Bagel seed
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From thuway
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upnorthsox
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Flip your cause and effect 180 degrees and everything begins to fit like a glove. Memory can be very heat sensitive with the effect being intermittent and unpredicable results. And the cause of that? On Durango, the biggest source of heat is the GPU and the 2 ways to combat it are move away from it (requiring a chip redesign) or lowering clocks which would explain the rumors.
Are we supposed to take GAF's word?
yeah. i was actually just sort of showing how annoying people predisposed to believing a certain rumor can be lol.
basically reverse my post, multiply it by 9000 gaf members and you have the downclock rumor thread over there in a nutshell lol.
btw the latest in that GAF thread is "gopherD" confirmed it and he's supposedly some insider. Well I ran his name through google in ten seconds and...
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=47871129&postcount=1620
Somebody should tell Guerrilla...
Also this is his post. The wording is such there's wiggle room for him on clocks (even if the clocks are 800, it's likely in some cases there could be "significant performance issues" compared to Orbis with conventional straight ahead programming). Or he could even be talking about the OS only.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=61374949&postcount=1130
What does the OS being a "total lie" mean? How are people developing games for the platform, and how is it going to release in five months?
D
Deleted member 7537
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As I recall, the MS guy openly stated before that TV demonstration "this is the aspiration". Which is well known marketing code for "it might not be like this at least right away". I only know that cause a B3Der sagely called it out. Nobody should have been "fooled".
Yeah, Thuway is not convincing me anymore. I'd really need a more detailed grasp of his "source". Calling the info "recent" only calls it's validity into question more. It's basically the same type of thing Reiko fell for.
We used to PM and He DID have early specs somehow back in the day on both ps4 and durango iirc. Since then I dont really look at him as an insider. To my mind AFAIK He's another that is basically a PM rumor aggregater like Proelite rather than an actual insider. So it just depends on his source, and if his source is even the same as his older ones, has any kind of track record etc etc. Like Reiko, it sounds on the surface like he has a "new" "source" feeding him this, which makes it dubious.
At that time he told me he came by that info by being an ex game tester, which struck me a little odd. Not even a current tester, lol.
Not really. In ten seconds of googling:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=47871129&postcount=1620
We already know as much as we can know (certainly much more evidence than the Durango cores reserved thing) from the Killzone slides PS4 reserves 2 cores.
Can you point me to any prior "accurate" posts of his? The only other one I looked at he was talking about the 8GB of GDDR5, but it wasn't a predictive post, he was just saying third parties didn't know.
I suppose I should take a closer look at him.
Bagel seed
Veteran
Wow, this is like the quickest I've seen a rumor get a nod from almost all the insiders on gaf. There's definitely something to it.
Well he is spinning with "this doesn't really matter nobody in the real world will notice" type stuff.
Which I cant imagine being true. You'd be talking about Xb1 now being HALF as powerful as PS4. Seems like a bridge too far to me.
i still havent seen one real insider (though again there's a dearth of those) say anything so, yeah. shrug, and stuff. it's thuway and pro-elite vs senjetsuu sage and that's it. pretty thin stuff when you get down to it.
even gopher, somebody needs to ask him to specifically confirm the downclock. his post was leading but vague, almost purposefully to leave him an out or even hedge against banning.
gopherd does seem to have insiderish tendencies, but i cant find where he has ever really confirmed anything beforehand. and the ps4 os core reserved thing gives me major pause, it kind of suggests he isn't really in the know.
If true, and I'm in no way supporting the position that it is, I would take that comment to mean that demonstration at the reveal event was full of mockups and prerenders of a product that isn't yet working. This isn't atypical when working with software and finding it's not ready for a public showcase that you've prebooked. I guess the rumour that the show was postponed perhaps could tie into wanting more time to get the software working, and they still missed the deadline. Maybe it would mean that extra time was spent creating the fake presentation assets, if they were faked?
