Koei on Ps3 Costs

[Shifty Geezer]

Even if the PS3 resides most of the time inthe bedroom instead of the living room, I'm sure people will buy BRDs over DVDs and just move the console downstairs to use it's BlueRay output. I know before we got a DVD player I used the PS2 this way. And we only got a DVD player because was chucking one out, otherwise I'd have been doing this for longer until out of convenience we bought a cheapo DVD player. I'll be gobsmacked if anyone with HDTV and PS3 won't buy BRD movies. Gobsmacked AND dumbfounded!

 

[London Geezer]

I'll be gobsmacked if anyone with HDTV and PS3 won't buy BRD movies. Gobsmacked AND dumbfounded!

Flabbergasted!

 

[expletive]

Even if the PS3 resides most of the time inthe bedroom instead of the living room, I'm sure people will buy BRDs over DVDs and just move the console downstairs to use it's BlueRay output. I know before we got a DVD player I used the PS2 this way. And we only got a DVD player because was chucking one out, otherwise I'd have been doing this for longer until out of convenience we bought a cheapo DVD player. I'll be gobsmacked if anyone with HDTV and PS3 won't buy BRD movies. Gobsmacked AND dumbfounded!

Well i certainly wouldnt want anyone to be gobsmacked or dumbfounded!

I do agree when you get all the pieces in place -- buyer buys a PS3, buyer has an HDTV, buyer has PS3 connected to HDTV, buyer buys movies instead of rents, movie buyer wants is available on BDR, people will buy them.

I dont think the average consumer, especially those without an HD TV, will drag a game console around the house to play HD movies when they cant take advantage of it, or that movie isnt available. (Remember, roughly half the movies released wont even be on either format.)

J

 

[Black Dragon37]

We've gone totally off topic!

This is about the cost of the PS3 development and console price, not about the format wars!

 

[expletive]

We've gone totally off topic!

This is about the cost of the PS3 development and console price, not about the format wars!

Well it was off when i got here!!

OK no more on format adoption.

J

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Explanation

They announced the price of the PS3?

Do you think it will cost $1000?

I dont see what your point is. Movies getting sold will declare the winner, if there is one.

Would you buy DVD movie if you did not have a DVD player?

In spite of their cost, tons of PCs get sold in the US every year. The number of those being Win MCE versions is approaching 50%. APparently the 360 will be able to stream media from a MCE pc in your house so while the 360 can be its own 'media center' theres a value-add proposition for people with Win MCE, they can stream music, photos, and programs recorded off TV to any 360, thats cool.

Are you saying almost 50% of PCs sold are MCE PC's? Where do you get this statistic? Also, what is point of having MCE and another media controller and how many main-stream consumers can afford and be able to configure multiple media controllers?

Thats a big assumption that there will be a disparate isntall base of BR compared to HD-DVD. I think we need to wait a 18 months and see what MS has done with MCE and the 360 in terms of HD-DVD, and intel with their plans before we assume this. These are all huge companies and they will use their leverage to support their format.

Only way HD-DVD can match BR sale is if HD-DVD is in Xbox360.

 

[jvd]

Only way HD-DVD can match BR sale is if HD-DVD is in Xbox360.

Or if the titles people want are on hd-dvd not bluray . Or if hd-dvd titles are cheaper and have more of hte titles people want , or if hd-dvd has hybrid discs out of the gate so a person can play the movies on thier hd-dvd or in thier dvd player at one price ponit .

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Or if the titles people want are on hd-dvd not bluray.

That ones not so likely though is it, with 6/7 majour studios releasing (or claiming they will) on BRD but only half releasing on HDDVD. And that alone is surely the deciding factor. I'm not going to buy dual-format HDDVD/DVDs even if cheaper and dual-purpose over BRD if I'm going to need a player that won't ever get some of the movies I want. That's no more going to happen then someone buys a GC because it's cheaper and it's games are cheaper (if they were) then XB's, if the titles they want to play are on XB and not on GC.

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Hardware first software later

Or if the titles people want are on hd-dvd not bluray . Or if hd-dvd titles are cheaper and have more of hte titles people want , or if hd-dvd has hybrid discs out of the gate so a person can play the movies on thier hd-dvd or in thier dvd player at one price ponit .

Would you buy a VHS movie if you only had a DVD player? If you didnt have either player, and the DVD player was the same price or less, which would you buy? I ask you to think of this to help you better understand situation of HD-DVD.

