Old Discussion Thread for all 3 motion controllers

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I have heard good things about High Velocity Bowling from several people, but they never explain why. What's special about it ?

The Brunswick video could have shown us different in-game bowling moves and compare it with real bowling.

EDIT: I think Sony may have gotten things backwards a little. At this "early" stage (defining new experience/platform), they should focus on new concepts instead of optimization of existing known gameplay (e.g., refine bowling and table tennis games with more precision). The optimization can always come later. People can't tell the difference by reading articles and watching promo videos.

As a result, Sony needs to rely on individual's hands-on to sell Move (Too slow !). OTOH, we can usually identify a new game mechanics with a quick glance. It helps to generate excitement too. ^_^

Hopefully, they have something special up their sleeves. "New" games can require precision too.
 
I haven't read much in regards to the HVB but I assume they are just going to update the current version for Move support or is it a whole new version? I'm not sure what more Move can do for that game that the sixaxis can't? The only thing lacking in the current version is you use an analog button to control spin. I'm pretty sure the sixaxis could detect the wrist motion enough to implement that type of control into the game?

With that said, HVB is hands down the biggest party game we have for the PS3. Made a ton of converts of whom only played Wii Bowling.
 
Ah, HVB is also a motion controlled bowling game as well.

The SIXAXIS has a 1-axis gyro and a 3-axes accelerometer. The Move motion controller has a 3 axes gyro and a 3 axes accelerometer. The latter also has a pressure sensitive trigger for fine-tuning to make up for the lack of analog stick tweaks. (Assuming) all else being equal, the Brunswick bowling game should be more precise and expressive. But we'll never know without playing it. The developer can certainly mess up their programming along the way, so it's not a guaranteed win either.

The Move controller should also be more comfortable to hold/use.
 
If you're no good at bowling, you probably coulnd't tell the difference either. Or perhaps worse still, you will, in that all your shots which were great in the lesser bowling games and made you feel really good become gutter-balls in this version! :p

Without the momentum of the heavy ball to contend with, it's a far cry from bowling, and I imagine strikes far, far easier to get.
 
That's true ! I think they may take the same approach as the Table Tennis guys: Have separate modes for experts and casuals.

The experts should be able to adjust for the weight difference better than newbies. Focus tests and measurements against real-world bowling would be interesting.
 
Don't know where to file this:
http://twitchfilm.net/news/2010/04/...es-marchands-techno-thriller-black-heaven.php

It's a triller about a virtual world. The premise sounds interesting. Would be great as a test platform for augmented reality (and natural interface) in movies.

Gilles Marchand's techno thriller Black Heaven is one fans of high end science fiction have been waiting for for quite a while. Set partially in a virtual world called Black Hole, the film features extensive CG animation from the same company responsible for recent animated feature Renaissance, the production of which has kept the film in post production for well over a year.
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Dr. Mark talks about his view on PS Move:
http://worldwideintertubes.com/2010...playstation-move-with-sonys-dr-richard-marks/

Tell me about the physical design of the Move controller.

Well it’s different from the Wii, which used a remote control paradigm. With the Move, it’ll be more like you’re holding a physical object that has a handle. It’s designed so that it tapers in the middle then flares back out at the base, kind of like an axe handle. That creates an ergonomic advantage as well, because a smaller hand will naturally grip it at the thinner point while a larger hand will grip it further down, and in both cases that positions the thumb right above the button.

There’s also an analog button on the back that’s called the “T-button” and is used in some games like a trigger, but I prefer to think of it as a squeezer. It has a fairly long throw so you can control something really well just by squeezing, and that makes it feel very natural for grabbing and manipulating objects.

Do you think that a device like the Move has applicability beyond gaming?

Definitely. One of our favorite uses for the Move besides gaming is creating user-generated content. Just as a creation tool, it provides a lot more capability than anything we ever had before. We actually wrote a driver to send the data from the PS3 to a PC so our artists could use it in Maya, which is an animation suite they use to design games. Often in Maya you have to move things around and look at them from different angles and distances, which normally takes expert knowledge to understand the indirect controls. Using the Move, it’s amazing how fast you can operate it. People are surprisingly good at positioning two controllers relative to one another. You can carve, extrude, lathe, grab points in a wire mesh — it all feels very natural.
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Awesome only if Sony persue user generated content in a big way, as opposed to isolated, one-off efforts.

I don't quite agree with this though:

What were some of the lessons you learned from your experience developing the EyeToy?

Something that was lost with EyeToy was a sense of accuracy. Once in a while you want that. The EyeToy could only register broad, coarse body movements, and its reliability would vary with the lighting conditions in the room. So the Move has a glowing sphere on the end of it, which the camera can track to within a tenth of a pixel. The PS3 system knows exactly where the PlayStation Move controller is in the room with great accuracy.

One of the mantras of the EyeToy was that there were no buttons. We could have had people using the PlayStation 2 controllers with the games, but instead we chose to just rely upon the person’s physical movement in the room. I think that was a good discipline for us to work within and resulted in some really unique game experiences, but we came to realize that it went too far. It was very difficult to do things like navigating menus. You could only do that by waving your hands repeatedly over menu items to select them, then wave at another message to confirm that was really what you wanted to select. And while it was neat that you could work that way, it wasn’t a great interface. A button is very fast, very reliable, and very abstract — you can map it to anything you want.
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There are occasions where waving a hand is more entertaining than having great precision. Besides, it's a tech limitation. Natal should be able to do more accurate gestures more effortlessly.
 
Sports Champion interview:
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/playstation-move-sports-champions-interview

Eurogamer: How would you describe Sports Champions?

