News & Rumors: Xbox One (codename Durango)

[iroboto]

@shredenvain It may not be so bad as you think. See how 2015/2016 plays out. There are going to be pros and cons to the merger. You might see certain type of games being ported to X1 that may traditionally only be found on PC as well [Pillars of Eternity, Wasteland 2]. So I imagine there is going to be a lot more back and forth. For MS it's about Xbox the platform, not necessarily Xbox the console. If Xbox One the console dies out drastically as a result of this transition, I'm sure there are ways to bolster the console until it finds it's footing in the newly merged environment. I think you're feeling the effects of a large scale change in the way consoles are represented, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.

Right now you're going to see a merge happen, but it's still up to the game developers and publishers to let cross buy and cross play to happen. So that's definitely something to take note of, I don't think things will drastically cut off, eventually choices will cannibalize their own products. This is something Apple is good at doing - they know it's going to happen, so might as well do it first.

 

[Scott_Arm]

Windows 10 is coming to Xbox One along with Universal Apps. What kind of info are you looking for?

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

You say if this merger would have happened 2 years ago you wouldn't have gotten a Xbox One. If this merger does happen this is the way a lot of people will feel.

And I still don't see how that is a bad thing. I also don't think "a lot" of people are in the same position as I am. Already having an HTPC hooked up to my TV, already having the logitech mini remote keyboard to control it, a remote control that controls the TV and entertainment system as well as XBMC, etc. It's very easy for me to upgrade the HTPC to make it gaming capable and add a kinect sensor and a Xbox Controller and voila, no need for me to purchase an additional black box to add to the entertainment center. But I highly doubt that the % of console owners that are in a similar situation is anywhere above 5%.

Like I stated earlier, this "merger" hasn't been announced by anyone. As of right now it seems the Xbox One will keep some of it's major exclusives. After watching Phil's session at GDC it seems the point of all this is to make it easier for Devs to get their software on both the Xbox One and Windows 10 devices. They aren't even requiring a subscription to Xbox Live for multiplayer on windows 10 games. They are leaving it up to the devs and publishers.

While MS has clearly stated its up to the developers and publishers to support both crossplay and crossbuy, it is going to be a tad bit difficult for them to encourage that if they don't lead the way with their own exclusives, isn't it? If MS keeps to what it said at GDC, there's no reason to think that Xbox Exclusives won't be the first titles that are crossbuy:

Microsoft will be calling the service Windows and Xbox Live. ”The games you own are the games you own,” he said per PCgamesN. “Play them on any device you own. We want people to play games wherever they are.”

How can you reconcile that quote with your belief that Xb1 will "keep some of its major exclusives"?

As far as not requiring a subscription to Live for PC multiplayer, no.. they couldn't possibly get away with that yet. But I'm willing to bet that if you want to use crossplay, you're going to need a Live subscription. I'm also willing to bet (a little bit less) that those Xbox exclusives that will be made available on the PC will also require a Live subscription for multiplayer, even on the PC.

So yes, I fully expect Halo 5 to be crossbuy. I also expect that if you buy Halo 5 for the PC, you'll still need a Live subscription in order to play multiplayer. Even if it isn't set up for crossplay.

There's absolutely no point in giving up the console exclusivity otherwise. (I think we agree here). Where we disagree is that I don't see that as a bad thing, I see it as a positive.

You want to play Halo 5 on your PC? Fine. Buy it. Play on Xb1 or your PC. Either way, you're buying the game and if you want to play multiplayer, you're going to need a Live subscription to do so. MS makes money and making money is what keeps Live a viable division which ensures it continues to exist, which is all I care about.

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

. Most other folk really don't care and just want something to play games on. For people who only care about the software, XB1 games on PC is a Good Thing as it provides more options - cheap console for the entry level gamer, PC for core gamers or those already half-way there... <snip> ...That's just progress though. You may lament the change, but it's going to happen, one way or another. At some point in the future we likely won't have consoles but streamed games from servers. Just like we lost the variety of Home Computers from the 80s and settled on 2(.5) OSes for all computers. Can't really fight this one.

Exactly. Personally, if it was announced tomorrow that MS sold it's Xbox division to Sony and PSN became Live and I could use my Kinect and Xbox controller on the PS4 (or PS5, whatever), I'd be perfectly fine with that. I don't care whose name is on the black box that sits under my TV. I struggle to understand those people that do.

 

[AzBat]

If Microsoft is saying you don't need Gold for multiplayer on the PC & then turn around & require it anyway, then they deserve all the backlash they will get. I don't see it happening though. They already learned their lesson with Games for Windows Live.
Tommy McClain

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

If Microsoft is saying you don't need Gold for multiplayer on the PC & then turn around & require it anyway, then they deserve all the backlash they will get. I don't see it happening though. They already learned their lesson with Games for Windows Live.
Tommy McClain

Well, that's why I said I'd bet less. And, I'm only talking about MS exclusives, such as Haloz. However, crossplay is something else and I fully expect that to require Gold.

 

[AlNom]

However, crossplay is something else and I fully expect that to require Gold.

That's pretty much how GFWL was for Shadowrun 2007.

