Sony's NeoGeo Pocket's (PSP2/Vita) business/non technical ramifications talk

[patsu]

I feel that the workings of XMB is not so important. It can be mimicked by swiping and pointing easily. It's the minimalist art style that catches the eyes first, followed by the grouping of items.

They only need to keep the art style and icons. Grouping is more flexible with folders and a table/2D presentation instead of a list. Swiping desktops and (background) apps can be added without disturbing fullscreen presentation.

The Vita OS has similar set up.

However this is only a utility view. Other views such as the community, activities (Calendar of events ?), geolocation (Globe), etc. may be more interesting. Since these views are missing from XMB (or they are standalone apps), Sony can pretty much do whatever they want.

They can also call the new experience XMB 2.0. It's not really a problem. They can always think of new words for XMB.

 

[dobwal]

I personally love XMB. The biggest problem I have with XMB is not the interface itself but the way Sony designed the way you interact with it. It designed to be handle by a simple remote (left, right, down, up and select). Imagine if IOS was designed in such fashion, it would be a terrible interface. Or look at the Apple TV interface (designed to work with a remote) which works more like XMB than it does IOS.

If XMB were touch based it would be just as easily to use as IOS. In fact if it were touch based you could add more ribbons.

 

[patsu]

Yes, the touch screen actions are more direct and expressive. The Vita UI has these benefits but IMHO, it won't be sufficient.

I think they should start from the concept first and then work backwards. e.g., They can expand on XMB, Cross Media Bar/Browser, to demonstrate how Vita has grown beyond PS3.

1. Media has changed
PS3 media includes offline + online games, music, movie, TV and basic web. Vita adds a social media layer over these. The UI should show the benefits of this new social layer over the traditional media, even in "XMB". I like LiveArea. I think Near should not be an app. It should be a common service (like the current in-game XMB, or chatroom).

2. The world is now "crossed"
We will have more inter-PS3-PC-Vita-whatever games.
We will have cross media sharing between Blu-ray and digital copies, between local and cloud storage
We will have more user generated content and more sharing between users
We will have activities that cross between virtual and real world thanks to geolocation
Hence, the new Vita "XMB" UI should enable and simplify/optimize for these use cases.

If they just think at the level of actions and controls, then they may miss the whole point altogether.

In this sense, Sony expands its products on top of old ones. Traditionally, Sony has never done that. They usually redo old software and makes things fragmented as a result.


EDIT:
I saw the latest Sony ads (Long Live Play). Kinda like it because it's familiar and funny. Sony is still targeting old and young gamers, which is reasonable considering the strength of Playstation brand lies there.

I completely forgot that Scott Steinberg is the VP of Product Marketing. Would be great if Mr. Steinberg look deeper into "Play". The ads may appear shallow to the skeptics. What Sony needs here are ads that can touch the skeptics. Starting with the "Play" concept is the right direction, but I feel that the ads should tap into the "warm, fuzzy emotion" behind Play to connect with skeptics. It can be done ! ^_^

And yo, Mr. Steinberg. Please, please (!) convince your CFO to double-down in Playstation Home. Turn it into an Internet phenomenon instead of just a PS3 "vertical" virtual world like the defunct eWorld.

 

[Arwin]

Near isn't an App, but an SDK / services feature. I've seen it implemented in SmartAs.

 

[patsu]

Please elaborate !

[size=-2]I have seen marketing material that refers it as an "app", which is plain wrong.[/size]

 

[Arwin]

Please elaborate !

[size=-2]I have seen marketing material that refers it as an "app", which is plain wrong.[/size]

Well based on what I've seen I would assume that underlying the tech is a database that stores items of various sorts along with their physical location. This includes high-scores, in-game items, 'augmented reality' type graffiti, or whatever. You can then access this type of information through Sony's SDK.

SmartAs implemented this simply in its leaderboards, by for instance giving you the following leaderboard options:

- how much (or less) smarter you are than people in your direct vicinity? This one shows a map with the location of the scores posted.
- ... in the same city. Shows a map of the city.
- ... in the same country. Shows a map of the country
- ... in the same region. Shows a map of the region.
- ... in the world. Shows a map of the world.

That doesn't mean that Near isn't also an app, as I think it is a built-in augmented reality browser in which you can see items left by other people overlayed on the camera feed, etc.

 

[wco81]

Double down on Home?

Would even Sony say Home has been a success?

 

[specwarGP2]

The important bit isn't the swiping but the direct access to anywhere on the screen via touch. Thus an interface designed for touch should make good use of the whole screen instead of showing a single column and row of icons.

Windows phone 7 does that.

 

[patsu]

Well based on what I've seen I would assume that underlying the tech is a database that stores items of various sorts along with their physical location. This includes high-scores, in-game items, 'augmented reality' type graffiti, or whatever. You can then access this type of information through Sony's SDK.

