Nice GOW/MGS4 Compare

[NAP]

Wow voice of reason. Nice to see it here again.:smile:

E so pure Italiano - I'm italian too

 

[hey69]

I was going to say something inappropriate about Hideo and "in-game assets", but never mind.

londonboy is that you?

 

[Nightz]

GOW has the trademark super bumpy "zbrush" look all over it. They both look comparable, this gen more than others art direction will be the deciding factor.

 

[Tap In]

I think that we can't compare two different engines, GOW engine and MGS4 engine are too different (probably MGS4 engine is MGS3 engine), moreover GOW is near to be complete on Xbox360 final devkit, MGS4 is developed on PS3 alphakit, wtih 256MB of RAM XDR, without RSX and FLEX I/O, and with a Cell@2,4GHz against the final Cell@3.2GHz. For a better comparision we should compare the first PS3 game based on UE3.0 with GOW

agree we should wait but just a point of contention;

Gears of War is not near completion, it is not to be released until at least March of 2006.

6 mos away.

 

[Qroach]

6 months for a 3+ year project IS near completion.

 

[scooby_dooby]

The game has only spent 2 weeks on final dev kits.

Over the next 6 months I'm sure they will push the visuals as far as they can on the final hardware, before now all they've had was a guesstimate about the final power.

 

[Laa-Yosh]

GOW has the trademark super bumpy "zbrush" look all over it. They both look comparable, this gen more than others art direction will be the deciding factor.

I wouldn't go that far, IMHO the modeling work is very good. The 'super bumpy Zbrush look' is far worse than this...

 

[Atsim]

I point you guys to the new GOW pictures thread. If this is cutscene then it offers a fair example of cutscene vs cutscene..

If it isn't cutscene then it's in game, but either way it's real time.

 

[Laa-Yosh]

moustache = the same amount of polys as 1 character model in MGS3
(probably) hair = 60,000 vertex primitives

Whatever they've said, it's still stupid to push all that geometry into a mustache and hair if the rest of the model isn't smooth enough, IMHO.

 

[Laa-Yosh]

Nope ,there is shared algorithmics in these technics.You are right ,that paper doesn't explain what and how.Still ,There is strong corelation ,and the HDR approach is way better quality wise.
Btw ,mgs has MB since MGS1 and DOF since Mgs2 .

Let's get through it again, OK?

This is what you've said:

DOF and MB, are both a given with HDR lighting.

I don't think it's true, as the currently used forms of both depth of field and motion blur are image processing 2D effects, bluring the image based on some data provided by the 3D renderer (like motion vectors for MB). There's absolutely nothing to do with HDR in this. An engine can have HDR implemented and it still wouldn't support either of these; yet you can code both into an engine without HDR support. MGS2's support of these effects actually supports this to an extent, and the HDR-supporting games' lack of both is a proof to the rest (see Far Cry and HL2).

The documentation that you've linked to, however, does not support your claim. So once again, why do you think that DOF is a given with HDR lighting, how can the two have to do anything with each other?

 

[LunchBox]

better pic to compare?

 

[NAP]

I prefer Metal Gear, the weapon looks like better then GOW picture, moreover Kojima style is inimitable.

 

[_phil_]

Let's get through it again, OK?

This is what you've said:

DOF and MB, are both a given with HDR lighting.

I don't think it's true, as the currently used forms of both depth of field and motion blur are image processing 2D effects, bluring the image based on some data provided by the 3D renderer (like motion vectors for MB). There's absolutely nothing to do with HDR in this. An engine can have HDR implemented and it still wouldn't support either of these; yet you can code both into an engine without HDR support. MGS2's support of these effects actually supports this to an extent, and the HDR-supporting games' lack of both is a proof to the rest (see Far Cry and HL2).

The documentation that you've linked to, however, does not support your claim. So once again, why do you think that DOF is a given with HDR lighting, how can the two have to do anything with each other?

to make it short :
HDR is mainly a Blur and precision blending thing (high color precision blending),Dof is a blur thing ,MB is a blur thing ,...
once you have a working HDR blend ,DOf ,MB are trivial
Precision makes for quality.

 

[Inane_Dork]

HDR is mainly a Blur and precision blending thing

There's nothing about HDR that blurs anything. HDR just allows for a much greater range of light intensities to be displayed on the screen. Bloom, which can sit on top of HDR, can blur the screen.

 

[_phil_]

When you tonemap your hdr data You have blurs involved everytime you can see light source..

 

[Qroach]

_phil_ I get the impression from what you're saying, that you don't understand how HDR lighting works. I've got no idea where you are getting it has anything to do with depth of field and motion blur. Those are post processed effects (the last effects added to a scene after it has been rendered)

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I can appreciate MoBlur and DOF don't look right without HDR as you don't get bright areas overpowering. But blurring by distance or motion doesn't need HDR. You can get photoshop plugins to apply these sorts of effects to 24 bit images.

 

[Phil]

I think _phil_ was replying to this sentence of Laa-Yosh's post

currently it seems that MGS has DOF, GOW has DOF and MB

when he said that MGS (as far as he is concerned) uses HDR which basically enable DOF and MB for the reasons he named later. He didn't say it needs HDR.

 

[_phil_]

Tkz phil,
I didn't want to bring up the thread,but i know well what is HDR ,i was just pointing out that once your HDR +tonemaaping is up and running, quality DOF and MB (and other things too) benefits the blur routines and hight precision blending .

 

[Qroach]

Both Phils, HDR lighting has nothing to do with depth of field and/or motion blur. Again you're not making any sense in what you are trying to say. HDR lighting is a completly seprate un related fewature from the other two, I don't see why you think they are connected or related.