 

[jvd]

Would you buy a VHS movie if you only had a DVD player? If you didnt have either player, and the DVD player was the same price or less, which would you buy? I ask you to think of this to help you better understand situation of HD-DVD.

Stop making stuff up .

A better example is this .

If i walked into best buy in best buy next month and see on the shelf i dunno Lord of the rings trilogy and I see it on dvd for 100$ (all 3 movies ) bluray for a 120$ for all 3 movies or hd-dvd / dvd hybrid for a 120$ I will buy the hybrid version . Why ? Because I can watch it today and next year when i'm ready to buy a high def format i will already have a library of titles i can play on both my dvd player and my new hd-dvd player .

Because lets face it . Many people right now do not want movies they can only watch on one tv . Not many people are going to rush out and buy bluray movies for thier ps3 that may not even be on a dvi / hdmi tv . ANd thos ethat do have hd-tv only have 1 of the sets and I don't see many rushing out to buy a bluray movie library they can't watch on thier other 4 tvs in the hosue .

 

[Shifty Geezer]

If i walked into best buy in best buy next month and see on the shelf i dunno Lord of the rings trilogy and I see it on dvd for 100$ (all 3 movies ) bluray for a 120$ for all 3 movies or hd-dvd / dvd hybrid for a 120$ I will buy the hybrid version . Why ? Because I can watch it today and next year when i'm ready to buy a high def format i will already have a library of titles i can play on both my dvd player and my new hd-dvd player .

I wouldn't. I wouldn't invest in an HD format without being confident that in the future it won't be redundant and I'll need to buy a new BRD player to watch new movies and keep the old HDDVD player for when I want to watch my old dual DVD/HDDVD collection. I'll wait until one format seems to be a standard. Also in buying a format to watch now in view of playing on HD later, I could buy BRD's to play on a PS3 or BRD player and watch them on my conventional set until I upgrade, and take that collection with me. Of course I wouldn't buy a BRD player without an HDTV, but I would buy a PS3 without an HDTV. And then get BRD movies on it despite only having an SDTV set, knowing in a couple of years I'll probably have an HDTV.

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Rude.

Stop making stuff up .

It is ok to disagree but nothing gained in being rude.

A better example is this .

If i walked into best buy in best buy next month and see on the shelf i dunno Lord of the rings trilogy and I see it on dvd for 100$ (all 3 movies ) bluray for a 120$ for all 3 movies or hd-dvd / dvd hybrid for a 120$ I will buy the hybrid version . Why ? Because I can watch it today and next year when i'm ready to buy a high def format i will already have a library of titles i can play on both my dvd player and my new hd-dvd player .

Aside from why a typical consumer would pay 20% more for a disc-set that supports a media player which is beyond their means (standalone HD-DVD) and beyond their sphere of knowledge, I suppose you have a good explanation for why that store refuses to stock BD-DVD hybrids at the price point you created.

 

[scooby_dooby]

JVD is bang on the money.

The average household has 1 or 2 DVD players already, if they are going to buy a new movie they will want it to work on their nice new HD player, as well as the DVD player in their bedroom, basement, guest room etc etc

They do not want to buy 2 version of the same movie, just for different rooms in the house.

People think there's gonna be a big battle between DVD and HD-DVD/BR but I don't see why that would even be a consideration, just offer hybrid discs for a slight mark-up, you'll get the entire HDTV market, plus everyone looking to futureproof their collections.

Now before someone says that studios will be leaving money on the table by doing this, realize that the main purpose behind the new media is to provide a sales spike because DVD sales are flattening. So they're simply revitilizing a slowing market.

Forcing people to buy 2 copies of the same movie, or render their existing DVD players useless, will not provide the spike in consumer interest that they are looking for.

IMO of course.

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Not typical consumer behavior

JVD is bang on the money.

He forgot to include BD-DVD hybrid in his story, and doing so goes back to my story, which is if you already have a DVD player (PS3) why would you buy VHS?

There is reason why movie studios switching to BD. Because BD does everything HD-DVD does but better and millions of installed hardware units = millions of potential customers. Although cost has come down massively the cost is still marginally higher cost/disc to produce despite the new technique of implementing superior ultra-thin protective film (secret to higher capacity) but the gain is far superior capacity per side so in many cases no need for more expensive two-sided disc.

 

[scooby_dooby]

He forgot to include BD-DVD hybrid in his story, and doing so goes back to my story, which is if you already have a DVD player (PS3) why would you buy VHS?

