i believe Seagate supplies them with ALL their HDDs.
Black XB360 120 Gig HDD + HDMI = $479
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i believe Seagate supplies them with ALL their HDDs.
scooby_dooby
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don't forget, 2.5" SATA ... with proprietary enclosure and connection. (snap in/snap out) (which now looks like a stupid idea)
that's why we can not compare apples/apples.
Why does it look like a stupid idea? We have no idea how muc hthis adds to the cost, but I would guess the price has much less to do with the actual cost of the proprietary enclosure, and much more to do with MS's insanely high pricing schemes.
$100 for wifi usb adapter says it all. I have no doubt they could sell the 20gb for $50 and still clear a profit.
So, it's not the proprietary drive that was really the mistake(to a small extent it is), but rather MS's abuse of the proprietary status of their peripherals across the board.
don't forget, 2.5" SATA ... with proprietary enclosure and connection. (snap in/snap out) (which now looks like a stupid idea)
that's why we can not compare apples/apples.
A $2 enclosure + OEM drive is not apples to oranges. Like with most add-ons I'm sure the margin is above 50%. I'm sure the reseller margin is 20% alone, so the MS cost has to be less than $80, most likely $40.
I disagree with the proprietary nature hardly adding to the cost (Seagate is building one HDD SKU for one single customer MS) ... (see my post regarding the 20gig cost)... not to mention the strategy hinders our ability to add our own HDD for downloads.
Also, the ridiculous nature of peripheral pricing HARDLY started with MS or this generation.
that's a long standing tradition in this industry to make up some of the losses in giving away the hardware cheaper than cost while game sales catch up the revenue curve over time. :smile:
don't forget, 2.5" SATA ... with proprietary enclosure and connection. (snap in/snap out) (which now looks like a stupid idea)
that's why we can not compare apples/apples.
Gotten from Newegg.
The description labels it as a 2.5" drive.And yes we all know MS doesn't pay that, and that they have packaging cost and the cost of putting whatever media the drive may come with (sounds like none even though the 20 gig had media on it).
Well is a screwdriver required to remove the drive in the ps3? (Honestly never looked at my dad's unit long enough) If so then I guess it isn't truly portable/removeable in the same sense as MS's is. (If you ignore the stupid price difference)
scooby_dooby
Legend
Yes it did. $180 HDD is 60% of the entire cost of a console last generation, at launch.
Last gen, it was not great but not horrible, now we have MS charging $40 for a 64mb memory card.
You honestly think it costs MS more than $40 for the custom 20gb HDD? There's no way.
They are obviously under marching orders to be profitable bu 2007, and gouging deep to make it happen. Probably at the cost of market leadership if they don't make some quick moves.
p.s. yes I realize I used entirely too much bolding in that post
Gotten from Newegg.
I figured it might I was just clarifying as a lot of other people seem to jump to conclusions and are not aware of the details of the product.
Last gen, it was not great but not horrible, now we have MS charging $40 for a 64mb memory card.
that price is dropping with the addition of the new larger card... so again, there is a curve that early adopters pay the premium for getting the cutting edge for below cost while games make up for it, allowing cost drops over time.
It is still a profit driven business after all.
oh and I'm pretty sure I paid a ridiculous amount (at the time) for stupid "save cards" for my PS1 and Dreamcast too and it pissed me off.
Here is a question for everyone, tPrice for the United States is $479 but what about the rest of North America. If you transfer that $479 US dollars into Canadian dollars you get about $550 but here the Premium 360 costs $499 s either they can give the Elite to the Canadians for $550 wich gives us a better deal in comparison to the US for the Elite and Premium pricing or they can increase the price to $579 or $599, but by doing this the PS3 is also only $20 away or the same price much like in the US. What is everyone's thoughts on this?
a source on GAF said that he is familiar with MS's cost on 20 gig current (proprietary :smile
If that plastic enclosure is costing them more than $60 a unit - more than the drive itself! - then God help whoever makes sourcing decisions over at XBox.
oh and I'm pretty sure I paid a ridiculous amount (at the time) for stupid "save cards" for my PS1 and Dreamcast too and it pissed me off.
ps2 as well!
