All purpose Sales and Sales Rumours and Anecdotes [2022 Edition]

[Johnny Awesome]

It depends on the title and the deal they have worked out with MS.

 

[BRiT]

Btw how is Gamepass allocating revenue? Now this one seems to be on the top charts on gamepass.
It should deserve some extra remunaration. Is this how it works?

Depends on the deal terms they agreed to. I recall a tweet from a Microsoft persona that indicated there is no standard deal as nearly every deal is different. They have a few different typical structures but everything is custom.

 

[Nesh]

Kinda sucks though as this means there is no transparency and some titles may be experiencing some opportunity costs.
This game may not sell well out of gamepass, but people seem to enjoy it enormously in gamepass. Surpassing every other game is a huge thing. It should deserve some pretty good income.

Btw I checked some videos and the footage I ve seen is funny. The way I understand this game, is that motivates the player to experiment with character's reactions and interactions.
Its kinda like the easter eggs we have been experiencing in the Metal Gear Solid series but under a different more humorous cartoonish execution and probably this game is full from top to bottom with them.

Is this correct?

 

[Johnny Awesome]

Why does it suck? Two companies made an agreement and it was honored. Sounds pretty fair to me.

 

[Inuhanyou]

Interesting. I'll have to check that one out.

Btw, I know people treat VG chartz with skepticism and we probably should be careful, but they think that X|S and PS5 are neck and neck world-wide this holiday. The Series S was a great idea for MS as it's helping them close the gap with Sony pretty well, I think.

Vg chartz is never accurate. Not that I don't think Xbox is doing well or anything. But it's better to not look for confirmation of catching up to sony from them

 

[Nesh]

Why does it suck? Two companies made an agreement and it was honored. Sounds pretty fair to me.

Agreements dont always mean fully fair or pareto efficiency for all parties. We dont know the details. But having different agreements for each case, it means there is something being negotiated, with the benefits being subject of the negotiating power of those sitting on the table.
Since there is no standard for every company, it is expected that some games might be benefitting more than others.

 

[BRiT]

This game may not sell well out of gamepass,

High on Life Steam sales skyrocket alongside PC Game Pass success

High on Life Steam sales rise despite Game Pass launch as the FPS game from Rick and Morty creator Justin Roiland pushes ahead of Modern Warfare 2 and FIFA 23

www.pcgamesn.com

It looks like High on Life Steam sales are off to a very strong start. The irreverent comedy FPS game from Squanch Games, founded by Rick and Morty co-creator Justin Roiland, has pushed past Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 and FIFA 23 to take second place behind the Steam Deck on the weekly top sellers list, as reported by SteamDB. Perhaps even more impressive is that the High on Life release also saw the game come to Microsoft’s PC Game Pass subscription service, yet this hasn’t stopped it from selling big on Steam as well.

 

[Inuhanyou]

Agreements dont always mean fully fair or pareto efficiency for all parties. We dont know the details. But having different agreements for each case, it means there is something being negotiated, with the benefits being subject of the negotiating power of those sitting on the table.
Since there is no standard for every company, it is expected that some games might be benefitting more than others.

Gamepass I think definitely helps indies out in many cases, its like games with gold or ps plus games on steroids which gets tons of eyes on the game for relatively low investment

Whether it's smart for games that are bigger and need huge returns is another story. But MS is a trillion dollar company, they should be able to eat the cost to any size game without issue indefinitely.

 

[see colon]

Gamepass I think definitely helps indies out in many cases, its like games with gold or ps plus games on steroids which gets tons of eyes on the game for relatively low investment

Whether it's smart for games that are bigger and need huge returns is another story. But MS is a trillion dollar company, they should be able to eat the cost to any size game without issue indefinitely.

I would almost think it's better than Games with Gold or PS+ free games because Gamepass subs know going in that they can't keep it forever. That means people who play a game and like it are more likely to buy it, and more likely to play it more even if they don't. I know that sounds a bit strange, but if you sample a game on Gamepass, and you like it, you will probably try to finish it before it leaves the service if you aren't interested or able to purchase it. This drives hours of play, which trickles through Live because if you see a group of your friends playing a game, you are more likely to check out what it is. And that means you are more likely to buy it than you would have been if you had never heard about it.