 

[shredenvain]

There is no merger. Its a hypothetical situation that hasn't even been announced by anyone. Also I have many boxes with many names sitting under my television just so you people know.

 

[AzBat]

Well, that's why I said I'd bet less. And, I'm only talking about MS exclusives, such as Haloz. However, crossplay is something else and I fully expect that to require Gold.

I bet zero. No way, no how, they charge for multiplayer on PC after what they've said now. That's including crossplay. And that's including every title, including first party exclusives like Halo 5. Now, I think they might be setting up people for disappointment when people buy a Xbox One game & then expect to play said game on Windows 10 device without a Gold subscription. That's something I think they will still require since the game is still physically playing on the Xbox One, but just being streamed to Win10 devices. I suspect a PR nightmare coming for that.

Tommy McClain

 

[shredenvain]

I think it is so funny that so many of you have jumped to the conclusion that Microsoft announced that all Xbox exclusives are coming to Windows 10 at GDC. Show me a news story reporting on this "merger" or show me a video snipet from Phil's session at GDC where he says this is happening. You are all jumping to a huge conclusion with absolutely no proof whatsoever.

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

There is no merger. Its a hypothetical situation that hasn't even been announced by anyone. Also I have many boxes with many names sitting under my television just so you people know.

Uh.. What? Now I'm really confused.

How do you take Spencer's comments about buying the game once and playing it on Xbox or Windows PC to mean anything other than they want all games available on all of their platforms?

Clearly, they can't force third parties to do this. All they can do is provide them with the toolkit so that they are able to do so, if they want. But what they can do, certainly, is make sure that the games that they (MS) publish do adhere to that philosophy. That would pretty much be just exclusives, because that's all they have control over.

I'm struggling to understand your position and your logic. The only thing that I can think of that will marry your position and logic with Spencer's statements is that this is restricted to just ID@Xbox games and doesn't include AAA games. Which is actually a completely logical perspective and not refuted from anything that I saw was stated at GDC.

If you want to be an independent game developer of B or C class games, then you need to make sure your game can be played upon all of our platforms. If you're a AAA studio making a game, then those rules don't apply.

Is that what you think their announcement meant? That only ID@Xbox games would be crossplay and crossbuy?

That is certainly a possibility.

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

I bet zero. No way, no how, they charge for multiplayer on PC after what they've said now. That's including crossplay. And that's including every title, including first party exclusives like Halo 5. Now, I think they might be setting up people for disappointment when people buy a Xbox One game & then expect to play said game on Windows 10 device without a Gold subscription. That's something I think they will still require since the game is still physically playing on the Xbox One, but just being streamed to Win10 devices. I suspect a PR nightmare coming for that.

Tommy McClain

Not sure I understand your position.

First.. I'm not sure what quote or statement you are referring to when you talk about what they've already said in terms of subscriptions and memberships, etc.

Second, there's no way they would ever allow PC gamers to buy Haloz and play online multiplayer for free across platforms but charge Xb1 owners a subscription to do the same.

So, I'm very interested in whatever statement it is you are referring to.

It seems pretty easy to me. You're a PC gamer? Great! There's no Haloz for you, buy an Xbox. You're an Xbox gamer? Great! Here's Haloz but you have to pay for a Live subscription to play online/multiplayer. Look! We've made Haloz available for PC gamers as well, but you have to buy a Live subscription ton play online/multiplayer.

Despite what people's initial reactions are, the choice is simple: Either don't even offer the game to PC gamers, or offer the game to them but they have to pay for Live just live Xb1 users. PC gamers are still getting an increased choice, where before they didn't even have the option.

Maybe if you could provide the link to MS's statements it would clear things up a bit.

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

I think it is so funny that so many of you have jumped to the conclusion that Microsoft announced that all Xbox exclusives are coming to Windows 10 at GDC. Show me a news story reporting on this "merger" or show me a video snipet from Phil's session at GDC where he says this is happening. You are all jumping to a huge conclusion with absolutely no proof whatsoever.

I provided you with his quote.

You have enough information available to you that you should be able to understand that MS's vision is that you buy the game once in their ecosystem and you can use it on any of their devices that are capable.

They want this for EVERYTHING, for EVERY PRODUCT, whether it be Music, Movies, Office, or games.

Of course, this is more difficult with third parties. Does EA really want to agree with this? How many people buy Madden 2025 on Xbox and also buy Madden 2025 on PC? I'm sure there's a couple of folks that actually do this, so EA would be losing some sales. So MS has to convince them that this will actually encourage sales by enabling people to play on whatever platform (Xbox or PC) that they have. There is no way that MS can encourage EA to agree to this if they don't take the lead by doing so themselves with their exclusives.

 

[shredenvain]

Uh.. What? Now I'm really confused.

How do you take Spencer's comments about buying the game once and playing it on Xbox or Windows PC to mean anything other than they want all games available on all of their platforms?

Clearly, they can't force third parties to do this. All they can do is provide them with the toolkit so that they are able to do so, if they want. But what they can do, certainly, is make sure that the games that they (MS) publish do adhere to that philosophy. That would pretty much be just exclusives, because that's all they have control over.

