News & Rumors: Xbox One (codename Durango)

[bkilian]

A single player AND original owner or only a single player counting the owner?

From what I understood, a single player only, counting the owner.

Could that one hour deal be confusing those spreading the rumors, as they are taking it to mean up to an hour?

I have no idea, since I have no clue what basis the rumors used for their claims.

Did your friend say that this was the ONLY way it was going to be or was it one of some number of alternatives ?

When was the decision made and of course what meetings did he go to or didn't go to ;-)\

Even with one hour granularity I bet there would be simple share systems that could use different time zones to time share games. The ease of which would depend on how much info on a player could be exposed ( what games/timezone gamer tag etc. ) with their permission of course.

I'm sure there are. I suspect (but I don't actually know) that there might have been a limit on how soon you could add a game to the library. If you couldn't add a new game to your shared library until two weeks or a month after launch, it would reduce the financial impact to publishers to almost nothing.

 

[zupallinere]

If you couldn't add a new game to your shared library until two weeks or a month after launch, it would reduce the financial impact to publishers to almost nothing.

This would make more sense to me. Had MS come out with this restriction it would have been met with more credulity. They always referred to it as Shared Library or game which was always a flag for me.

Thanks

Well how much used game action do you get before 2 weeks or a month and how much of a problems is that ? Just sayin'

 

[XpiderMX]

finally we can put that nonsense to rest

thank you.. people (cboat and his flock) just trying to make MS and Xbox look bad as usual... ridiculous

I don't like CBOAT and his way to say things, but are all the people in GAF who believe him like if a god. What he said is "60sigh--", it can mean anything, but people understood what they want to understood.

 

[DJ12]

One of my friends still in the XBox org stated unequivocally that there was no timeout on sharing. It was a single player at a time only, and you "check out" a game, and while you have it checked out, no one else can access it. The checkin and checkout system worked on a one hour granularity.

So the pastebin has good information just presented in a "Microsoft is evil" way.

Seems like the idea was anyone in the "family" group could play it for an unlimited time, but if the owner started playing the other person would then not be able to start the game and I assume if they were mid-session the game would stop working at the next hourly check in on the non-owners xbox.

Actually seems a good idea for all concerned, I would be annoyed enough at being kicked out of the game after a few hours to buy it (if I was into it by then). If I don't like it then I've effectively had a few hours of "game trail". You certainly wouldn't organise a group buying scheme on this though as some suggested was possible. It'd be too open for abuse by whoever "bought" the physical/initial install.

 

[Gubbi]

I think there are some flaws in that article.

Not the first Tom Bramwell XB1 article in the recent past to have flaws.

Cheers

 

[Shifty Geezer]

One of my friends still in the XBox org stated unequivocally that there was no timeout on sharing. It was a single player at a time only, and you "check out" a game, and while you have it checked out, no one else can access it. The checkin and checkout system worked on a one hour granularity.

So it's something like a limited library, with ten members per title. Thinking about how that would work, against the worry of missed sales, it sounds quite workable. Any recent game would be actively played, and those waiting to play wouldn't wait too long to share. Any down-time could see someone else have a go and, again, if they like it want to play it while it's otherwise in use, they'll have to buy. A game that isn't being played can be shared around, much like lending discs. The end result is a system that's analogous to the principle of lending that everyone's used to, and not an obvious threat to the bottom-dollar takings of the publishers which explains why they could be in favour.

Sounds like quite a good idea. MS really should have explained it better! It's taken us this long, and insider information, to actually understand what the hell MS's proposition was! I think this is the worst handling of a console policy I can recall. It's even worse than Nintendo Wii U where many people think it's a Wii peripheral. I don't understand how MS could struggle so much to communicate this. They're all over the shop at the moment. It's almost like they hadn't really agreed on policy, and internal conflict that never wanted a change stifled the chances of the new ideas, and then pushed for a change back.

 

[dobwal]

The first fitness game that uses all of kinects new futures in my opinion sadly has the chance to be a bigger system seller than any hardcore game if wii fit is any indication of the size of market for that sort of thing
I can hear to now kinect screaming back work it work it you slacking do you want to drop that dress size or what

P 90 XBOX.

 

[Gubbi]

Sounds like quite a good idea. MS really should have explained it better! It's taken us this long, and insider information, to actually understand what the hell MS's proposition was!

I think it was fairly clear from the get go.

People jumped to their own conclusions.

I don't understand how MS could struggle so much to communicate this.

They were massively misrepresented.

All the grand standing about game ownership by people who have either/both a Steam account and an Android/iPhone/iPad was sickening.