A Gamepass success has a somewhat counter-intuitive uplift to game sales. But of course, the opposite can also happen if you publish a dud and no one enjoys it.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I would almost think it's better than Games with Gold or PS+ free games because Gamepass subs know going in that they can't keep it forever. That means people who play a game and like it are more likely to buy it, and more likely to play it more even if they don't. I know that sounds a bit strange, but if you sample a game on Gamepass, and you like it, you will probably try to finish it before it leaves the service if you aren't interested or able to purchase it. This drives hours of play, which trickles through Live because if you see a group of your friends playing a game, you are more likely to check out what it is. And that means you are more likely to buy it than you would have been if you had never heard about it.

A Gamepass success has a somewhat counter-intuitive uplift to game sales. But of course, the opposite can also happen if you publish a dud and no one enjoys it.

That's true. But unfortunately I've seen too many people anecdotally say they don't ever buy games if they come to game pass. It's unfortunate. As a wider industry sample I wonder how it actually does affect game sales as a whole, but we don't have any numbers to actually glean any substantial info besides some individual games.

Despite not being a fan of the gamepass model (or ps plus or games with gold model for that matter) however, it's without doubt that gamepass does a segment of the market a good service with cases like these

 

[iceberg187]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1605292202531229696

 

[AlphaWolf]

That's true. But unfortunately I've seen too many people anecdotally say they don't ever buy games if they come to game pass. It's unfortunate. As a wider industry sample I wonder how it actually does affect game sales as a whole, but we don't have any numbers to actually glean any substantial info besides some individual games.

Despite not being a fan of the gamepass model (or ps plus or games with gold model for that matter) however, it's without doubt that gamepass does a segment of the market a good service with cases like these

And how many of those people were going to buy it if it never came to gamepass? I think you're talking about the same people who bought all of their games used at gamestop and thought they were doing the developer a favor because they play so many games.

 

[Inuhanyou]

And how many of those people were going to buy it if it never came to gamepass? I think you're talking about the same people who bought all of their games used at gamestop and thought they were doing the developer a favor because they play so many games.

I dunno. Speaking for myself, in the past I often always bought plenty of used games at GameStop and could only rarely ever buy games new cause I just couldn't afford paying full price every time for something I didn't know if I'd enjoy or not.

But with PSN sales being practically weekly these days with games essentially lowering in price relatively quickly, buying games properly digitally became way more viable and easier to do. So I end up with far more games that I own now than I would going to GameStop and online shopping in general has made retail purchasing also much easier than buying used a lot of the time too.

Even if I can't buy games full price I still think making things affordable is good solution to support the devs and gain full ownership. I wish Nintendo would take the hint but they practically never lower their prices and still make good sales for their products..

I dunno if that's just because of Nintendo blind brand loyalty or the fact Nintendo has just conditioned their users to never expect sales and lower prices

 

[see colon]

I dunno. Speaking for myself, in the past I often always bought plenty of used games at GameStop and could only rarely ever buy games new cause I just couldn't afford paying full price every time for something I didn't know if I'd enjoy or not.

I work at a mom and pop video game store. We do plenty of retro games but also carry modern consoles and games. Gamepass has really changed the way Xbox games sell, or more accurately, how hard they are to get. Obviously they are available new via distributers, but anyone who knows the games industry knows the real way to make money is buying and selling used games, and selling accessories. Xbox One and Series games aren't often traded in, and when they are, it's the same 20ish titles. If a game launches into Gamepass, there is a high probability that it will be uncommon in the used market. If it's also a multiplatform game, a physical copy is probably worth more used than it's Playstation counterpart. Microsoft has effectively solved the "used game problem" that some publishers complained about some years ago without resorting to sleezy tactics like online pass.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I work at a mom and pop video game store. We do plenty of retro games but also carry modern consoles and games. Gamepass has really changed the way Xbox games sell, or more accurately, how hard they are to get. Obviously they are available new via distributers, but anyone who knows the games industry knows the real way to make money is buying and selling used games, and selling accessories. Xbox One and Series games aren't often traded in, and when they are, it's the same 20ish titles. If a game launches into Gamepass, there is a high probability that it will be uncommon in the used market. If it's also a multiplatform game, a physical copy is probably worth more used than it's Playstation counterpart. Microsoft has effectively solved the "used game problem" that some publishers complained about some years ago without resorting to sleezy tactics like online pass.