I'm struggling to understand your position and your logic. The only thing that I can think of that will marry your position and logic with Spencer's statements is that this is restricted to just ID@Xbox games and doesn't include AAA games. Which is actually a completely logical perspective and not refuted from anything that I saw was stated at GDC.

If you want to be an independent game developer of B or C class games, then you need to make sure your game can be played upon all of our platforms. If you're a AAA studio making a game, then those rules don't apply.

Is that what you think their announcement meant? That only ID@Xbox games would be crossplay and crossbuy?

That is certainly a possibility.

Streaming from Xbox to windows 10!
There is even a Eurogamer article in this thread that shows a list of cross buy and cross play games announced. Why would they be announcing games if every game qualified?

 

[shredenvain]

I provided you with his quote.

You have enough information available to you that you should be able to understand that MS's vision is that you buy the game once in their ecosystem and you can use it on any of their devices that are capable.

They want this for EVERYTHING, for EVERY PRODUCT, whether it be Music, Movies, Office, or games.

Of course, this is more difficult with third parties. Does EA really want to agree with this? How many people buy Madden 2025 on Xbox and also buy Madden 2025 on PC? I'm sure there's a couple of folks that actually do this, so EA would be losing some sales. So MS has to convince them that this will actually encourage sales by enabling people to play on whatever platform (Xbox or PC) that they have. There is no way that MS can encourage EA to agree to this if they don't take the lead by doing so themselves with their exclusives.

I think you are the one not understanding exactly what it is they are trying to accomplish. I have no animosity. This whole thing started with me saying I hope they keep some Xbox One exclusives. It was followed by a bunch of people attacking me as a fanboy and you all assuming that this means no more Xbox one exclusives. Your quote from Phil has no specifics whatsoever. The streaming feature allows you to play exclusive Xbox one games across all your windows 10 devices. The games still need an Xbox one to stream. The crossbuy feature is an option for 3rd party developers across the windows store. Cross play is also up to the devs which means it isn't required. So please go watch Phil's session from GDC.
Or go Google Microsoft announce all Xbox one exclusives are coming to PC. You won't find one site reporting this.

 

[shredenvain]

Also what would be the point of streaming any Xbox one game to your windows device if all the games will be available to play natively on your PC, phone or tablet?
Seriously what is the point of this feature rancid?

 

[AlNom]

Of course, this is more difficult with third parties.

It'll be a tough sell for any major publisher which have their own digital stores (i.e. EA & Ubisoft) given the 30% cut.

For the rest, MS will have to sell the third party devs on why cross purchase is desirable - as a starting point, maybe it'll mean 15% cut for MS per sale if the title supports cross-buy (or less). Meanwhile, MS provides all the tools to make it that much easier to pull off the PC version. i.e. they did all the work for Xbox, no need to do extra work to hook into Steam or Origin etc.

Or something.

 

[shredenvain]

It'll be a tough sell for any major publisher which have their own digital stores (i.e. EA & Ubisoft) given the 30% cut.

For the rest, MS will have to sell the third party devs on why cross purchase is desirable - as a starting point, maybe it'll mean 15% cut for MS per sale if the title supports cross-buy (or less). Meanwhile, MS provides all the tools to make it that much easier to pull off the PC version. i.e. they did all the work for Xbox, no need to do extra work to hook into Steam or Origin etc.

Or something.

major 3rd party publishers aren't going to be required to do this and if they do they aren't locked into windows store exclusivity. They can still sell their titles at Steam or their own store as well.

 

[AlNom]

Of course.

MS just have to incentivize cross-buy to have any impact. Of course, they could just follow a similar model as they've done with cross-gen purchasing (optional, extra, relatively minor fee for the consumer).

 

[AzBat]

Not sure I understand your position.

First.. I'm not sure what quote or statement you are referring to when you talk about what they've already said in terms of subscriptions and memberships, etc.

Second, there's no way they would ever allow PC gamers to buy Haloz and play online multiplayer for free across platforms but charge Xb1 owners a subscription to do the same.

So, I'm very interested in whatever statement it is you are referring to.

It seems pretty easy to me. You're a PC gamer? Great! There's no Haloz for you, buy an Xbox. You're an Xbox gamer? Great! Here's Haloz but you have to pay for a Live subscription to play online/multiplayer. Look! We've made Haloz available for PC gamers as well, but you have to buy a Live subscription ton play online/multiplayer.

Despite what people's initial reactions are, the choice is simple: Either don't even offer the game to PC gamers, or offer the game to them but they have to pay for Live just live Xb1 users. PC gamers are still getting an increased choice, where before they didn't even have the option.

Maybe if you could provide the link to MS's statements it would clear things up a bit.

This is from Major Nelson today after responding to a tweet about asking to pay for Gold on Windows 10...

@haydencd Not charging. Xbox Live Gold will not be required for online multiplayer gaming using our service on Windows 10 PCs and Phones

https://twitter.com/majornelson/status/573285677149888514

But this isn't new since they already talked about it when they talked about Xbox on Windows 10 back in January...

http://www.polygon.com/2015/1/23/78...g-xbox-gold-program-for-windows-10-but-online

Tommy McClain