Microsoft announces external HD-DVD drive for Xbox 360

[Laa-Yosh]

What I'm saying is that once TVs make the move to 1080p
we might end up in a situation like we're in now where your SD content actually looked better on your old TV and the only solution is to upgrade your source material to HD.

I think that we're already at this point even on 720p, 1080p wouldn't make much of a difference.
Analog TV broadcasts already look as bad as they would, and 480p/576p DVD won't get any worse through the internal upscaling of the HDTV either. Compression artifacts would be a more important problem then resolution IMHO, some old DVDs might have more prominent banding and jpeg-blockiness... but that's quite apparent at 480p already.

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Future

Most people don't think DVD looks bad.

Thats because they see on SD TV. On 1080P TV 480P is not so great but 1080P looks really great.

I really doubt you will see 1080p sets being competetively priced in 5 years. I certainly don't expect them to be going from 'so expensive most people wouldn't consider them' to 'the norm' in 5 years. Perhaps if they solve OLED issues, but thats another story.

I feel you will be pleasantly surprised my friend.

HD players will have to reach the $50 price point before the HD media can even think about competing with DVD.

This is a little too conservative no? In 5 years if chinese company is manufacturing then $50 is maybe no problem but even $150 next-gen player will have very fast sales like "hot-cakes".

 

[expletive]

By time they get to $150, the format will already have been decided. So its a moot point.

To suggest that somehow PS3 buyers can be any less of a rabid movie fan than this distinct "standalone buyer" profile you've contrived is quite ridiculous. There is no clear demarcation between these profiles. It's all overlap, movie sale behavior will likely be quite similar.

I'm begging, please drop it. I dont know any other way to put it. We disagree.

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Shrink

Compression artifacts would be a more important problem then resolution IMHO, some old DVDs might have more prominent banding and jpeg-blockiness... but that's quite apparent at 480p already.

This is why next-gen format video at High Definition resolution on disc can look better than 480P DVD even on normal TV because all compression artifacts from High Definition disc "shrink" with resolution but reverse process of upscaling 480P DVD to show on 1080P TV has opposite effect to "expand" artifacts.

 

[ERP]

It's not even my opinion it's more like an assumption. I question what DVD's will look like blown up to 1080p. Was that Samsung plasma 1080p?

What I'm saying is that once TVs make the move to 1080p
we might end up in a situation like we're in now where your SD content actually looked better on your old TV and the only solution is to upgrade your source material to HD.

I watch DVD's scaled up to 1080i on 106 inch screen, and you know what they look pretty good.

I can get anal about it and critcise the picture, but I know what I'm looking for, and watching a good DVD master on a big front projection screen is still an enjoyable experience.

At some point it isn't about better it's about convenience and good enough. The reason I moved to DVD from Laser wasn't picture quality it wasn't the fact that DVD was cheaper. I didn't have to wait for the player to swap sides and the form factor was more convenient.

To me SACD sounds orders of magnitude better than CD, but that doesn't stop a lot of people being happy with mp3's encoded at less that 128Kbits.

I've said this before the new formats aren't competing with each other they are competing with DVD and with downloadable content. I think that BluRay is the only one with any real chance of success and that depends on the legions of PS3 owners buying movies fro their PS3. I have no idea if this is really a likely scenrio, I don't see people buying PS3's just for it's ability to play movies.

 

[expletive]

I watch DVD's scaled up to 1080i on 106 inch screen, and you know what they look pretty good.

Agreed, if anyone wants to see what DVDs can look like blown up to 110", live in the NY/NJ area, and arent crazy ( ), I'll show you first hand.

 

[expletive]

FWIW, on my "old" projector, 110-inch diagonal.

Projected on a bare wall:

 

[ihamoitc2005]

I've said this before the new formats aren't competing with each other they are competing with DVD and with downloadable content. I think that BluRay is the only one with any real chance of success and that depends on the legions of PS3 owners buying movies fro their PS3. I have no idea if this is really a likely scenrio, I don't see people buying PS3's just for it's ability to play movies.

DVD I think is not so much problem for next-gen format because of inferior content and image quality but downloadable content maybe if many people have very high bandwidth connection. Maybe this is why Kutaragi says no size HD is big enough and why next gen consoles have very good network capability for connection with computer or other media storage device.

 

[randycat99]

It's fairly well thought out line of reasoning if you ask me. The people who early adopt the standalones are going to be videophiles. I don't think could say (with a straight face anyway) thats true about all the people who will buy the PS3.

It's myopic reasoning. Early adopters are not necessarily rabid movie collectors, either. Some may be, some just like collecting new tech equipment. Some just like buying high-priced stuff for the esteem. What's certain, is that their numbers have never been such that they alone got a standard into the mainstream. They are simply the first to buy in- hence the label "early adopter".

 

[seismologist]

FWIW, on my "old" projector, 110-inch diagonal.

