New Mark Rein interview

[Qroach]

EDIT - see Laa-Yosh's post above

What could "The big news" be that isn't news already? Have they been hiring enough people over the past year to add another dev team and possibly announce/show a new game? Perhaps something exclusive for ps3 along the same lines as a Gow?

If it was something for PS3 they would not be annoucing or making hints about it on the Gears of war forum. Whatever it is, it's probably related to gears of war or something they are doing with microsoft imo.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

As Laa-yosh said - those videos were not rendered to spec - Sony lied period.

I'm not trying to lynch Sony here, but the Sony defenders need to come clean on this so it can be dropped.

As Alstrong says, if this topic is to continue it needs a thread split. I'll also say that I'm only arguing this largely pointless case because I'm a strong believer in giving people a fair trial. By my reckoning if a person commits a murder but has an airtight alibi, they can't be thought of as guilty until the detective in the raincoat has shown their alibi is broken because of the answerphone message and phone records. Only when the weight of evidence is against them can they be convicted. In this case I've yet to see the evidence that of all the parties involved in producing the KZ movie, the only one who could be responsible for over-the-top results beyond what the hardware can produce is Sony. (eg. How do people know Guerilla aren't to blame in orxer ot win Sony's favour and get bought up?). Sony may well be guilty of purposefully commissioning the KZ trailer as shown knwoing their machine couldn't pull it off, but it hasn't been proven to me beyond reasonable doubt

 

[Mariner]

Still OT: I think that in future, interviewers need to think carefully about how they word their questions. Instead of asking, "Is this realtime gameplay?", they should say, "I'm assuming that the trailer was pre-rendered CGI unless you tell me otherwise."

Don't leave them any wriggle-room for semantic word games!

Back OT: What on earth could this 'big secret' be? Bah! It's probably just some kind of PR stunt! :smile:

 

[AlNom]

Serenity has graciously created a topic about the big announcement and the viral marketing thing. I probably should have done that originally.

 

[elementOfpower]

In reference to the Killzone footage at E3 last year, Mr. Tretton says:

That's one thing that Ted wanted to make sure people understood. That is real gameplay that everybody is seeing out there.

G4TV Guy: So, it is real gameplay?

Mr. Tretton: It is real gameplay.

http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/748/748475/vids_1.html


That seems pretty cut and dry to me. If you watch the entire interview, the G4TV guy questions him beforehand on whether or not it's CGI. Tretton denies it emphatically.

Didn't mean to drift off-topic again, but I thought this might put an end to the debate. It's hard to spin this one.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I thought this might put an end to the debate.

Not writing would end the debate What you posted can readily be argued against.

 

[Darkon]

In reference to the Killzone footage at E3 last year, Mr. Tretton says:



http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/748/748475/vids_1.html


That seems pretty cut and dry to me. If you watch the entire interview, the G4TV guy questions him beforehand on whether or not it's CGI. Tretton denies it emphatically.

Didn't mean to drift off-topic again, but I thought this might put an end to the debate. It's hard to spin this one.

"Ted wanted everybody to know that is real gameplay." Ted Price is the CEO of Insomniac Games, the people who are making Resistence AKA I-8 , the guy confused killzone with I-8 .

 

[fireshot]

Shifty i don't see why you even need to put a spin for Sony "render target" FUD? Laa-Yoshi hit the spot about the benefit of hindsight. I had say it is justified to have a go at Sony(Acert93 made another good post).

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Shifty i don't see why you even need to put a spin for Sony "render target" FUD?

Forgive me. I was under the misconception that this was a discussion forum where people present their ideas with their rationale behind them for others to either agree with or not. The fact that having an interpretation of a statement is by nature of the definiton, adding your own spin to it, means everyone is guilty, thus if no-one is to discuss points with 'spin' then nothing would be discussed.

In other words, if you're not here to listen to people's opinions, why are you here?

 

[elementOfpower]

"Ted wanted everybody to know that is real gameplay." Ted Price is the CEO of Insomniac Games, the people who are making Resistence AKA I-8 , the guy confused killzone with I-8 .

I noticed that too, but the G4TV guy specifically mentioned Killzone and all the hype surrounding it being CGI just before Tretton responded with that. It was an entirely different line of discussion from I-8.

Maybe Tretton simply got the names of developers mixed up? Tretton would've had to been really, really lost to not know the current topic was Killzone.

 

[scooby_dooby]

Forgive me. I was under the misconception that this was a discussion forum where people present their ideas with their rationale behind them for others to either agree with or not. The fact that having an interpretation of a statement is by nature of the definiton, adding your own spin to it, means everyone is guilty, thus if no-one is to discuss points with 'spin' then nothing would be discussed.

In other words, if you're not here to listen to people's opinions, why are you here?

Please. A guy is given a straightforward question "IS KZ real" he answers, 'it's all real', there is no room for interpretation.

How in the world do you spin that to mean anything other than the obvious? The statement with regards to Ted was like 2 sentences later.

Shifty, as someone who claims to really dislike this type of behavious from companies, I would think you'd be a little more critical. This is as cut and dry as it gets, and if you refuse to hold them to account in this situation, I can't imagine a scenario where you would.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I'm not going to discuss it here - it's off topic - though there's still plenty of scope to question one's interpretation. Regardless, no matter how whacked out a person's ideas may be, are they not entitled to express them? What constitutes spin and when is it not to be allowed on a discussion forum?

 

[scooby_dooby]

I'm not going to discuss it here - it's off topic - though there's still plenty of scope to question one's interpretation. Regardless, no matter how whacked out a person's ideas may be, are they not entitled to express them? What constitutes spin and when is it not to be allowed on a discussion forum?

