit boring compared to past years, but one can live with the hope that it returns to it's glory of real drivers circuit - I can't remember was it Häkkinen or Schumacher or who once said that "on a perfect lap in Monaco, you still hit the wall on average 6 times per lap", which means when you're driving at the limits it's just millimeters between too hard hit to the wall and crash and perfect lap
UniversalTruth
Veteran
Monaco race is the iconic race in the calendar. Removing it would as stupid in favour of shitty tracks as that in Turkey as the removal of Imola or Magny-Cours.
Bahrein, India, China, etc tracks cannot be compared with those jewels.
http://en.espnf1.com/fia/motorsport/story/97027.html
Not 2013 but fits this thread better than 2012 - the plans to reduce aero downforce with 2014 regulations have been dropped.
edit:
oh, and I just couldn't resist posting this (yes, like it says under my name, I am drunk atm)
Not 2013 but fits this thread better than 2012 - the plans to reduce aero downforce with 2014 regulations have been dropped.
edit:
oh, and I just couldn't resist posting this (yes, like it says under my name, I am drunk atm)
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So, same old boring shite for 2014 too.
None of this bollocks reduces costs, if anything it increases it as the designers are working far harder to find downforce than they would if there were less restrictions.
No one has so much as broken a toe nail for years, so lets loosen some of the reins and let them innovate again.
None of this bollocks reduces costs, if anything it increases it as the designers are working far harder to find downforce than they would if there were less restrictions.
No one has so much as broken a toe nail for years, so lets loosen some of the reins and let them innovate again.
I think this will still be a big aero change for them anyway. Packaging of the engines is going to force some fairly major changes at the back end of the cars, and with smaller combustion elements and more turbo power the effects of the "coanda" exhaust may well be diminished.
What I'd really like to see is a season, even if not full, driven with late-80's - early-90's F1's, just upgraded to todays standards on safety (ie monocoque mainly) so no-one whines about them being too dangerous) on tracks of those days by todays drivers - make it the last season with actual gear-stick to make it perfect.
Make your own series and have fun
http://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=F1 1988 carrera.4
http://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=F1 1988 carrera.4
The hard part is getting all F1 drivers to participate (and to find actual simulator, rFactor isn't one (their philosophy with F1 is 'the less grip there is, the more realistic it is))
stolen from neogaf:
Interesting overtaking stats for the year:
All overtakes
1. Sebastian Vettel – 74 on-track overtakes
1. Mark Webber – 74
3. Felipe Massa – 65
4. Lewis Hamilton – 55
4. Romain Grosjean – 55
All overtakes, without backmarkers
Disgarding the overtakes on the teams of HRT, Marussia and Caterham
1. Sebastian Vettel – 51 on-track overtakes
2. Lewis Hamilton – 46
2. Mark Webber – 46
4. Felipe Massa – 45
5. Jenson Button – 41
All overtakes, without backmarkers, with equal tires
Disgarding the overtakes on the teams of HRT, Marussia and Caterham
Disgarding overtakes on cars with more than 5 lap older tires
1. Sebastian Vettel – 29 on-track overtakes
2. Jenson Button – 26
3. Mark Webber – 24
4. Kimi Räikkönen – 23
4. Felipe Massa – 23
All overtakes, only on 5 top teams
Counting only overtakes on the teams of Red Bull, Ferrari, McLaren, Lotus and Mercedes
1. Sebastian Vettel – 28 on-track overtakes
2. Lewis Hamilton – 25
3. Jenson Button – 22
4. Kimi Räikkönen – 21
5. Felipe Massa – 16
Who's up for a meltdown..?
Interesting overtaking stats for the year:
All overtakes
1. Sebastian Vettel – 74 on-track overtakes
1. Mark Webber – 74
3. Felipe Massa – 65
4. Lewis Hamilton – 55
4. Romain Grosjean – 55
All overtakes, without backmarkers
Disgarding the overtakes on the teams of HRT, Marussia and Caterham
1. Sebastian Vettel – 51 on-track overtakes
2. Lewis Hamilton – 46
2. Mark Webber – 46
4. Felipe Massa – 45
5. Jenson Button – 41
All overtakes, without backmarkers, with equal tires
Disgarding the overtakes on the teams of HRT, Marussia and Caterham
Disgarding overtakes on cars with more than 5 lap older tires
1. Sebastian Vettel – 29 on-track overtakes
2. Jenson Button – 26
3. Mark Webber – 24
4. Kimi Räikkönen – 23
4. Felipe Massa – 23
All overtakes, only on 5 top teams
Counting only overtakes on the teams of Red Bull, Ferrari, McLaren, Lotus and Mercedes
1. Sebastian Vettel – 28 on-track overtakes
2. Lewis Hamilton – 25
3. Jenson Button – 22
4. Kimi Räikkönen – 21
5. Felipe Massa – 16
Who's up for a meltdown..?
Billy Idol
Legend
Ha ha, great! I wonder how this will be twisted into Vettel being the worst or Vettel being the luckiest!
Still, in my honest opinion he should swap places with Alonso in all time ranking, because Alonso starts with 'A', and Vettel only with 'V' and I guess it is clear that leading the alphabet ranking has to be taken into account somehow...
