Windows 10 [2014 - 2017]

Discussion in 'PC Hardware, Software and Displays' started by Scott_Arm, Oct 1, 2014.

Tags:
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,165
    Likes Received:
    1,311
    weird, on my tablet the hidpi scaling works fine (except on those non-hdpi aware legacy app like regedit like you said).
     
  2. Grall

    Grall Invisible Member
    Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2002
    Messages:
    10,801
    Likes Received:
    2,172
    Location:
    La-la land
    It's because windows by and large is fucking ancient under the hood. It's built on a codebase that dates right back to NT, pre-turn of the century. The run dialog, regedit itself and many of the other various utilities and system management applets built into windows itself (like the file permission management dialogs, computer properties dialogs, disk management applet, control panel and so on) are all fucking ancient and basically unchanged since jesus and the god damned deciples walked the earth... :p

    MS is trying to kludge on high-DPI support to bits of an OS that was never built to support it. Then you add that high-DPI screens are still mostly a curiosity in the PC world, and there probably isn't much incentive to spend the resources needed to make it work properly. Notch it up to good ole Redmond Incompetence, heh. Give them a decade or so and maybe they'll whip it into shape, eventually.
     
  3. zed

    zed
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2005
    Messages:
    4,445
    Likes Received:
    632
    I'm not talking about the app, which is OK sure its not high DPI but its enlarged (thus blurry) I'm talking about the messagebox before then asking if you want to make changes, I ran it just now went and got a ruler and measured the letters. They are 1mm high on the screen, I am not making this up. 1mm high text!
    Surely they can spend the 5 mins and make a legible messagebox, I havent coded any of the windows API's in years but I reckon I could even manage it in a few minutes
     
    Grall likes this.
  4. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,165
    Likes Received:
    1,311
    on your screenshot i only see the icon text, no message box.

    or that is your point? the message box is so small, its practically invisible in your screenshot. im confused
     
  5. hoom

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2003
    Messages:
    2,948
    Likes Received:
    497
    BTW there is apparently a major Anniversary Edition update coming around July.
    Looks like they are bringing back a bunch of those Win8 features for Tablet mode that people have been complaining about being missing.
     
  6. Shifty Geezer

    Shifty Geezer uber-Troll!
    Moderator Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2004
    Messages:
    40,741
    Likes Received:
    11,222
    Location:
    Under my bridge
    It's a bit of a crap-shoot for me. I installed Intel's drivers and added a custom correct aspect res for using apps based on tiny icons. Well, I was using native res when I switched my SP on last night, with tiny desktop icons. I install the VM feature (to try and get an XP application running eventually), rebooted, and the icons were now large. Was I using native res, or my custom res? Check settings, it was native with element scaling. Then in the sidebar, Airplane mode was switched on! Only it wasn't, just the icon was lit, because I pressed it to swtich it off and that killed BT and Wifi.

    It's just a mess. Really crap experience versus iOS and Android. This was their chance to show they could compete, and they can't. As Grall says, I think the engine under the hood is just too old and decrepid, so we're left with another typical MS desktop OS, and not a whole new paradigm shift. TBH I've no idea how they can make Windows work as a tablet and mobile OS. Shoehorning a tablet-friendly front end isn't enough.
     
  7. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,165
    Likes Received:
    1,311
    I truly never got that problem with scaling like that
     
  8. Shifty Geezer

    Shifty Geezer uber-Troll!
    Moderator Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2004
    Messages:
    40,741
    Likes Received:
    11,222
    Location:
    Under my bridge
    That's part of the problem really - the experiences are very inconsistent. I suppose that's a bit true of Android when companies customise it, but I've always found my way around an Android device without too much bother.
     
    orangpelupa likes this.
  9. manux

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2002
    Messages:
    1,566
    Likes Received:
    400
    Location:
    Earth
    Windows 10 is a bit of a mixed bag for me. The part I use most works great but is not really made by microsoft.

    Geforce experience is rather decent for keeping the gpu driver up to date. Gefore experience also provides decent default settings to most games if one wants to take the easy route to gaming bliss.

    Similarly steam works great on buying, installing and updating games.

    Win10 itself seems to be not that great and is is quite dependent on third party solutions. Latest example being the mess that UWP is. At least updating mechanism is good so I don't remember when I had to reboot to install drivers. GPU driver goes in without reboot and most other updates get either done overnight or when I shut down my computer.

    Overall I'm quite happy about my win10 gaming machine. But I guess my happiness is based on good hw pick, nvidia geforce experience and steam.
     
  10. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,165
    Likes Received:
    1,311
    Err, driver update without the need of reboot has been there since Vista (or even older, I don't remember).

    Sure at Vista days most driver install or update will yell "restart please". But it still works fine without restarting.
     
