VF5 for North America: Feb 20th '07; Launch title for Euro PS3 launch

TheChefO said:
So you'd be ok with a 640x480 game displayed with a 1080p sticker on the back?
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It would have no rez listed. Why should it? I have already set my system to 720P so the game shows up at that rez on my TV. Now whether or not the game looks good @720Pis a different subject.

Todd33 said:
But some new 360 games are true 1080P and as a consumer I'd like to know. Maybe it might affect my purchase decision if I own more than one console.

Provide all the info, don't treat consumers like idiots. If I buy a car I'd like to know the true horsepower, not some marketing version that hides information from me.
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But they don't tell you the true horsepower as there are many different ways of defining it (at the crank, at the wheels, etc).

TheChefO said:
Exactly. Or gas that's actually 90 octane but they sell it as 93 because "90 isn't official so we might scare/confuse consumers".

Or a dvd that is DD3.1 but that isn't official so they label it 5.1

A tv that displays a 1024x1024 picture but that isn't official so they label it 1080p. Actually come to think of it I think their standard is the tv must render equal to or MORE pixels than the standard res in order to use that res in marketing/ad material.
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Do you guys buy computer games? Cause the last time I checked none of them show the supported resolutions on the box. All I am saying is that when you have a scaler, and it is doing its job properly, why should it matter what the game is rendered at? If you don't have a scaler, then I can understand needing to know the supported resolutions.
 
inefficient said:
Well you could go online and read reviews for that kind of information.

I think your normal consumers only want to know if the game will work with their equipment or not. Any more information than that is going to confuse them.

Because where is it going to end? Should the box also have to say if it is a 30fps game or a 60fps game? Should it have to say it supports anti aliasing or not and what level it is?

Even if you had all that information on the box you still would not know if it sucked or not. You would want to read a review somewhere anyway or you would not be a well informed consumer regardless how many number & figures they print on the box.
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False

They want to know if it will take advantage of their equipment. All games will "work" on their equipment. Even if it is just 480p.

People buy HDTV's and HD consoles because the resolution IS important to them. If all games were 720p native then great - no need for a marker. 1080p native standard? no problem. Mark the box accordingly. Or even if games did vary and some were 1080p native and others were 720p native. Cool, a 1080p or 720p mark would suffice perfectly. But to state "1080p!" on games which fall short of the resolution is garbage.

Like I said even TV's makers follow the standard of falling back to the next closest standard resolution. (768 to 720p)

I've yet to see a tv advert state "1080p" when in fact it was 1080x960. So if this information were really that confusing why not follow this model of marketing?
 
inefficient said:
Well you could go online and read reviews for that kind of information.

I think your normal consumers only want to know if the game will work with their equipment or not. Any more information than that is going to confuse them.

Because where is it going to end? Should the box also have to say if it is a 30fps game or a 60fps game? Should it have to say it supports anti aliasing or not and what level it is?

Even if you had all that information on the box you still would not know if it sucked or not. You would want to read a review somewhere anyway or you would not be a well informed consumer regardless how many number & figures they print on the box.
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I agree

I think it's more important from the point of "will it work on my TV?"

all the rest is not important IMO because you can hardly tell any difference anyway.
 
Diamond.G said:
All I am saying is that when you have a scaler, and it is doing its job properly, why should it matter what the game is rendered at?
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Do you have an hdtv? If so you've probably watched hdtv programming. Have you tried switching between sdtv channels and hdtv channels? Does the resolution make a difference? Would this difference influence your watching preference? (same show, one in hd, the other sd)

If they want to get lazy/sleazy/("clear message") about it, just drop back to the next standard resolution.
 
Todd33 said:
If I want a 1080P to show off my 1080P TV, I don't want some low res mess upscaled to 1080P. I want true 1920x1080. They can list the native res and supported res, if the customer is that easily confused than they can buy a Wii.
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TheChefO said:
What would you think about a 640x480 game with a 1080p "sticker" on the back? How about 700x500? 800x600? 900x700?

Point is it's misleading. Where do we draw the line of acceptable rendered resolution? Would it not be misleading if pgr3 was repackaged to include a 1080p checkmark now that xb360 can scale to this resolution even though we know it renders about a quarter of that resolution natively?

Where do we draw the line?

It should be marked somewhere on the box what the actual rendered resolution is and apparently Japan realizes the issue and has addressed it accordingly.
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My point is simple. Does it support X resolution? Does it look good at X resolution? If you want to show off your new 1080p TV (I would want to do the same) I would want a game that looks good on it, regardless of it renders 1080p natively, using a broken hardware scaler, or with help from the Pixel Fairies (tm). I fail to see how being natively rendered automatically makes it better than being scaled when it both situations there’s plenty of room for the developer to screw something up that makes it look bad.
TheChefO said:
What would you think about a 640x480 game with a 1080p "sticker" on the back?
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Its called Tekken 5 Dark Resurrection! Where have you been?! :p

All joking aside, I understand your argument. But on a personal level, its seems so irrelevant to me. Am I going to take Call of Duty 3 back for my 360 because it doesn't actually render at 1280x720? That would be ridiculous. I would take it back if it looked bad, had horrible frame rate problems etc, not for something superficial like native rendering resolution, which I would never be able to actually verify anyway. In no way does a game's native rendering resolution effect me. It looking like crap does, but as far as I can tell that’s independent of what resolution(s) it nativly renders at and/or scales to.

TheChefO said:
Exactly. Or gas that's actually 90 octane but they sell it as 93 because "90 isn't official so we might scare/confuse consumers".

