Next Generation Hardware Speculation with a Technical Spin [post E3 2019, pre GDC 2020] [XBSX, PS5]

[Love_In_Rio]

This doesn't line up with the info i have for either next gen consoles.

PS5 has 3.2ghz CPU. GPU is 1.8ghz 40CUs. 2.0ghz devkit.
Scarlet has a 320-bit bus 16GB of GDDR6, 560GB/s bandwidth.

IMO the reality, even more after seing the disastrous efficiency of Navi 14, is that the only way they can go with such a gpu is with a full RDNA2 (nothing about half navi half next architecture) if it is really the "Nvidia killer" ,as seems to be called internally, and really supposes a jump in efficiency for AMD.

 

[PSman1700]

IMO the reality, even more after seing the disastrous efficiency of Navi 14, is that the only way they can go with such a gpu is with a full RDNA2 (nothing about half navi half next architecture) if it is really the "Nvidia killer" ,as seems to be called internally, and really supposes a jump in efficiency for AMD.

He doesn't know the specs either.

 

[Love_In_Rio]

He doesn't know the specs either.

Yes, but after seing the RX 5500 at 150 watts cant see even a console at 9 tflops with the current RDNA1.If they get ray tracing from next arch, if it really is more efficient they will get the full navi 12 or whatever is called, even the node at 7nm+.

 

[PSman1700]

Yes, but after seing the RX 5500 at 150 watts cant see even a console at 9 tflops with the current RDNA1.If they get ray tracing from next arch, if it really is more efficient they will get the full navi 12 or whatever is called, even the node at 7nm+.

Aren't the specs/architecture already pinned down? RDNA2 isn't even available yet. Same for Zen3.

 

[Love_In_Rio]

Aren't the specs/architecture already pinned down? RDNA2 isn't even available yet. Same for Zen3.

Neither was R500 when X360 launched(in fact R500 never reached the market). Or Vega when PS4 Pro launched with rapid packed math.If they have ray tracing that comes with AMD next arch evolution they can get the whole chip, cant see why not. It will probably launch in Q1-Q2 of next year to fight Ampere. The timing is right to have been planned for next consoles.
As for Zen 3 the rumors say it will be a SMT beast (4 threads per core?), not very suitable for console needs.

 

[PSman1700]

PS4 Pro launched with rapid packed math.If they have ray tracing that comes with AMD next arch evolution they can get the whole chip, cant see why not. It will probably launch in Q1-Q2 of next year to fight Ampere. The timing is right to have been planned for next consoles.

True, think we can expect a mid-end comparable GPU, perhaps 2070 (non super) range. We can hope atleast as that would be quite a beast for a compact console.

 

[Proelite]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1181515241814806528

I was off by 20mm2 from my estimate of 370mm2 for Scarlett die size.

It could be possible that Scarlett is 360mm2, and 350mm2 is an approximation.

 

[Love_In_Rio]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1181515241814806528

I was off by 20mm2 from my estimate of 370mm2 for Scarlett die size.

It could be possible that Scarlett is 360mm2, and 350mm2 is an approximation.

That has no sense unless Oberon is a discrete GPU.

 

[Proelite]

That has no sense unless Oberon is a discrete GPU.

5700 with 40CUs is 250mm. Add 8 core Zen with 8MB L3 instead of 32MB, that brings you to around ~290mm. 4 more CUs (disabled) is ~300mm.

300mm2 can also be an approximation. i.e. 316mm2.

 

[snc]

That has no sense unless Oberon is a discrete GPU.

yep, discrete 300mm2 gpu for ps5, thats make sense ;d

 

[McHuj]

That has no sense unless Oberon is a discrete GPU.

Or only a 7TF GPU

 

[McHuj]

384bit gddr6 800GB/s my ass Do some homework before trolling.

what’s the math?

16 Gbs memory on a 384-bit bus would be 768 GB/s. GDDR6 goes up to 18 Gbs that would allow for 864 GB/s, the ~800 GB/s is in that range.

 

[McHuj]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1181515241814806528

I was off by 20mm2 from my estimate of 370mm2 for Scarlett die size.

It could be possible that Scarlett is 360mm2, and 350mm2 is an approximation.

if this is correct, what did MS spend the extra silicon area on? RT hardware? GPU shaders? CPU cores? Or maybe just additional cache?

 

[snc]

what’s the math?

16 Gbs memory on a 384-bit bus would be 768 GB/s. GDDR6 goes up to 18 Gbs that would allow for 864 GB/s, the ~800 GB/s is in that range.

384bit with >16gbps make no sense (very expensive, also 384bit with ggdr6 14gbps - 672GB/s would be impressive bandwidth for console, really doubt we will have such a big number not to mention 800GB/s)

 

[Deleted member 13524]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1181515241814806528

Why is this odd chinese translation being taken at face value as true information?

Or rather, why is that in this thread and not in the baseless rumors thread?

if this is correct, what did MS spend the extra silicon area on? RT hardware? GPU shaders? CPU cores? Or maybe just additional cache?

Could be GDDR6 vs. HBM.

Or special hardware for always-on Kinect 3.

 

[dobwal]

i'm fairly confident they'll be the same. I'd be shocked if we saw a dramatic difference in performance, because that would lead to a dramatic difference in price.

just curious, but if RT an enabler of producing better visual quality. What is the concern?

I don’t expect a dramatic difference but I expect more than we have now.

Using 12nm while accommodating 14TFs of compute is the not the best circumstance to cram in your most ideal design for RT.

And given the console market isn’t the PC market where hardware iterates at a faster pace and new iterations of hardware have to perform better with the current crop of games. Console designs don’t have to deal with the same pressures of the PC market. Also, on the contrary, consoles don’t iterate quick enough to allow designs to be implemented over several generations of hardware.

Consoles have to put their best foot forward given their life span. And given their life span, consoles have a much easier time outperforming last gen hardware.

The next Xbox and PS5 doesn’t have to out perform a 16nm 1080TI or Titan with a 12 nm design. At most next gen consoles at 7nm have to beat out the 16nm based X/Pro. On top of that, next gen don’t have to accommodate tensor like cores which most RT based games don’t readily use.

Plus when next gen consoles arrive, devs will not have been working with software based RT solutions waiting for RT accelerated hardware just months before the release of their titles. Devs will have had access to hardware accelerated RT for a number of years with a finer understanding of using RT in a real-time environment.

 

[iroboto]

if this is correct, what did MS spend the extra silicon area on? RT hardware? GPU shaders? CPU cores? Or maybe just additional cache?

AI/ML Tensorcores.
Trollingly; esram

I guess there could be a lot of different avenues for difference here.

 

[Mskx]

if this is correct, what did MS spend the extra silicon area on? RT hardware? GPU shaders? CPU cores? Or maybe just additional cache?

Well, i did notice that they did not specify the number of CPU cores at E3...

 

[dobwal]

Maybe the PS5 is 7nm+ while the next Xbox is 7nm. Who knows? Doesn’t necessarily mean the Xbox is automatically more powerful.

Plus, I believe it when I see it. The problem with next gen rumors is that any truths are hidden in a pile of shit (falsehood).

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Really curious about the SDK design! Hope we get to hear about that some day.

It's just plain weird. There is one possible practical use of this design; if the grates on the inside of the V are vents, then the device is potentially venting heat in more directions than traditional box designs which tend to only vent at the rear and/or sides - which can be compromised in closed spaces. Building space, no matter how weird-looking, into the form-factor design, mitigates some of this.