  11. zed

    zed
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2005
    Messages:
    4,445
    Likes Received:
    632
    its the message box alert that pops up warning you 'making changes to PC'
    win & printscreen doesnt capture the desktop so I cant take a screenshot,I suppose I could use my camera on the phone, but trust me its very small 1mm text (like even smaller than text on my phone)

    I think part of the issues lies with me having a high DPI monitor 4k & normal DPI (1920x1200) both coming from the same PC, also my normal DPI, HDMI is the main monitor in the BIOS (I cant see how to change this) though the high DPI monitor is the main one in windows, perhaps that confuses the issue,
     
  12. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,165
    Likes Received:
    1,311
    Ah I see. I only use one hidpi screen and got no problem at all.
     
  13. zed

    zed
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2005
    Messages:
    4,445
    Likes Received:
    632
    On a related note, anyone done this before?
    Any idea how to easily change my bios so the #A monitor is the main one, i.e. it displays the bios etc when the PC starts up at the moment it goes #B -> and then windows starts here for a couple of seconds (blue screen with spinning wait symbol) and then it changes over to #A

    both connected to the same nvidia card
    #A 4k display port monitor (main)
    #B 1200p HDMI monitor (secondary)

    I would of thought a DP monitor would be ranked higher than a HDMI one (as you're more likely to plug in your better monitor to the more advanced standard) but apparently not in my case
     
  14. Grall

    Grall Invisible Member
    Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2002
    Messages:
    10,801
    Likes Received:
    2,172
    Location:
    La-la land
    Get two video cards (and if necessary, a mobo that supports it)... Plug the secondary monitor into the second video card (IE, the one not plugged into the PCIe slot closest to the CPU...)

    That's pretty much the only way I know of. Yes, it's not a very good solution, unless you love SLI gaming of course. ;)

    Anyway, does it really matter which monitor the BIOS appears on, or is it more a peace-of-mind kind of thing? Because, the BIOS only displays for a brief moment, and in your OS (windows, presumably) you can configure yourself which is the main monitor, of course...
     
  15. hoom

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2003
    Messages:
    2,948
    Likes Received:
    497
    My Radeon boots on both screens :wink4:
     
  16. Arwin

    Arwin Now Officially a Top 10 Poster
    Moderator Legend

    Joined:
    May 17, 2006
    Messages:
    17,682
    Likes Received:
    1,200
    Location:
    Maastricht, The Netherlands
    You can set Windows to auto-correct scaling for the size and dpi of your screens, so for instance if you drag a window from one to the other the physical size stays the same. It's a cool feature that I imagine should work well with a secondary high dpi display. Are you using that? It's in display settings, aspect correct scaling or something.

    As for comparing this versus Android and iOS, things are changing quickly now, but much depends on what you compare where. The less closed a platform, the more workarounds there are but also the more you need. It is perfectly possible to make a great scaling app in UWP now, but not many companies have. UWP is a stretch for games on PC now versus Steam, but it is better than anything targeting both iOS and OS/X right now I think if even possible
     
  17. Shifty Geezer

    Shifty Geezer uber-Troll!
    Moderator Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2004
    Messages:
    40,741
    Likes Received:
    11,222
    Location:
    Under my bridge
    Another truly crap Win 10 experience. I'm at someone's home and put in their Wifi details and connect to their Wifi. When I try to access the internet, Windows keeps using the free, open, BT Wifi from someone down the road, where you are taken to a password page. There's nothing I can do to ignore this Wifi option and use the one I'm actually connected to! No option in any setting I try to ignore and block this Wifi option. Ther may be an option somewhere, but how truly shit is that, that the Wifi connection you are connected to isn't the one Windows uses?? That wasted our morning.
     
  18. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,165
    Likes Received:
    1,311
    there is an option to "automatically connect to known friendly open wifi" that default to enabled. but i cant remember where that setting is :( sorry
     
    Grall likes this.
  19. Shifty Geezer

    Shifty Geezer uber-Troll!
    Moderator Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2004
    Messages:
    40,741
    Likes Received:
    11,222
    Location:
    Under my bridge
    But I was connected to another Wifi! Why ignore the connection I've requested to use in favour of an unknown, unconfirmed open Wifi access point?
     
  20. Silent_Buddha

    Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Messages:
    16,157
    Likes Received:
    5,095
    Unfortunately it's purely based on port priority on the video card itself. So what you'd want to find is a hacked firmware for the video card, assuming anyone has bothered to modify the firmware to change port priority. Usually it goes DVI (1, 2, etc.) -> HDMI -> (1,2, etc.) -> DP (1, 2, etc.) from what I've seen.

    Don't ask me why video card makers prioritize it that way, but that's just how it is in general.

    Regards,
    SB
     
Loading...
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...