When a corporate exec lies about the content in a 1st party game, and then people try to pretend he 'meant' something else...that would constitue spin. The language is extremely clear.

 

[TheChefO]

As Alstrong says, if this topic is to continue it needs a thread split. I'll also say that I'm only arguing this largely pointless case because I'm a strong believer in giving people a fair trial. By my reckoning if a person commits a murder but has an airtight alibi, they can't be thought of as guilty until the detective in the raincoat has shown their alibi is broken because of the answerphone message and phone records. Only when the weight of evidence is against them can they be convicted. In this case I've yet to see the evidence that of all the parties involved in producing the KZ movie, the only one who could be responsible for over-the-top results beyond what the hardware can produce is Sony. (eg. How do people know Guerilla aren't to blame in orxer ot win Sony's favour and get bought up?). Sony may well be guilty of purposefully commissioning the KZ trailer as shown knwoing their machine couldn't pull it off, but it hasn't been proven to me beyond reasonable doubt

So your whole point then is it is impossible to blame Sony specifically for this confusion because they themselves may not have known what was possible with their machine and what methods were used to create the videos in question.

BS

When investigating, one questions potential motives. If the motive was directly from the developer or publisher to gain awareness or hype for their specific game, why do we not see these videos all the time? Was it coincidence that multiple devs decided to make cgi "target renders" outside the scope of ability of ps3 on their own without direction? Is it coincidence that Sony needed to hype ps3 and show it's superiority over 360 at a time when they knew there was no way they could launch anywhere near the same timeframe and in fact would be a year after 360?

The motive for Sony to show these cgi videos and pawn them off as gameplay to the uninformed is clear. The motive of third/second party devs to show these cgi videos and pawn them off as gameplay to the uninformed is questionable.

Somebody call Dick Tracy or get MagnumPI in here. :smile:

As they say in the US - they are guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. It's ok for you to have a doubt about this whole scenario, it just isn't reasonable.

 

[Mmmkay]

Please. A guy is given a straightforward question "IS KZ real" he answers, 'it's all real', there is no room for interpretation.

"Interviewer: The Ratchet and Clank guys have this interesting sort of FPS that sorta looks like a mix between half-life 2, call of duty. Tell me something where'd the sorta idea you know, putting a team like Insomniac who're used to doing these almost you know kiddie games onto something that looks very mature. What was the decision behind that?"

"Jack: Well, Ted Price is absolutely a genius and his team over there's done an incredible job..."

"Interviewer: Now I know that there were some other demos that were shown there. There was Killzone, a lot of people were excited about that. People were wondering though, you know, was some of the stuff real, was it CGI, it looked so good you know. I mean what was, what was the sense from you? Is there some stuff in there you know computer smoke and mirrors?"

"Jack: It's definitely real, I guess we're pretty good at keeping secrets, because the dev kits were out there. The dev kits are very intuitive so people did some incredible things, and that's one thing that Ted wanted to make sure that everybody understood. That is real gameplay everybody is seeing out there"

"Interviewer: So it is gameplay? All that stuff is all gameplay?"

"Jack: And I think beyond great gameplay I tihnk we have the opportunity to tap into worldwide development resources. Cos when you mention something like Killzone that's of our sister company over in Europe"

There were no direct questions relating to Killzone and Jack only acknowledged that Killzone had been brought into the discussion as a 'mention'. He was still answering with regards to I-8. Call it deflection or what ever, but this was by no means a 'straightforward' question and there is a country mile's worth of room for interpretation.

 

[mckmas8808]

So still till this day that interview is still being argued about. Sheesh guys. Too bad there will be no more E3's to argue about in the future.

 

[scooby_dooby]

Call it deflection or what ever, but this was by no means a 'straightforward' question and there is a country mile's worth of room for interpretation.

Only if you believe the interviee was a complete moron incapable of understanding an extremely straightforward question.

The question had nothing to do with I-8, it was clearly with regards to all the demo's shown, with an explicit Killzone mention.

 

[Mmmkay]

Only if you believe the interviee was a complete moron incapable of understanding an extremely straightforward question.

The question had nothing to do with I-8, it was clearly with regards to all the demo's shown, with an explicit Killzone mention.

It's a PR dodge. I said it was a dodge when we went through all this the last time it came up. You don't have to be 'moronic' to avoid answering a question, direct as you seem to believe it was. Jack was clearly not willing to be drawn into clarifying Killzone's authenticity. This is the world of PR and it's highly likely that any and all questions were vetted prior to the interview with the opportunity for interviewees to prepare answers in advance. His answer was singular so as to highlight a specific case, I-8, which he had been previously discussing. His subsequent answer demonstrates that he ignored Killzone's relevance to the prior question.

 

[scooby_dooby]

His subsequent answer demonstrates that he ignored Killzone's relevance to the prior question.

So he was intentionally misleading the public? Exactly what I'm saying, he's not a moron and was fully aware of the question and the impression his statement would give. Saying it's 'PR' is not an excuse for lying.

Q: There was Killzone, a lot of people were excited about that. People were wondering though, you know, was some of the stuff real, was it CGI, it looked so good you know.

A: It's definitely real.

Either he's a moron who didn't understand the question, or he's intentially misleading people with a lie.

 

[mckmas8808]

So he was intentionally misleading the public? Exactly what I'm saying, he's not a moron and was fully aware of the question and the impression his statement would give. Saying it's 'PR' is not an excuse for lying.

Q: There was Killzone, a lot of people were excited about that. People were wondering though, you know, was some of the stuff real, was it CGI, it looked so good you know.

A: It's definitely real.

Either he's a moron who didn't understand the question, or he's intentially misleading people with a lie.

No it's neither. He's dodging the question totally.