SmartAs implemented this simply in its leaderboards, by for instance giving you the following leaderboard options:

- how much (or less) smarter you are than people in your direct vicinity? This one shows a map with the location of the scores posted.
- ... in the same city. Shows a map of the city.
- ... in the same country. Shows a map of the country
- ... in the same region. Shows a map of the region.
- ... in the world. Shows a map of the world.

That doesn't mean that Near isn't also an app, as I think it is a built-in augmented reality browser in which you can see items left by other people overlayed on the camera feed, etc.

Sounds like they have a GIS library for developers to implement geolocation applications ? But that is still a techie view. And it's similar to the current PSN API where developers decide everything. The Near app offers a location-based gifting service for games.

From a user perspective, I am more interested to see how geolocation can be incorporated into the basic OS. e.g., Vita has a party system, does it allow me to invite people in a region to join my party ? In SmartAs, can the game results be kept as part of the Vita user profile ? Can Near be run in parallel with a game to exchange items ? Why is gifting limited to a geolocation app ? Why can't I gift in a virtual group like GAF, to other far away GAF users ?

From a social media perspective, the personal interests and time element are also important. I think Vita needs a Calendar of Event for highlighting activities, not just a log of activities.

All these elements mean that the traditional PS3 XMB may not be sufficient anymore. Hence, Vita needs an extended XMB UI. The touchscreen interface is "only" an implementation detail. ^_^

 

[patsu]

Double down on Home?

Would even Sony say Home has been a success?

Playstation Home is interesting in the following ways:

* According to Jack Buser, PS Home is profitable with a 100-man operation despite the observation that many people hate the UI + avatar artstyle. ^_^

* Immediately after the PSN came online, PS Home is the only service that has increased traffic. The other PSN services were down. This is likely because people signed in to Home to check out the new E3 Home space at that time. It demonstrated the platform's ability to attract and hold crowd.

* Sony is expanding Home into a gaming platform. The concept is unique because you play the game inside the Home world. If the developers allow, other Home users can see your in-game actions and scores. And you can see other users and their speech bubbles. e.g., In the RedBull Air Race, I could see people on the ground, and what they were saying while I raced my plane in mid-air. In Home, social app and games are mixed together seamlessly.

* PS Home is based on Internet tech (LUA, XML, http server). I think it is being held back by the PS3 user base. PS3 users probably respond most positively to the service, given that we are all gamers. But with proper UI design and optimization, PS Home should work efficiently on PS3 and other devices.

All these elements add up to make an interesting gamer community service. If only they support 2D web, XMB and Vita UI for the Home services.

 

[Gradthrawn]

Lack of a docking station has continued to bother me, but I recently ran across an interesting little feature Sony is adding to some upcoming products like the S tablet and the Walkman Mobile Entertainment Player (working name). From what I can tell It's currently dubbed "Throw", much in the same vein as AirPlay and seems to allow for streaming of media and games to Bravias and other compatible DLNA devices (not sure what that includes, exactly). I could definitively see them including something like that in the PSV. No substitute for a hardware dock, IMO, but if executed properly might not be a bad solution.

EDIT

From this marketing video it just simply looks like normal DLNA streaming, except initiated and controlled by the DLNA server itself instead of the client (the server being the tablet, or PSV). I can't think of any reason why they wouldn't implement this feature at least for standard media. Although I question how useful it will be for games depending on the inherit lag of the system.

 

[patsu]

Lack of a docking station has continued to bother me,

Sony Japan asked Japanese gamers to suggest accessories for PS Vita:
http://www.shoptonews.net/2011/08/1...they-want-playstation-vita-peripherals-to-be/

Unsurprisingly, the add-on that is in the front running is the UMD Drive, but it is followed closely by a docking cradle with HDMI out, a compact QWERTY keyboard, and a grip battery unit.

but I recently ran across an interesting little feature Sony is adding to some upcoming products like the S tablet and the Walkman Mobile Entertainment Player (working name). From what I can tell It's currently dubbed "Throw", much in the same vein as AirPlay and seems to allow for streaming of media and games to Bravias and other compatible DLNA devices (not sure what that includes, exactly). I could definitively see them including something like that in the PSV. No substitute for a hardware dock, IMO, but if executed properly might not be a bad solution.

EDIT

From this marketing video it just simply looks like normal DLNA streaming, except initiated and controlled by the DLNA server itself instead of the client (the server being the tablet, or PSV). I can't think of any reason why they wouldn't implement this feature at least for standard media. Although I question how useful it will be for games depending on the inherit lag of the system.

