Xbox 360 1080p – Why Not?

[Shifty Geezer]

Of course. 1080p is just the output resolution. Rendering at 2x the pixels doesn't need 2x the assets - they just get rendered larger. Think of it this way; when you install a game on your PC that takes up 2 GBs to play at 1024x768, you don't have to install more if you want to render at 1280x1024, do you?

 

[JardeL]

If so what's the meaning of Blu-Ray on PS3 then ?

And what about in-game videos ?

 

[Carl B]

Are Double Layer discs enough for 1080p games ?

What kind of a question is this? Of course they are.

Now - how large of a game are we talking about?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

If so what's the meaning of Blu-Ray on PS3 then ?

BluRay in PS3 is there for several reasons, one of which is Sony wanting to propagate this format to make it a standard so they make royalties on every HD movie etc. Another reason is to provide more detailed/expansive content for games. If you consider an open game like Oblivion that fits on a DVD, say 5 GB, if you wanted that same game but with 4x the variety of environments, monsters, fand everything else, you'd need 20 GB of storage. You don't need next-gen optical disks to render at 1080p, but more storage could be used for me content.

And what about in-game videos ?

These will likely come in HD flavours for those with HD sets, filling up space (though you can get 720p with higher compression onto DVD).

 

[A176]

From IGN:

IGN : Does the Xbox 360 have the internal bandwidth between CPUs and graphics processors necessary to move a full 1080p image? There's a big difference between 1080i and the 3GB/s of 1080p.

Microsoft: No Comment.

http://gear.ign.com/articles/735/735860p1.html

the way and pace things are moving, i believe hdmi is just around the corner.

 

[SPM]

From IGN:



http://gear.ign.com/articles/735/735860p1.html

the way and pace things are moving, i believe hdmi is just around the corner.

This does rather confirm my suspicions that Microsoft's 1080p and HD-DVD add-on announcements look like a paniced half baked reaction to the launch of the PS3 - although I can't understand why.

 

[Rangers]

This does rather confirm my suspicions that Microsoft's 1080p and HD-DVD add-on announcements look like a paniced half baked reaction to the launch of the PS3 - although I can't understand why.

What part confirms anything? Like, what were you not worried about before that the article changes?

The article really seems uneducated. For example..you do not have to use a DVI adapter for 1080P over VGA..wtf is that about? So now VGA cant do a common PC resolution of 1920X1080?

Someone posted a stat that less than 2% of TV's sold LAST quarter where even 1080P anyway. That's not some faraway qaurter. If that's the case than the # of 1080P TV's as an overall has got to be infimitesable. I dont know, something like 1/100th of 1%.

As I understand it, 360 will do 1080P over component and VGA, not HDMI. That's it. Supposedly the HDDVD movies will be ONLY on VGA because that's some kind of DRM thing that they cant go over component. But these restrictions apply to such a small percentage of anything it's kind of ridiculous. As IGN points out, 1080i is the same as 1080P (after being deinterlaced by the TV) in many cases anyway).

The ONLY time you get benefit from 1080P is >30 FPS. That's it. Which eliminates all HDDVD/Blu-Ray movies currently.

The other part of the article that's glaring is her question about bandwidth. It just doesn't make any sense, and surely befuddled some marketing guy to the point of no comment, which IGN then sort of makes it look guilty or something. As has been pointed out the internal bandwidths of PS3 and 360 are similar anyway. And 22.4 GB/s>3GB/s AFAIK (and I have no idea if it even matters).

The main thing I wonder is if MS can somehow "retrofit" EXISTING 360's for HDMI. They've kind of implied as much. I think they should go ahead and do it then, but in any case it's going to be once again, just for PR. Because that's what 1080P is about, almost nobody currently benefits, and those that do (1080P TV owners) even then only benefit in very limited senarios (while frankly, losing out on a lot because most content is 720P which wont look as good on a native 1080P display).
________
Live sex webshows

 

[SPM]

http://uk.gear.ign.com/articles/735/735860p1.html

The other connections capable of carrying an HD signal (and the only ones currently supported by the Xbox 360) are Component and VGA. Both are analog connections, which means that they can't support HDCP / AACS. They are also subject to interference if the cables run too close to masses of power lines. The really big problem with Xbox 360's lack of HDMI support, however, is the that only a limited number of 1080p-capable HDTVs can accept the signal via analog inputs.

In addition to the fall update that will allow the 360 to internally up-scale to 1080p,
Microsoft is launching an HD-DVD add-on for the X360 in mid-November for $199. Obviously, Microsoft is making a serious move in the realm of 1080p, but without support for an HDMI connection.

This will leave many folks in a bit of a quandary. There are very few HDTVs that accept a 1080p signal through anything other than HDMI. The best signal that many of these 1080p displays are able to accept via analog connections is 1080i, which is de-interlaced by the HDTV's internal circuitry to convert it back to 1080p. This is essentially exactly what these displays would do when accepting 1080i from the 360 right now. It seems Xbox 360's new 1080p prowess may not amount to much in practice.