Though I agree with Scoob, the periphs are way out of line price/perf wise. but they are trying to bridge the gap with ps2 still I believe. (64mb should be more than 8mb ... 8mb costs $20 and up from there)
to clarify the entire enclosure on the top is the HDD that they sell and it actually sits on the outside of the machine. whole unit you see is the enclosure and it snaps on/off. Notice the little button just before the rise in the shape to press and release.
scooby_dooby
Legend
oh and I'm pretty sure I paid a ridiculous amount (at the time) for stupid "save cards" for my PS1 and Dreamcast too and it pissed me off.
At the time the price was a little more realstic, flash memory was still fairly expensive. Back in 1999 I remember RAM was sometimes ~$1/mb.
But in 2005 you could easily buy a 512mb card for $29, and for MS to release a 64mb was pinching pennies to the extreme imo. I think it hurts them in the longrun, expecially when short-sighted moves like that have ripple effects, i.e. no XB Arcade game could be over 64mb due to the tiny MC.
That was a mistake that they did catch, and have recently fixed by bumping up the limit, but it is a good example of saving a couple pennies, and potentially costing yourself much more in the long run.
I think the HDD is another example, they make a couple million off of the HDD by gouging, but they completely stall the adoption of the Core SKU as a result. In the long run, this will bite them in the ass (hopefully! cause lessons need to be learned here).
If that plastic enclosure is costing them more than $60 a unit - more than the drive itself! - then God help whoever makes sourcing decisions over at XBox.
come on Xbd, I'm in business for myself and nobody.... nobody... prices anything without a markup.
I'm just saying that perhaps it's not as much of a rip-off as some want to claim when comparing to an off the shelf OEM part from NewEgg (who specialize in low price, high volume compared to B&M).
oh and FTR, I also wish the 120 drive was $99 and that we could use our USB drives for saving media which is why I think a proprietary HDD may have been a mistake,.
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come on Xbd, I'm in business for myself and nobody.... nobody... prices anything without a markup.
Oh I definitely agree with you here.
I'm just saying that perhaps it's not as much of a rip-off as some want to claim when comparing to an off the shelf OEM part from NewEgg (who specialize in low price, high volume compared to B&M).
Just not here!
Anyway I don't care much either way, so I'll leave the debating to those more passionate on the subject. I agree with you though that Newegg is not the best comparison point for determining retail pricing, but I think it was being raised as more of an indication of what MS' own margins on this thing must be.
Newegg prices are more than MS's. MS can sign a deal with a minimum order of 100,000+ 120GB direct from the manufacturer and get a great price (like most have said probably <$50). Newegg has to buy from another distributer who buys from the manufacturer and buy them hundreds or thousands at a time. It's the same way Walmart works, guarantee large number and strong arm low prices.
This is just a new SKU that is meant to appeal to those who:
bitched about lack of HDMI
bitched about lack of bigger HDD
didn't like the white and wanted black to go with their other AV Equipment
If you're not in the above list, then don't worry about the new sku. You can still buy the core and premium as always and your gaming experience will be the same.
bitched about lack of HDMI
bitched about lack of bigger HDD
didn't like the white and wanted black to go with their other AV Equipment
If you're not in the above list, then don't worry about the new sku. You can still buy the core and premium as always and your gaming experience will be the same.
Ok well I don't know about margins that high - a 120GB drive is going to cost something, I'm just guessing it's around ~$60'ish when procured in the hundreds of thousands.
I'm not 100% sure how the Retail market works in this regard but: Aren't periphs a big profit source for the Retailers along with games (in contrast to the systems themselves which in the early years are not)
Doesn't excuse some of the crazier margins we see on some things (wifi) but one can clearly see a diffierence between online pricing and typical retail. (which explains how a place like newegg became so popular in the first place)
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