If we think of the OS design involving 3 OSes working together, all having to work with non-standard hardware (memory move units, eSRAM) on silicon that wasn't available, it's not implausible that OS issues have plagued development, and we have heard rumblings to that tune as well.
i wish people would stop saying this self-reenforcing baloney! it's the same thing that makes that gaf thread annoying.
what insiders? links? can you supply some actual facts here?
i cant read every last post over there but i believe i've covered it. it's certainly nothing like you suggest. thuway and proelite are dubious and rumor-mongers not insiders (former a bit less than latter i give). matt is an insider but did not confirm downclock. some guy named gopherd seems insiderish but he was wrong about ps4 cores reserved and his actual specific record seems thin at best (again, feel free to correct)
and that's all i have. currently it's mostly speculation, which doesn't necessarily mean it's not true, but there's really little for it right now. It's "thuway and proelite said it" and nothing else basically.
Averagejoe
Regular
Aren't ESRAM issues reason enough to lower clock speed on the GPU to achieve cooler temperatures.?
no clue.
i guess in theory, sure. so? that's like saying "arent the CU's in AMD GPU's capable of causing heat and thus needing to be clocked lower?"
That is true, but says next to nothing about the clocks of any AMD GPU.
if anything i think most have said esram runs very cool. it would seem to be an obvious case since they arent computational units like cu's.
but you can always justify a downclock if you want. 3dillante mentioned some crazy signalling issues stuff for example. it doesn't have to be heat.
I usually assume most stage demos are faked in some form or another. I'm surprised Microsoft would have started this console so late that it would be in such bad shape at this point.
Hopefully there are some more reliable sources that will hint at what's going on. I don't have a huge amount of trust in forum "insiders".
Averagejoe
Regular
Some of the things that were hint on Neogaf latter appear on VGleaks and held up until the end some did not.
But what is so out of this world about MS having problem with the APU,specially with one this complicated,didn't the first xbox receive a 50mhz down clock before launch.?
It was 300mhz and was lower to 250mhz,this thing happen some times,if you read well,it is say that the reason the PS4 has 18CU is because 2 were sacrifice for yields,and we know the speed of the GPU is 800mhz,so what if the PS4 GPU was a 7870 with 2 CU kill and 200mhz lower clock,because sony could not hit the spot a full blown 7870.
This things happen,apparently MS is late and the recent may 21 showing had by leaks fake UI presentation,because it is say the UI is running like at 5FPS now.
You are asking for the impossible links to something that would violate so many NDA if the person that is leaking is catch.
(((interference)))
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FWIW I have heard that Durango was looking likely to slip, the fact that they've delayed Xbox TV/Yuma (originally planned to launch simultaneously) probably indicates that too.
I am going to see if anyone out of GAF has heard anything.
In the meantime someone should analyze the post history of the 'insiders' claiming this rumour to be true. Now thuway and Proelite definitely have access to insider info (whether this particular claim is insider info is another matter) while senjutsusage seems just to be a fanboy judging from his B3D posts, I have no idea about Matt, Bruceleeroy or GopherD. What have they posted that is 'insidery'?
However if a whole bunch of insiders are saying the same thing, plus that stfuandplay website - then this rumour deserves some consideration.
It's very much unlike the rumours of a clock increase where we had no insiders claiming it nor any outlets running stories about it.
I am going to see if anyone out of GAF has heard anything.
In the meantime someone should analyze the post history of the 'insiders' claiming this rumour to be true. Now thuway and Proelite definitely have access to insider info (whether this particular claim is insider info is another matter) while senjutsusage seems just to be a fanboy judging from his B3D posts, I have no idea about Matt, Bruceleeroy or GopherD. What have they posted that is 'insidery'?
However if a whole bunch of insiders are saying the same thing, plus that stfuandplay website - then this rumour deserves some consideration.
It's very much unlike the rumours of a clock increase where we had no insiders claiming it nor any outlets running stories about it.
Betanumerical
Veteran
Matt is very legit I am led to believe but he didn't confirm the down clock just that they where having issues with the eSRAM and yields.
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