IGN : Does the Xbox 360 have the internal bandwidth between CPUs and graphics processors necessary to move a full 1080p image? There's a big difference between 1080i and the 3GB/s of 1080p.

Microsoft: No Comment.

The Microsoft XBox + 360 HD-DVD add-on solution is a complete waste of money. The XBox is noisy (not good for watching movies) and you get a jumble of cables (not good for your living room), you probably get poorer image quality going through VGA/component, plus if you want 1080p only a few 1080p HDTV sets will support the XBox + HD-DVD add-on. It certainly looks to me like a rushed PR kludge in response to PS3. If you really want an HD-DVD player you are much better off buying the Toshiba HD-DVD player, and who in their right mind would give a damn about saving $50-100 if it is in exchange for accepting more background noise, limited options, and poorer image quality given that you have to buy a 1080p HDTV for $1000+ anyway. If I am spending that kind of money, I would want a top end solution, not a kludge.

As for 1080p, after denying that 1080p is necessary last year, I get the distinct impression Microsoft is pushing it only because 1080p HDTVs have suddenly appeared and the PS3 has it - ie. another knee jerk "me too" PR exercise to allow Microsoft to add HD and 1080p on the features list.

 

[assen]

If you really want an HD-DVD player you are much better off buying the Toshiba HD-DVD player, and who in their right mind would give a damn about saving $50-100 if it is in exchange for accepting more background noise, limited options, and poorer image quality given that you have to buy a 1080p HDTV for $1000+ anyway.

It's not $50-100 if you already have a 360, or if you have ANY other use for the 360, even playing Bejewelled on Arcade.

 

[pipo]

...ie. another knee jerk "me too" PR exercise to allow Microsoft to add HD and 1080p on the features list.

The fact the hardware can handle it shows that they've thought about it in advance.

I suspect MS wasn't planning on using this until maybe a new 360 model though.

The sweet spot still is 720p though. And I completely agree with them on that.

 

[A176]

The article really seems uneducated. For example..you do not have to use a DVI adapter for 1080P over VGA..wtf is that about? So now VGA cant do a common PC resolution of 1920X1080?

Because the article seemed to be more like a 'layman's intro to HD gaming', I believe that part refers to the fact not so many tv's in north america have vga ports, but rather dvi (such as my own Sony Wega), so you'll need to use a VGA-to-DVI adaptor.

 

[22psi]

I think 1080p is really really overhyped and overrated. Give me 720p, 60fps, 4xAA, massive geometry, etc first

 

[blakjedi]

Actually quite few tv if they are 1080p native CAN do 1080p component... but there arent many 1080P sets... they are mostly DLP and LCD if anything... many of which DO have PC/VGA in addition to consumer connections... the author of that article is just plain wrong...

The big issue for many 1080P owners is whether there is 1:1 pixel Mapping.

 

[pascal]

I think 1080p is really really overhyped and overrated. Give me 720p, 60fps, 4xAA, massive geometry, etc first

Agree, add some massive pixel shading too (100 passes)

 

[ManuVlad3.0]

Xbox 360's New 1080p Support: Crippled?

 

[scooby_dooby]

lol, updated

Microsoft: *updated* Yes, the Xbox 360 has the necessary internal bandwidth between CPUs and graphics processors to move a full 1080p image.

 

[London Geezer]

lol, updated

Microsoft: *updated* Yes, the Xbox 360 has the necessary internal bandwidth between CPUs and graphics processors to move a full 1080p image.

Of course it does. All GPUs this side of the decade have been able to output higher resolutions and they all had much lower bandwidth that what the X360 has. It just depends on what image it is.

 

[22psi]

lol, updated

Microsoft: *updated* Yes, the Xbox 360 has the necessary internal bandwidth between CPUs and graphics processors to move a full 1080p image.

I find that update funny as well, like either MS rep had to go check to be sure or something.

 

[Jesus2006]

Updated again:

***Updated 9/28, 2:15 PM PST***

IGN: Can the X360 send out a digital signal now, or ever?

Microsoft Xbox 360 currently doesn't include a digital out connection for video. Our platform is flexible enough to allow support of a digital connection in the future should we choose to do so. When the Xbox 360 was being developed HDMI was nascent and with our current connections we support what the overwhelming majority of consumers have available to them. It's important to note that the market penetration of 1080p displays is in the single digits. Regardless, for those early adopters who have displays and projectors that support 1080p over VGA and component we have a solution and it is a free upgrade for them. We are watching the market closely and will continue to evaluate our solution in the face of consumer demand, but have no announcements regarding additional cables or connections.

But i guess that just means what was already announced - that MS could release a box with HDMI support, not a cable. Very vague expressoins there though...

 

[Rash']

I'm really confused on this whole matter and would really appreciate simple response to this question. Is the 1080p display natively possible on 360?