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Johnny Awesome
Veteran
The main awesome thing about the upclock is not the 7% performance boost, but what it says about yields and potential availability of units at launch.
Also, while it doesn't put the final nail in the coffin regarding the 12 GB rumours, at this point I think it would be extremely unlikely that there will be a ram boost.
Also, while it doesn't put the final nail in the coffin regarding the 12 GB rumours, at this point I think it would be extremely unlikely that there will be a ram boost.
What I mean is that picture can keep "accurate", they can change the speech and say "oh, we meant 8GB for games". I know that slide is for total ram, but it doesn't mean they can't add 4GB DRR3 to the system.
Why do you believe it puts a nail in the coffin and rules it out?
If there was any truth to that rumour, I could see why it would make it more possible that it goes to 12GB now.
They ask the developers which they prefer, they say memory.
It goes to 12GB, and gpu gets a free upgrade that it would've got anyway.
I think that if developers had said a GPU speed increase, I don't think MS would give them the free slight speed bump. But would have gone 100-200Mhz, and taken the hit in cost. Why bother even ask developers?
Not saying your wrong, just curious why you came to that conclusion?
GrimThorne
Newcomer
I think they would have killed that if it were just a rumor. They responded very clearly to the down clock rumor, even after that people STILL didn't believe them.
I guess that's why MS typically doesn't respond to rumors. What good does it do if you tell people the truth and they still call you a "PR boy?"
If they change their mind, they can just announce they've increased the RAM. There's no need to be tied to an older spec from a slide and they won't need to say, "ah yes, but we still have 8 GB for games." That slide is either what we'll get in the final box, or irrelevant; there's no need to justify an old slide when offering people more!
Adding more RAM seems like an extremely expensive proposition. I seem to recall MS (Robbie Bach, I believe) stating increasing the 360's RAM from 256MB to 512MB was a "billion dollar" decision. Therefore, it's very hard for me to believe they'd throw another 4GB in the bone at the last minute.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
Yup, and there's only 2 valid reasons that I can think of for why they might do it (and again this is not to imply that I think they are doing it).
1. Developers are demanding more RAM and hinting that without it, it's going to be more difficult to try to maintain platform parity with the competition. We haven't heard many rumors of this, so I don't think there's this big developer push for more.
2. As Microsoft works on the system OS part of the memory reserve they are discovering that 3 GB might be a bit limiting for what they want to put it there now and in the future. Again, that seems doubtful as I would think 3 GB should be plenty unless they start to get really extravagant with apps and services and being able to instantly switch between multiple apps and services and games without paging out memory to HDD (virtual memory).
So, highly unlikely, IMO. But if it happens, I'd think it was one of those two reasons. Having more than the competition wouldn't be a valid reason on its own.
Regards,
SB
Well this doesn't prevent any upgrade.
The same as Sony listing PS4 specs in more detail doesn't prevent any upgrade or downgrade. Otherwise there's no possibility of PS4 upclock because it'd change their teraflop rating that is on their official specs.
Sony also downclocked the PS3 after publishing the clock.
Johnny Awesome
Veteran
It's important to remember that because the vast majority of big franchises are multiplatform, it doesn't make sense to stray too far from the "other guy". You might end up paying to put something in the box that won't get used much.
Let me start of with that I'm neutral either way, and wouldn't be surprised or disappointed with how the memory pans out. (So keep that in mind when reading my craziness)
When I first heard about the 3GB OS reservation, I thought it's crazy what the hell, makes no sense, and don't be telling me it's 3 OS crap, it just doesn't work like that.
But then when I thought about it, and followed a few of the threads on here, I thought well is it such a bad thing.
We currently have little idea just how MS came up with that figure, is it very restrictive to them, how much room does it give to grow, did they give minimum they could get away with to the OS so that the game vm would have as much as possible?
It seems MS is aiming for another long cycle, and if so what would they like to be doing 5-10 years from now?
Not just centre of living room, but of the connected home, etc.
Is 3GB enough for their 10 year vision, it may or may not be more than enough....
The 360 mem upgrade was a massive undertaking, but how well would it have faired if it hadn't have happened?
PS4 has upped its memory from at least 4 - 8GB (off GDDR5 which is far from a cheap upgrade), although I think it was something they needed to do (as the correct chips came along in time)
The fact that PS4 is cheaper, and will do just as well in multipat games, where does that leave the X1?
Personally I believe regardless of what people believe, that the kinect couple years down the road may well be embraced (well not hated lol) by most people, and not treated the way it currently is viewed.
But where does that leave them now? And I'm not saying I think it leaves them with a sinking ship either.
I do wonder if a few developers said, if we had more ram we could do some amazing things that just wont be possible otherwise (1st and 3rd party). You could get some very special exclusives.
But considering you could do HDD streaming of data, I just cant imagine why they would need so much memory.
Could you have really high quality textures, LOD levels, audio samples, better and diverse AI?
Sometimes I wonder if I'm just thinking about what they could do now, and not what it would allow them to do 5+ years from now?
4k gamining, maybe not 3d (due to gpu limitations) , but high quality 2d and kinect games?
4k TV's may be expensive now but in 3+ years?
The amount it may cost to add the 4GB may well be considered a worth while trade off.
Or then they may just think, where more than fine with 8, so that's that
(Sorry for the brain dump lol)
When I first heard about the 3GB OS reservation, I thought it's crazy what the hell, makes no sense, and don't be telling me it's 3 OS crap, it just doesn't work like that.