Yeah, they demoed the "throwing" capability on PSP 1000 long long ago:
http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=671507&postcount=1

Hands down the best stand I saw at CES was Sony's. And in particular one pod showing their home network stuff.

They had a Set top box/HDD recorder with a DNLA compliant network server built in. Next to it they had a Vaio, also running a media server. And they had an LCD TV as a media player.

But they also had a PSP with some early new software which was being used as a media renderer. You could access both media servers and see all their content - combined into one list. They only had video working, but you could click on a video and it would start playing on the PSP. That was really good to see.

Then the guy on the stand asked me to flick the analog nub up. When I did this, the PSP 'threw' the video onto the TV. The TV immediately started playing back the video from where I'd left off. The PSP was then my remote control for play/pause etc. Flicking down on the nub pulled the video back down to my PSP.

It really was amazing to experience, and made a change from the other 'simple' server/client models going around.

I also asked the guy there if the PS3 would be DLNA compliant and he said yes. Of course, thats no confirmation, but Sony seem to be pushing hard this open home networking so I'm confident the PS3 will be a DLNA/UPnP media renderer.

That means it won't need MCE, just a UPnP server. Lots of software out there to do that, including being preloaded on NAS devices

Now it becomes touch-based.

I remember jeff_rigby mentioned a DLNA extension that works with DVR (proposed by Samsung). Not sure if that's going to be supported by Vita or Tablet S and P.

I am still waiting for their UltraViolet dream of throwing protected media around. -_-

I hope the "throwing" feature comes to PS Vita. Sony slides confirmed that Vita will support DLNA.



EDIT: On a related note, onQ123 speculated that Sony's new lenticular screen, glasses free 3D may be applicable for Vita, S and P:
http://onq-world.blogspot.com/2011/09/sony-adds-glasses-free-3d-to-laptops.html

 

[patsu]

Looks like Sony is extending XMB for other devices:
http://www.engadget.com/photos/sony-cedia-2011-presentation/#4427208

Also in the gallery is a shot of the new "activity based UI" for the receivers that looks at least something like the graphical upgrade the XMB has always needed. You'll also spy one more device,

If Vita also has "throwing" capability, then its UI may be similar but optimized for touch screen.

If you look at 0:10s of Gradthawn's YouTube link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWALOT4xbGE&feature=player_embedded#!

... you may see a similar menu on Tablet S. Unfortunately, the picture is too small to confirm.

 

[patsu]

Nope. Tablet S is sporting a completely different UI. The brief shot @ 0.10s above is just a series of Sony icons on standard Android "desktop".

@ 0.04s here:

They look like the standard Playstation applications. Some of them are confirmed for Vita. Some also found on PS3:
Music Player, Video Player, Gallery, Music Unlimited, Video Unlimited, Reader, Remote Centre, Select App (?), Social Feed (something).

These icons follow the standard XMB art style.

Vita demo videos use a completely different set of icons for these apps though (Ha ha).

 

[patsu]

Sony To Hold Pre-TGS Press Conference As Well:
http://www.siliconera.com/2011/09/08/sony-to-hold-pre-tgs-press-conference-as-well/

Like Nintendo, Sony will hold a pre-Tokyo Game Show press conference in Japan. Nintendo’s 3DS event takes place on September 13th, and Sony’s follows a day later on the 14th.

You’ll be able to watch the conference via live streaming over the net...

Sony also hosts the one of the TGS keynotes (“All About PlayStation Vita.”). Looks like Sony and Nintendo are going at it again. ^_^

 

[patsu]

English livestream for Sony's press conference (probably Vita related to counter Nintendo's game announcements ?):
http://tgs.playstation.jp/info/conference_en/

I only caught the last few minutes of Nintendo's conference yesterday. It was in Japanese, so I couldn't do much anyway. >8^/

 

[patsu]

Ok, I'm late and can't get into the English livestream site anymore (Congested).

Here's the Japanese live stream:
http://live.nicovideo.jp/watch/lv63571616?ref=ser

EDIT: I'm watching it on my PS3 web browser now. ^_^
[size=-2]Can't make heads or tails of the presentation[/size]

 

[Brad Grenz]

Final Fantasy X, ZOE HD and MGS HD all confirmed for Vita. Ultimate Marvel vs Capcom also announced.

 

[patsu]

Mr. Grenz, do you know Japanese ?

What did we just see ? There is a short demo on some sort of "Friends Network" where Toro watch 2 guys exchange business cards.

 

[Brad Grenz]

No Japanese here. Just watched the stream and followed along with some twitter folks who do. I wonder if the Friends Network is some kind of street-pass type thing.

On the plus side, I liked what they showed of the UI. I really dig the tear from the corner thing to unlock the screen and close apps. The multitasking looked good, even if the guy doing the demo appeared to be struggling with sweaty fingers.