I would probably say on the whole both pubs have solved used game "crisis" ( I didn't think there was a real crisis but publisher desperation due to their insane reliance on AAA investment and investor expectations). Especially considering the ratio of games that are now being sold digitally on PSN according to Sony's investor statements compared to physical

Now sure how Nintendo is doing in relation to that but I'd assume their digital storefront makes some money as well

 

[Johnny Awesome]

Agreements dont always mean fully fair or pareto efficiency for all parties. We dont know the details. But having different agreements for each case, it means there is something being negotiated, with the benefits being subject of the negotiating power of those sitting on the table.
Since there is no standard for every company, it is expected that some games might be benefitting more than others.

That's true. It's just not a problem.

 

[BRiT]

Xbox Podcast: Justin Roiland on Why High on Life Came to Game Pass (and How That Will Help Make Future Games) - Xbox Wire

Justin Roiland explained to us why he chose to join Game Pass for High on Life - and how it should help Squanch Games make new titles in future.

news.xbox.com

“Before we decided to pull the trigger on it, I spoke with a handful of other studio folks who did Game Pass,” Roiland explained. “And I ultimately came to the conclusion based off of what I had heard that it is– it’s a value-add. Because essentially, there’s a lot of people that would otherwise not have picked up the game and played it.

“And those people, if you believe in what you’ve made, and you really you feel confident that you’ve made something special, or different– and we do with our game– those folks can become evangelists in a way for the title.”

...

Roiland’s research helped him conclude that Game Pass is, “a powerful tool to get a lot of reach. If you really do believe you made something worthwhile, it’s a pretty powerful tool. And that’s what I gathered in doing my due diligence on it on my own. A lot of folks told me that non-Game Pass games that they ship versus Game Pass games, [they get] 7x sales.”

...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1605624159534399490

 

[Silent_Buddha]

You can think of it another way. For indie developers that can't afford a large advertising campaign in multiple countries in multiple languages each being tailored to the cultural differences in each country (important as a advertisement in one country that works may be viewed as offensive in another country) GamePass is like an incredibly cheap advertising avenue (leverage GamePass subscribers to proselytize your game to friends, family and social media) where not only is there no cost out of pocket but they also earn some revenue by it being on GamePass.

For Indie and AA games, the benefits (steady revenue stream + increased sales) far outweigh any potential loss of sales from someone playing it on GP instead of buying it.

The cost benefit obviously shifts for AAA games where there is far greater public awareness of your game, but there are still benefits in drawing in people who cannot afford to buy every AAA game that comes out and thus might choose other AAA games (IP they have played before) over your AAA game (never played anything by your dev. studio) because of some level of familiarity or word of mouth.

That last is why AAA studios rarely introduce new IP anymore and why we get X new game in IP franchise or Remake #4 in same franchise or Reimagining of the first game in Y franchise or Remaster of games in Y franchise. You're far more likely to get someone to buy your game if it's an IP they've already played in the past and they've liked it in the past.

Regards,
SB

 

[Nesh]

I work at a mom and pop video game store. We do plenty of retro games but also carry modern consoles and games. Gamepass has really changed the way Xbox games sell, or more accurately, how hard they are to get. Obviously they are available new via distributers, but anyone who knows the games industry knows the real way to make money is buying and selling used games, and selling accessories. Xbox One and Series games aren't often traded in, and when they are, it's the same 20ish titles. If a game launches into Gamepass, there is a high probability that it will be uncommon in the used market. If it's also a multiplatform game, a physical copy is probably worth more used than it's Playstation counterpart. Microsoft has effectively solved the "used game problem" that some publishers complained about some years ago without resorting to sleezy tactics like online pass.

So they resolved it by eliminating the existence of physical games being sold at retail.

 

[see colon]

So they resolved it by eliminating the existence of physical games being sold at retail.

Basically, but without the negative reception they would have received had they removed the physical retail component. They still sell games at retail. They still have floor space at stores, and physical releases I'm sure are important for some customers. But Gamepass has redefined the console experience for a substantial percentage of the market. And there are policies and marketing built into the Gamepass model to move consumers to a digital only future. Like giving discounts to subscribers to games on the service, combined with games cycling in and out of the catalog, encourages digital purchases. Building habits for digital ownership are a big part of the model.