They're all over the shop at the moment. It's almost like they hadn't really agreed on policy, and internal conflict that never wanted a change stifled the chances of the new ideas, and then pushed for a change back.

That's the most annoying thing: They buckled to the GAF idiots. If it is going to compromise family account management or I need to swap discs when my brother invites me to Forza 5 while I play Crimson Dragon I'm going to be so f*cking annoyed.

Cheers

 

[DrJay24]

That's the most annoying thing: They buckled to the GAF idiots. If it is going to compromise family account management or I need to swap discs when my brother invites me to Forza 5 while I play Crimson Dragon I'm going to be so f*cking annoyed.

Cheers

So they got rid of this family plan with DD titles for what reason? Blame MS, they were trying to make something unappealing look acceptable, they failed, so they took their ball and went home. They couldn't get what they wanted, so they had no intention of giving you the parts you wanted. Back to raging at the boogeymen on the internet while letting MS like victims.

 

[blakjedi]

So they got rid of this family plan with DD titles for what reason? Blame MS, they were trying to make something unappealing look acceptable, they failed, so they took their ball and went home. They couldn't get what they wanted, so they had no intention of giving you the parts you wanted. Back to raging at the boogeymen on the internet while letting MS like victims.

I think MS is gonna take a second crack at this before launch.

Just a hunch

 

[Strange]

I think MS is gonna take a second crack at this before launch.

Just a hunch

In a sense, I hope they do.
I'd like to see which "180" is better received by the masses.

 

[zupallinere]

I think MS is gonna take a second crack at this before launch.

Just a hunch

AS they should and it will most likely be a better deal.

 

[James Car]

...or I need to swap discs when my brother invites me to Forza 5 while I play Crimson Dragon I'm going to be so f*cking annoyed.

Cheers

Download your games?

It seems to not be an issue for ps4... not seeing why it would be a problem for xbone.

 

[AlphaWolf]

Download your games?

It seems to not be an issue for ps4... not seeing why it would be a problem for xbone.

It will be an issue for anyone with a (smallish) cap or less than stellar connection speeds on either platform. MS was offering to alleviate that issue, but it has been rescinded in favour of the DRM (on disc DRM).

 

[zupallinere]

All the grand standing about game ownership by people who have either/both a Steam account and an Android/iPhone/iPad was sickening.

Android/Iphone/Ipad and Steam are not the same as consoles.

1. What goes on in the cloud stays in the cloud. There is plenty of consumer experience with this system. There is little expectation that you OWN the game in the same way you OWNED and a 360 disc which you can sell and it's license to use.

2. Portable apps in almost all cases cost far less than a game on one of these consoles.

3. Steam is in a much more competitive situation than the console world.

4. Consumers of disc based media have been able to buy/sell used for decades now, that includes last generations game discs and previous cartridge based games. Now everything changes and first sale goes by the wayside because MS says so ?? In the EU software licenses can be resold. Not that it would affect XB1 sales much but used games are legal in Japan as well.

Let publishers force the issue in court if they have a case or just use the DRM tools that already exist. This is their problem not the consumers. All of this anti-consumer stuff is reminiscent of Walt Disney latching on to Mickey for dear life.

 

[zupallinere]

It will be an issue for anyone with a (smallish) cap or less than stellar connection speeds

How would this affect the always connected/Cloud nirvana were being promised ? As I said love to see how many people have a connections situation that stopped them from downloading games they wanted every month and was also good enough for all of the Cloud Magic and had an issue with swapping discs.

 

[dagamer]

So it's something like a limited library, with ten members per title. Thinking about how that would work, against the worry of missed sales, it sounds quite workable. Any recent game would be actively played, and those waiting to play wouldn't wait too long to share. Any down-time could see someone else have a go and, again, if they like it want to play it while it's otherwise in use, they'll have to buy. A game that isn't being played can be shared around, much like lending discs. The end result is a system that's analogous to the principle of lending that everyone's used to, and not an obvious threat to the bottom-dollar takings of the publishers which explains why they could be in favour.

Sounds like quite a good idea. MS really should have explained it better! It's taken us this long, and insider information, to actually understand what the hell MS's proposition was! I think this is the worst handling of a console policy I can recall. It's even worse than Nintendo Wii U where many people think it's a Wii peripheral. I don't understand how MS could struggle so much to communicate this. They're all over the shop at the moment. It's almost like they hadn't really agreed on policy, and internal conflict that never wanted a change stifled the chances of the new ideas, and then pushed for a change back.

If Microsoft couldn't full articulate their plan to the public, did they at least do so to publishers? In fact, I really want to know if they signed off on this plan, because if they didn't have all their ducks in a row to the press, what on earth did they present to EA, Activision, Ubisoft, Square-Enix, and the like?