Olivier Banal: It's a sports simulation. It replicates real-life sports as well as not-so-real-life sports, like gladiator duels. You act out the sport just as you would do in real-life, and the Move controller tracks your motions. So throwing a frisbee, swinging a bat, throwing a ball, shooting arrows... Things like that.
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[size=-2][They need a better name !][/size]

Eurogamer: How do you achieve that? I've played a lot of Wii games, a lot of what I would call mini-game compilations. Often I've found the mini-games are either too challenging for, say, my mum to play, or they're too simple and just involve waggling, which is no fun for anyone. How do you strike a balance?

Olivier Banal: Replicating a real-life discipline with a very accurate motion controller is a bit of a double-edged sword. It's very good at replicating what you're doing, regardless of whether you're doing it right or wrong.

That's where the different difficulty levels come in. The easier levels will fine-tune what you're doing - for example, in table tennis, to make sure you hit the ball back over the net and on the table. At the other end of the spectrum, you get more control over the ball but you're also more likely to hit the net or hit it wide.

You can adapt the difficulty levels to individual players. So if you're playing table tennis with your mum, you can set the level to easy for her and normal for you, and play against each other like that.


Eurogamer: Table tennis makes a good case in point, as there are lots of table tennis games already out there for the Wii. I'm not sure the motion control aspect makes them worth playing, though - I'd always rather play the Xbox 360 version of Rockstar Table Tennis, for example...

Olivier Banal: Move offers the most accurate simulation you can get. With the combination of the gyrometer, the accelerometer and the light tracking, you basically have motion tracking in a 3D environment. If you turn the bat to a certain angle then the physics engine identifies that, and adapts the trajectory of the ball like in accordance with the physics. So you can put in as much spin as you want and replicate what you'd do in real life.

The challenge for the team right now is to make sure that players get into the game and aren't frustrated after five minutes spent missing the ball. Once they're used to that you can move on to a more realistic setting, one which allows players to have more control and get closer to a realistic experience. That's something I believe we can achieve with Move.

...
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The interview looks rather in-depth. No time to get down to it yet. Will come back later. ^_^
 
Rare is going to talk about Natal in a July Develop Conference keynote:
http://www.develop-conference.com/developconference2010/keynotes_2010.html

The Future IS Controller-Free Games and Entertainment

The growth of physical based gaming has introduced an entirely new audience to our industry and like it or not, it's here to stay. As the technology improves, diversifies and becomes ever more complex designing compelling experiences is a challenge but this is something we should embrace as developers and not fear. But where do we go from here?

In this session George - Creative Director at Rare, will talk candidly about how Rare has created one of the premier launch titles for "Project Natal" and the challenges faced regarding the new design philosophy at the studio, "everything you've learnt over the last 25 years - throw it away!" We also take a brief look at Rare's last foray into the physical play space from yesteryear. We outline our vision for the future of physical based gaming and why as an industry we have only just scratched the surface of the vast array of possibilities now available to us, what this means for developers and for future generations of gamers alike.
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Dr. Marks will keynote the "Games for Health Conference" in May:
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2010/04/29/playstation-move-the-mind-body-experience/

The title of my talk is “The Mind-Body Experience of PlayStation Move – Relationships between Gaming, Play, Exercise, and More.” I plan to discuss the development of PlayStation Move, with a focus on what I call “somatic gratification” (I didn’t coin the term, but I think I’m the first to apply it to video games). In short, I’ll be talking about how the physicality of an interface can connect the body and the mind to really enhance an experience. Sometimes, the interface is only a means to an end, but often, the interface becomes an integral part of the experience. I’ll be analyzing the similarities and differences this has for gaming, for play, and for exercise, and why different interface choices may be appropriate for each domain.

I’ll also be talking about the design of PlayStation Move, highlighting why many of the design choices are the way they are. Many of the seemingly arbitrary stylistic choices are not cosmetic; they are actually functionally and ergonomically important. Finally, I’ll share my thoughts about the subtle yet profound differences between a true position-sensing device vs. a motion-sensing device, and describe some of the applications that are enabled as a result of having position information.
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Move Party Interview:
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2010/04/30/playstation-move-developer-diary-move-party/
(Video inside)

We’ve been showing the game behind closed doors and conducting lots of user testing. We’ve been really impressed at how quickly people of all ages are captivated by the game as soon as they pick up the PlayStation Move motion controller. The experience is extremely intuitive. There are no special gestures to learn like in some motion control games, you simply interact with the objects as you would in real life. It’s super easy and fun to just pick up the controller and start playing. Move Party is really only possible due to the amazing accuracy, freedom and precision that the PlayStation Move delivers. Cut hair, bash moles, bounce a ball, paint a picture, fly a helicopter, zap some robots and much more.
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Natal hands-on with videos:
http://laist.com/2010/04/30/project_natal_first_drunken_impress.php

The second my game started, my earlier misgivings were - temporarily - dispelled. Shockingly, it's actually pretty cool. The motion sensor is surprisingly sensitive, equally response regardless of user height, and able to detect whether 1, or two people are standing in front of the TV. Better still, while it didn't provide the ability to make your onscreen avatar flip the bird, it was able to virtually simulate how bad I am break-dancing.
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The demo has some hiccups because the sensitivity is not well-tuned. Other than that, the report is largely positive and enthusiastic, if a wee-bit cautious.
 
Nintendo released black wii bundle today:
Includes wii sports, wii sports resort and motion plus, still at $199.

14415_wii_black.jpg


I think this will put the price pressure on MS and Sony, I still predict natal 360 arcade for $199, it cannot be more than the wii to steal its market. PS3 unfortunately cannot go much lower, so the best case I see there is $299 with move included.
 
Is that new for the U.S.? I've seen this package in our mediamarkt for quite a while already, maybe even since the Holidays.
 
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