But then when I thought about it, and followed a few of the threads on here, I thought well is it such a bad thing.
We currently have little idea just how MS came up with that figure, is it very restrictive to them, how much room does it give to grow, did they give minimum they could get away with to the OS so that the game vm would have as much as possible?
It seems MS is aiming for another long cycle, and if so what would they like to be doing 5-10 years from now?
Not just centre of living room, but of the connected home, etc.
Is 3GB enough for their 10 year vision, it may or may not be more than enough....
The 360 mem upgrade was a massive undertaking, but how well would it have faired if it hadn't have happened?
PS4 has upped its memory from at least 4 - 8GB (off GDDR5 which is far from a cheap upgrade), although I think it was something they needed to do (as the correct chips came along in time)
The fact that PS4 is cheaper, and will do just as well in multipat games, where does that leave the X1?
Personally I believe regardless of what people believe, that the kinect couple years down the road may well be embraced (well not hated lol) by most people, and not treated the way it currently is viewed.
But where does that leave them now? And I'm not saying I think it leaves them with a sinking ship either.
I do wonder if a few developers said, if we had more ram we could do some amazing things that just wont be possible otherwise (1st and 3rd party). You could get some very special exclusives.
But considering you could do HDD streaming of data, I just cant imagine why they would need so much memory.
Could you have really high quality textures, LOD levels, audio samples, better and diverse AI?
Sometimes I wonder if I'm just thinking about what they could do now, and not what it would allow them to do 5+ years from now?
4k gamining, maybe not 3d (due to gpu limitations) , but high quality 2d and kinect games?
4k TV's may be expensive now but in 3+ years?
The amount it may cost to add the 4GB may well be considered a worth while trade off.
Or then they may just think, where more than fine with 8, so that's that
(Sorry for the brain dump lol)
All those poor people who didn't preorder one in the first place can do so now because there are more available at launch? Let's give that an awesome cheer.....
Of course having some reliable sources is important, and most rumours turned out to be true right now; although the 12GB figure floating around doesn't seem that feasible... although simply not knowing much about that rumour about the architecture doesn't write the possibility off either.Let me start of with that I'm neutral either way, and wouldn't be surprised or disappointed with how the memory pans out. (So keep that in mind when reading my craziness)
When I first heard about the 3GB OS reservation, I thought it's crazy what the hell, makes no sense, and don't be telling me it's 3 OS crap, it just doesn't work like that.
But then when I thought about it, and followed a few of the threads on here, I thought well is it such a bad thing.
We currently have little idea just how MS came up with that figure, is it very restrictive to them, how much room does it give to grow, did they give minimum they could get away with to the OS so that the game vm would have as much as possible?
It seems MS is aiming for another long cycle, and if so what would they like to be doing 5-10 years from now?
Not just centre of living room, but of the connected home, etc.
Is 3GB enough for their 10 year vision, it may or may not be more than enough....
The 360 mem upgrade was a massive undertaking, but how well would it have faired if it hadn't have happened?
PS4 has upped its memory from at least 4 - 8GB (off GDDR5 which is far from a cheap upgrade), although I think it was something they needed to do (as the correct chips came along in time)
The fact that PS4 is cheaper, and will do just as well in multipat games, where does that leave the X1?
Personally I believe regardless of what people believe, that the kinect couple years down the road may well be embraced (well not hated lol) by most people, and not treated the way it currently is viewed.
But where does that leave them now? And I'm not saying I think it leaves them with a sinking ship either.
I do wonder if a few developers said, if we had more ram we could do some amazing things that just wont be possible otherwise (1st and 3rd party). You could get some very special exclusives.
But considering you could do HDD streaming of data, I just cant imagine why they would need so much memory.
Could you have really high quality textures, LOD levels, audio samples, better and diverse AI?
Sometimes I wonder if I'm just thinking about what they could do now, and not what it would allow them to do 5+ years from now?
4k gamining, maybe not 3d (due to gpu limitations) , but high quality 2d and kinect games?
4k TV's may be expensive now but in 3+ years?
The amount it may cost to add the 4GB may well be considered a worth while trade off.
Or then they may just think, where more than fine with 8, so that's that
(Sorry for the brain dump lol)
After all the things that happened this generation, I would say it can be feasible. It could help to account for the extra price of the console. Memory isn't that cheap nowadays. Especially because of the competition from mobile phones memory and the like, right?
Whether the rumours turn out to be true or not, let's see how things pan out. At first I thought the Xbox One was a mix of sound and cloud.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
I'd imagine less than that as you can get a 4 GB stick of DDR3 2133 memory for 35 USD or less. And that include retailer margins, manfucaturer margins, PCB, Heatspreader, retail packaging, shipping, etc.
And consider it was even cheaper than that 1 year ago. Checking my Newegg order history, I got 32 GB of DDR3 2133 for 110 USD (13.75 USD per 4 GB) in Nov. 2012. Again that's including all the overhead associated with a retail stick of memory.
So depending on when MS contracted supply of DDR3 chips, it could be quite cheap.
Regards,
SB
Aye and ms will be buying it for 70m plus unkts over the next half a decade or so. Its a good way to reduce idle time for a fab even if margins arent the greatest
Also, I doubt GDDR3 RAM was ever mass produced at the same level that DDR3 RAM was.
I also don't get why devkits need 12GB. Its not like previous consoles where the system practically gave all RAM to developers for retail games, leaving nothing for debugging. The OS only supposedly uses 2GB and 1GB is reserved, why couldn't you use that address space for debugging?
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