Digital Foundry Article Technical Discussion [2022]

[Nesh]

Oh the thing is GT7 appears to have been held back by PS4. And honestly the reflections during gameplay have some apparent weaknesses on PS5 as well.
Their resolution is not high, the resolution draw distance is short, and all vehicles are sharing the main car's reflection. Not sure what they are doing with car LOD's because in previous games it was a bit horrendous at times.
To be honest GT7 doesnt look very much improved compared to GT6. It seems like an upgrade but no next gen leap.
Turn10 is trying to turn up a notch everything and the trailer's presentation I feel was intentionally a subtle attack on GT7's weaknesses, with emphasis on track detail, RT during gameplay, dynamic whether and daytime on every track, damage on all cars, dust collection on surfaces etc.
PD stopped pushing the envelope as much as they used to, but I think they still insist on keeping most work on a fixed team which limits a lot, whereas Turn10 outsources a lot.

 

[davis.anthony]

Oh the thing is GT7 appears to have been held back by PS4. And honestly the reflections during gameplay have some apparent weaknesses on PS5 as well.
Their resolution is not high, the resolution draw distance is short, and all vehicles are sharing the main car's reflection. Not sure what they are doing with car LOD's because in previous games it was a bit horrendous at times.
To be honest GT7 doesnt look very much improved compared to GT6. It seems like an upgrade but no next gen leap.
Turn10 is trying to turn up a notch everything and the trailer's presentation I feel was intentionally a subtle attack on GT7's weaknesses, with emphasis on track detail, RT during gameplay, dynamic whether and daytime on every track, damage on all cars, dust collection on surfaces etc.
PD stopped pushing the envelope as much as they used to, but I think they still insist on keeping most work on a fixed team which limits a lot, whereas Turn10 outsources a lot.

I think PD's perfectionism is their biggest downfall.

If they were to move to fully 3D tree's and detail via PS5's new geometry system it's not something they would half ass, which means it would take them 10 years for a single game.

Sometimes having fictional tracks can speed things up as you don't have to waste time referencing the real life locations and can just get on with it.

 

[iroboto]

Oh the thing is GT7 appears to have been held back by PS4. And honestly the reflections during gameplay have some apparent weaknesses on PS5 as well.
Their resolution is not high, the resolution draw distance is short, and all vehicles are sharing the main car's reflection. Not sure what they are doing with car LOD's because in previous games it was a bit horrendous at times.
To be honest GT7 doesnt look very much improved compared to GT6. It seems like an upgrade but no next gen leap.
Turn10 is trying to turn up a notch everything and the trailer's presentation I feel was intentionally a subtle attack on GT7's weaknesses, with emphasis on track detail, RT during gameplay, dynamic whether and daytime on every track, damage on all cars, dust collection on surfaces etc.
PD stopped pushing the envelope as much as they used to, but I think they still insist on keeping most work on a fixed team which limits a lot, whereas Turn10 outsources a lot.

Yea.

I think it's clear to most people that GT7's greatest strength is its lighting and GI and modelling. It looks realistic but comes at a cost that it's baked and it will never change. So the real-time system of FM8 is not going to look as good when you consider how much computation time was put into the baking process, for FM8 to get close to GT7s lighting, it would require RTGI at the very least, even then it may still fall short - though in situations where there are interactions with lighting RTGI would exceed baked.
But definitely, you can see that yes, they attacked GT7 on being a largely baked game. It's quite a challenge to move everything to real-time, and it takes time to develop that type of system. You need to stay baked if you intend to stay cross-gen. GT8 may change to dynamic conditions, and that will be a more apt comparison in terms of quality.

 

[BRiT]

You need to stay baked if you intend to stay cross-gen. GT8 may change to dynamic conditions, and that will be a more apt comparison in terms of quality.

GT8 may still be cross-gen depending on release year, PS5 and PS6.

 

[snc]

Oh the thing is GT7 appears to have been held back by PS4. And honestly the reflections during gameplay have some apparent weaknesses on PS5 as well.
Their resolution is not high, the resolution draw distance is short, and all vehicles are sharing the main car's reflection. Not sure what they are doing with car LOD's because in previous games it was a bit horrendous at times.
To be honest GT7 doesnt look very much improved compared to GT6. It seems like an upgrade but no next gen leap.

Comparing to gt6 ? Are you serious here ;d Its mile ahead gt6, maybe you want to say gt sport then yes improvement is minor in graphics (main diff 1800cb vs 4k, motion blur during gameplay and dynamic day time and weather). About new fm graphics - environment details are just on onother league and not even comparable to gt7 but car models are generaly same level and lighting (not reflections as they are also better on fm) is still more natural/better on gt7. Not many writing about it but main problem with fm is lack of proper wheel support, hope they will fix it as its simcade not arcade like fh so its quite important part of game.

 

[Nesh]

Comparing to gt6 ? Are you serious here ;d Its mile ahead gt6, maybe you want to say gt sport then yes improvement is minor in graphics (main diff 1800cb vs 4k, motion blur during gameplay and dynamic day time and weather). About new fm graphics - environment details are just on onother league and not even comparable to gt7 but car models are generaly same level and lighting (not reflections as they are also better on fm) is still more natural/better on gt7. Not many writing about it but main problem with fm is lack of proper wheel support, hope they will fix it as its simcade not arcade like fh so its quite important part of game.

oh I actually wanted to say GT Sport yes I mixed them uo

 

[milk]

This. I'm also not a fan of certain games that allow additional photo mode IQ enhancements (like higher quality AA or higher LODs) that aren't present in real-time gameplay. I've seen way too many gamers trying to pass off enhanced photo mode shots as being representative of actual gameplay.