Now imagine how good the PS3 projected on that wall would look.
if I had a 100" diagonal I would want Blu Ray more than anyone.

 

[AlphaWolf]

This is a little too conservative no? In 5 years if chinese company is manufacturing then $50 is maybe no problem but even $150 next-gen player will have very fast sales like "hot-cakes".

Number of HD players currently on the market, zero. Number of DVD players, hundreds of millions. That's what they have to overcome. If they can overcome that deficeit in 5 years or less I would be amazed. DVD player sales didnt really take off until the $50 players started hitting the market. They also need to have movies out to convince people to buy a player, I know that I am in no rush to buy one. If you told me I could buy a BR player this summer for $100 I probably still wouldn't, there's nothing to watch on it.

 

[expletive]

Now imagine how good the PS3 projected on that wall would look.
if I had a 100" diagonal I would want Blu Ray more than anyone.

Who said I dont want it?

I was just making the point that its plenty good for most people and can still look damned good even blown up to this size... (and it looks better the smaller you go)

However if the only option was a $500 HD DVD or $1k BR player i wouldnt feel compelled to jump on board and could happily live with DVD for awhile, especially since i get quite a few movies on HD over cable now.

And btw, its 110" diagonal

 

[randycat99]

Number of HD players currently on the market, zero. Number of DVD players, hundreds of millions. That's what they have to overcome.

They don't have to "overcome". They are backwards compatible. There is no either/or proposition. They just phase in, as the content accumulates. That alone makes this a far easier/painless transition than the one from vhs to DVD ever was.

 

[Ty]

Ask the movie studios this question. They seem to expect that people will want to upgrade their collection. They've complained that DVD sales aren't increasing, mostly the reason for this is that their back catalogue has been exhausted. The only way they are going to get sales on the upswing is to either release more movies or convince people to rebuy movies on a new format.

Naturally the studios want us to re-buy the HD version but those of us on this forum don't need to buy into that POV - therefore no one should be hung up on the idea that they "have to".

See my response to bobbler earlier on this. If people arent buying old movies, then theyre only buying new movies, if theyre only buying new movies, then the 200 list of annoucned titles quickly becomes 10 or 20. Are people going to buy a new player for 10 titles each on 2 different formats this year?

I was merely speaking about the perspective that some have shown here - that they feel the mandatory need to re-buy their movie collection. I don't know what the general public would do.

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Ps2

Number of HD players currently on the market, zero. Number of DVD players, hundreds of millions. That's what they have to overcome. If they can overcome that deficeit in 5 years or less I would be amazed. DVD player sales didnt really take off until the $50 players started hitting the market. They also need to have movies out to convince people to buy a player, I know that I am in no rush to buy one. If you told me I could buy a BR player this summer for $100 I probably still wouldn't, there's nothing to watch on it.

I dont think $100 BD player is available this summer but maybe in 3 years. But this year many movies will be available in BD format and soon HD monitors will be affordable for all buyers. Always prices are coming down.

 

[LunchBox]

I think you will find most PS3 buyers will be adults (over 18) and this market buys many movies and games. But they also buy adult movies. Do you not think it is only short time before 1080P adult film is made? How much is adult film DVD market? Now they will all want 1080P adult film. Why do you think Sony showed 1080P camera at CES? They know adult entertainment market is always on cutting edge of technology.

i dunno if watching HD adult movies is a good idea...

talk about those rashes/blemishes that will be severely noticable in hd...

or the hairy ass when the camera rotates underneath them while they're banging...

and dirty undergarments...

or the money shot where even the pores and pimples of their skin can be seen...

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Adult movie

i dunno if watching HD adult movies is a good idea...

talk about those rashes/blemishes that will be severely noticable in hd...

or the hairy ass and dirty undergarments...

or the money shot where even the pores and pimples of their skin can be seen...

Maybe this is why it is said "less is more"?

 

[expletive]

i dunno if watching HD adult movies is a good idea...

talk about those rashes/blemishes that will be severely noticable in hd...

or the hairy ass when the camera rotates underneath them while they're banging...

and dirty undergarments...

or the money shot where even the pores and pimples of their skin can be seen...

Very graphic and (unfortunately) probably very accurate...

 

[aaronspink]

To me pleased means less than $30-$35 personnally.

To me pleased means the same price as DVD. Pretty simple really, though Sony's idea of pleased and mine are probably radically different.

 

[aaronspink]

Box office income is dropping heavily as well.
2003 had 21 movies with over 200 million worldwide, and 4 above 500 million.
2004 had 24 above 200 million and 7 above 500.
2005 had only 16 over 200 million and 4 above 500. It was worse than 2003, not just 2004.

Now I don't know about DVD sales for new movies, but there are two possibilities... People either decide to spend their money on the DVD, instead of going into the theatre multiple times; or they don't care as much about the new movies at all, because they're getting worse and worse...

Don't forget about more and more expensive. When movies started costing more than $10 I curtailed my movie going considerably.