Thing is, so much of this is framing that it really need to be managing so much more carefully than it is now. I'd even just settle with digital games being shareable with 5 people 3 months after release with a single person being able to play at once. Want to play "right now"? Buy the game. Want to play your friends copy later? Wait 3 months. Want to both play multiplayer at the same time? Again, buy the game. Want to sell your game? Buy a disc. Depending on how close/far away you are with your friends, a digital version may be a better solution for you.

 

[Gubbi]

Android/Iphone/Ipad and Steam are not the same as consoles.

What's the difference ?

1. What goes on in the cloud stays in the cloud. There is plenty of consumer experience with this system. There is little expectation that you OWN the game in the same way you OWNED and a 360 disc which you can sell and it's license to use.

You paid money for the games on all platforms, but you only OWN the game on some platforms and not on others ?

That makes sense to you?

2. Portable apps in almost all cases cost far less than a game on one of these consoles.

Relevance ?

Or are you claiming price determines whether you bought to OWN or just bought to lease. If so, what price ?

3. Steam is in a much more competitive situation than the console world.

How is that relevant to the control of digital licenses ?

4. Consumers of disc based media have been able to buy/sell used for decades now, that includes last generations game discs and previous cartridge based games. Now everything changes and first sale goes by the wayside because MS says so ??

Yes. Wave goodbye to used games.

In the EU software licenses can be resold. Not that it would affect XB1 sales much but used games are legal in Japan as well.

We've been over this. Can you sell your iOS/Android/Steam games in the EU ?

No, you can't. And not because Google, Apple and Valve are U.S. companies, but because while you have the right to sell your software, these companies are not forced to facilitate the necessary license swapping required for you to make a legal sale.

In short: YOU CAN'T SELL YOUR SOFTWARE IN THE EU.

Let publishers force the issue in court if they have a case or just use the DRM tools that already exist. This is their problem not the consumers. All of this anti-consumer stuff is reminiscent of Walt Disney latching on to Mickey for dear life.

I, a consumer, wants to have my software licenses managed digitally online, so that I don't have to bother about discs, locations or who's console I'm on (I could travel to the other side of the world and play MY game on some completely random XBox).

It is already that way with my music, any new movies I purchase, my PC games (Steam only) and software for my smart phone.

Somehow console games are different ?

Cheers

 

[Cyan]

Not sure if this article was posted
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-06-21-the-most-popular-arguments-in-favour-of-xbox-one-drm

I agree with him that change isn't equal to progress. The problem for me was the marketing though.

My brother once told me. "Do you think Germans were crazy". I replied; "No, why should I?".

He was talking about the WWII with me.

And he mentioned that one of the major, irrefutable virtues of Adolf Hitler was that he managed to convince almost a whole nation about his views.

How? You might wonder. "He was a great, passionate orator!" he told me.

That's the difference to me.

 

[Cyan]

So it's something like a limited library, with ten members per title. Thinking about how that would work, against the worry of missed sales, it sounds quite workable. Any recent game would be actively played, and those waiting to play wouldn't wait too long to share. Any down-time could see someone else have a go and, again, if they like it want to play it while it's otherwise in use, they'll have to buy. A game that isn't being played can be shared around, much like lending discs. The end result is a system that's analogous to the principle of lending that everyone's used to, and not an obvious threat to the bottom-dollar takings of the publishers which explains why they could be in favour.

Sounds like quite a good idea. MS really should have explained it better! It's taken us this long, and insider information, to actually understand what the hell MS's proposition was! I think this is the worst handling of a console policy I can recall. It's even worse than Nintendo Wii U where many people think it's a Wii peripheral. I don't understand how MS could struggle so much to communicate this. They're all over the shop at the moment. It's almost like they hadn't really agreed on policy, and internal conflict that never wanted a change stifled the chances of the new ideas, and then pushed for a change back.

Yup, if bkilian said that we can finally settle this matter forever and ever. He is an amazing person.

As for your final paragraph, well, it reminds me of this video that I wanted to share even before reading your words, but you put those thoughts into words by sheer chance in a manner I liked that I decided to share it after reading your post.

The video is much, much more valuable because it was uploaded a couple of days before the whole DRM debacle, not after, what makes his opinion much more unexpectedly (and incredibly) accurate.

It has been created by the Killer Instinct guy, and he mentions simply in the initial 4 minutes or so how Microsoft aren't communicating things well. That was a HUGE problem that didn't help the initial idea of the platform and the DRM at all.

EDIT: At the 7 minutes mark he says something really CRUCIAL too -from 6:40 minutes mark on, to 7:30 mins mark-.