Or a dvd that is DD3.1 but that isn't official so they label it 5.1

A tv that displays a 1024x1024 picture but that isn't official so they label it 1080p. Actually come to think of it I think their standard is the tv must render equal to or MORE pixels than the standard res in order to use that res in marketing/ad material.
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Different situations. Does that DVD actually output 5.1 to the receiver? Is that a supported codec on the DVD? If not, then its not the same thing. A similar analogy would be listing 7.1 PCM lossless support, when in reality its just a remixed 5.1 soundtrack. It actually outputs 7.1 PCM, but the true source is only 5.1. The car is also completely different as well. A correct analogy would be gas labeled as 93, that's actually 90, but has the detonation resistance of 93 due to other factors.
 
The way it is listed on Playstation3 games is perfectly fine. It says "Output" resolution. Those who actually care will have the incentive to look it up, while those who don't care won't take it any further. Things only get slightly more ambiguous with the Xbox360 games and their "HDTV 720p/1080p" even on games that are not rendered at HDTV resolution. Comparing games with TVs is almost comical since they're not even close in terms of functionality, purpose, or level of investment. Not to mention the information plaque for TVs is practically the size of a PS3 game box.

I suggest though that this discussion on ethics be brought elsewhere for discussion because it is neither intrinsically related to the platform, or the game.
 
Todd33 said:
Provide all the info, don't treat consumers like idiots. If I buy a car I'd like to know the true horsepower, not some marketing version that hides information from me.
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Actually that's sort of what you get when you buy a car. A marketing number that is only loosly tied to performance. You get BHP which doesn't actually tell you how much HP your going to get at the wheels, or the cumaltive HP through the powerband, nor can it be easily verified. Hyundai even got sued a few years back for over rating their BHP on the new Tiburon's.
 
scooby_dooby said:
Actually that's sort of what you get when you buy a car. A marketing number that is only loosly tied to performance. You get BHP which doesn't actually tell you how much HP your going to get at the wheels, or the cumaltive HP through the powerband, nor can it be easily verified. Hyundai even got sued a few years back for over rating their BHP on the new Tiburon's.
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LOL, that will teach me to ever use cars for analogies :)
 
inefficient said:
Maybe that info is just old.

Otherwise another difference would be that the Japanese version requires at least 2700KB of HD space and that brochure says 2500KB. It wouldn't make sense for the US to get a different version of the game. The Japanese version has both Japanese and English language sets on the disc.

I think 1080i support is the important one on everyones minds for this game not 1080p. It would have been done to increase compatibility not to make the graphics look better.
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That info is NOT old...though. It's my US boxed Retail copy of the game, its NEWER than both the Japanese and Asian boxes. I took the picture last night, it lists 720p only.
 
http://www.gamebrink.com/playstation-3/2260-Virtua_Fighter_5-reviews-1.html

The graphics of Virtua Fighter 5 are just plain amazing. From the highly detailed polygon models, to their clothes, and the collision detection between all of them, its truly a treat for the eyes. Its pretty incredible that this is the first fighting game where I have yet to see body parts intersect. Not only that but Ive never seen hair or flapping clothing intersect either. Well I take that back, I have seen extra baggy pants intersect a bit, but thats an extreme case. When you execute any kind of move, the animations that occur between the two characters are just plain flawless. How long have we been waiting for cloth and hair animations that dont fall into the players bodies? Its finally here!

Whats also incredible about the visuals is that the backgrounds dont slouch a bit. There are actual 3D people in many of them along with flowing water and great looking landscapes. From a stormy Midwest town to a tropical waterfall arena, every stage looks near perfect. Add on the fact that the menus are animated and drawn in an incredibly cool fashion and youve got the best looking Playstation 3 game to date.
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8 more days for us NA guys, I'm really looking forward to it. Popped in my old VF4 the other day trying to get my "skills" (or lack of) ready for the new game. :)
 
Oh god I tried playing a bit last week and my game is a wreck. =D It'll be fun to get back in the swing of things.
 
Played it a lot this weekend. It meets my expectations for a VF game. Graphics are easily the best the PS3 has to offer right now. There is significant wow factor to them.

I really like the Dojo mode. It reduces the learning curve for a game like this. And it give you an efficient way to practice the new moves as well as polish old moves your rusty or haven't played the game in a while.

I've not played much VF since VF3. But after some time in the Dojo, I managed to play both Akira and Vanessa to 5th dan level. It's about my skill level right now I can beat anything bellow 3rd Dan pretty much every time. 4-5th is still scary for me - especially against certain characters I am weak against. Anything higher than 6th I know if I win it was just luck if I do pull it out. I did beat a 9 dan Aoi once by using really cheap tactics.

The quest mode is addicting because it's how you can get gold and items to dress your characters up with. But what I don't understand is why you get gold when you lose matches!(fixed) I don't get the logic behind that. I you keep beat challenge after challenge you barely get gold to buy new items. Every once and a while there is an item battle and you get something new. But the loser always gets gold.
 
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Can't wait! Today I did some research on VFDC for arcade sticks as it looks like I will finally be forced to retire my trusty grey and yellow Tekken 2 arcade stick.

The Sega stick looks fantastic, but it's currently out of stock at Play-Asia, and I need to have something on day one. The HRAP3 is in stock, but given the price, I'd rather go for the Sega stick instead. So I am currently looking at Hori's Fighting Stick 3 to hold me over at least until the VSHG is restocked. I'm familiar with their VF4 and Tekken sticks, so while I'm not expecting the highest-level of quality, it should be good enough to last until I can find a suitable replacement.

By the way, here's Myke's VF5 PS3 FAQ -- I haven't seen it posted here yet:

http://virtuafighter.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/149559/page/1#Post149559
 
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