So you are saying Devs should decide what features they offer in non-gameplay monents based on fringe screenshot competitions that dumb fan-boy-warriors have on internet forums. Yeah, very important issue.

 

[eastmen]

Odd that the xbox one has a weird lag in regards to sound. Also on ps5 in surround sound mode it plays only from the center speaker (should be patched soon).

The switch also has a frame time issue which should be fixed in a patch. Also it has trouble keeping 60fps on switch going to sub 30 with 5 players on screen

 

[PSman1700]

 

[snc]

Surprising John didnt remember fm7 was released same time as gt sport as he made video comparison :d

 

[snc]

 

[Pete]

Basically the Xbox fanboys were taking the piss out of the PS fanboys because Forza does RT during gameplay and GT7 doesn't

Then it came to light that it was actually PC footage of the game with RT.

Then the Sony fan boys started taking the piss of the Xbox fan boys because it was PC footage.

Alex from DF then took some guestimates regarding frame rate, resolution and RT in Forza (Basically said that native 4k at 60fps wasn't happening with RT and questioned PC version being held back)

PS fan boys used this to further take the piss out of the Xbox fanboys.

Forza devs then confirm that only RT reflections are available during gameplay and RT GI is only available in replays and other area's.

Cue XB fan boys taking the piss out of PS fan boys again because it has RT reflections during gameplay, followed by PS fan boys taking the piss back by saying if the reflections in the PC footage look that bad then how bad is the XB version going to look.

It's been quite comical.

Sounds like Twitter is a sea of piss takes. I’ll just stick to YouTube comments, thankyouvery—oh. Oh, no.

“The froguRT is also cursed.”

 

[Jupiter]

I was not a fan of the unstable Resident Evil 3 visuals on PlayStation 4 Pro but on PC with this new raytracing update it looks stunning on highest possible graphics settings, UHD and stable 60 fps. A whole other level and I am glad that those transformative improvements made it into this game. Without raytracing I could not stand the artifact-rich realtime reflections and therefore I always deactivated SSR.

Still they need to fix the low animation framerate on enemies which are more than a few meters away.

 

[Seanspeed]

Yea.

I think it's clear to most people that GT7's greatest strength is its lighting and GI and modelling. It looks realistic but comes at a cost that it's baked and it will never change. So the real-time system of FM8 is not going to look as good when you consider how much computation time was put into the baking process, for FM8 to get close to GT7s lighting, it would require RTGI at the very least, even then it may still fall short - though in situations where there are interactions with lighting RTGI would exceed baked.
But definitely, you can see that yes, they attacked GT7 on being a largely baked game. It's quite a challenge to move everything to real-time, and it takes time to develop that type of system. You need to stay baked if you intend to stay cross-gen. GT8 may change to dynamic conditions, and that will be a more apt comparison in terms of quality.

I'm still not quite sure why people think GT7 has better lighting at all. I feel like people are just judging the artistic component of things rather than the merits of the lighting system itself. We'll need to see more of Forza Motorsport to really judge which is doing more here.

 

[mr magoo]

I'm still not quite sure why people think GT7 has better lighting at all. I feel like people are just judging the artistic component of things rather than the merits of the lighting system itself. We'll need to see more of Forza Motorsport to really judge which is doing more here.

yeah i think we have to wait and see but gt7 vs Fm7 is night and day.

 

[PSman1700]

FM7 looks better because its not cross-platform.

 

[iroboto]

I'm still not quite sure why people think GT7 has better lighting at all. I feel like people are just judging the artistic component of things rather than the merits of the lighting system itself. We'll need to see more of Forza Motorsport to really judge which is doing more here.

At a first glance, I think it's apparent that the GI quality is better on the baked GT7 vs FM8. And that's fine. There's only judgment at this point in time, the move to real-time lighting and GI will result in lesser quality than our years of research into baked quality. It takes time for things to get better, and the pursuit of progress will eventually net the fruits of labour provided that progression never halts. Ultimately if there is no effect on gameplay then going baked is an ideal trade-off for performance gains.

If dynamic lighting opens up gameplay, then that is a big deal for the gameplay experience, it may not look better today (but with time and power it certainly will), but it may feel significantly more engaging as a result. 24 Le Mans style racing may make an appearance here with Forza now that they can do 24 hour lighting changes.

The issue is that with Ray Tracing, everyone expects (fairly so because of marketing hype) to be decidedly a whole generation of improvement over our existing techniques immediately. But people can't spot it. But over time as there is more research and development into this area (both in techniques and hardware power), the ceiling for RT-based solutions will far surpass our traditional lighting techniques, it will open up dynamic game play scenarios etc. And that's ultimately where we want games to head.

 

[PSman1700]

 

[Shortbread]

The original debut for the RE Engine gets a new patch for PS5 and Xbox Series systems - once again adding ray-tracing and 120Hz Modes. The difference next to the Resident Evil 2 and 3 Remake updates? Performance is very nicely optimised for 4K and 60FPS even with ray-tracing enabled - though Series S flags a few more issues than the two premium machines.

 

[Phantom88]

Resident Evil's new PC patches compromise visuals and hit performance hard

If you're not using ray tracing, don't upgrade - it's that simple.

www.eurogamer.net

Resident Evil's new PC patches compromise visuals and hit performance hard​

If you're not using ray tracing, don't upgrade - it's that simple.