1st of all, to use your analogy, everyone has 1 or 2 VHS players in their home, they don't want to throw those away, and if it were possible to have a format that plays on the old VHS and the new DVD that would be ideal.

Secondly, VHS and DVD are completely different formats, to the consumer they see one as a bulky VHS tape, and the other is a small DVD discs, so they won't expect that the VHS should play in their DVD player.

However DVD and BD-DVD look exactly the same, so the consumer is going to be confused about why they have to buy 2 discs, that look identical, the consumers common sense bells will start ringing and they're gonna say "Man this is stupid, these discs look exactly the same, why can't they just make one disc to play on both players??"

And the manufacturers will say "Here you go"

btw: the gain to the consumer is next to nothing, more storage capacity..hooray..they don't have a clue about storage capacities. It's not a compelling reason to upgrade, not even close to teh advantages DVD had opver VHS. All they know is HD-DVD/BR provide a slightly better picture, and so they'll only be willing to pay "slightly" more. And they certainly aren't going to abandon hundreds of dollars worth of DVD players that still provide an excellent picture.

 

[randycat99]

You are absolutely amazing to actually be oblivious to the state HD-DVD is in, right now. No one demands you to suddenly become a BR supporter...but at least show some smidgen of rationality and acknowledge that HD-DVD is juuuust possibly in a precarious position, where BR is really lining up. It's not about brand loyalties, to realize this. It's not about how many VCR's and DVD players are in a typical home. It's not about whether something looks bulky or looks confusingly similar. It is plain simple interpretation of the news events that stand right before your face.

 

[jvd]

wouldn't. I wouldn't invest in an HD format without being confident that in the future it won't be redundant and I'll need to buy a new BRD player to watch new movies and keep the old HDDVD player for when I want to watch my old dual DVD/HDDVD collection.

In my example dvd wont be hd and bluray is hd only .

So your going to buy a non hd format for 20$ less than both non hd and hd formats .

That is the point of my point .


You get both hd and sd on one format for am odest increase in price over just the sd version or for the same cost as just the hd version .

IN my example even if hd-dvd dies a slow death I can still buy a player at a cheap price and enjoy my dvd - hd -dvd collection with only a small investment . Which would be one hd-dvd player for my most likely one hd-tv set that can support it (i was a stupid early adopter who had component inputs and vga ) and i can use it in all my dvd players in the house which total another 5 units .

So to me and most people who have multiple dvd units it wont be a waste .

However investing in hd formats that only give u hd discs is a lossing choice as if one goes south your stuck with media that only works on that unit .


Now if bluray comes out with dual format discs so that i can start building a collectin before making a huge jump we can talk about it . But i have yet to hear anything about avalibilty of anything but sl bluray discs and from what i hear from all the posts here the bluray discs may have a large premium .


As much as people want to make it look like bluray holds all the cards it does not and its anyones market and toshiba could dick sony and make them both loosing formats

 

[ihamoitc2005]

missing the point

1st of all, to use your analogy, everyone has 1 or 2 VHS players in their home, they don't want to throw those away, and if it were possible to have a format that plays on the old VHS and the new DVD that would be ideal.

Sorry I was not clear. I was merely using current media to describe situation in 2007 when many will have Blu-Ray drive but no HD-DVD drive. Why would they buy HD-DVD media?

Next year, typical consumers will continue to buy cheap DVDs to play on their normal DVD player on their normal TV and seldom will be convinced to shell out extra for BD-DVD or HD-DVD hybrids while growing millions of Blu-Ray drives owners will switch to buying BDs and they might even buy hybrids to cover DVD drives they already own for use in multiple rooms.

Secondly, VHS and DVD are completely different formats, to the consumer they see one as a bulky VHS tape, and the other is a small DVD discs, so they won't expect that the VHS should play in their DVD player.

That VHS vs DVD story describes the millions who will already own Blu-Ray drives in 2007 who would not waste money on HD-DVD which like VHS not playing DVD will not play in Blu-Ray although it does look similar.

btw: the gain to the consumer is next to nothing, more storage capacity..hooray..they don't have a clue about storage capacities. It's not a compelling reason to upgrade, not even close to teh advantages DVD had opver VHS. All they know is HD-DVD/BR provide a slightly better picture, and so they'll only be willing to pay "slightly" more. And they certainly aren't going to abandon hundreds of dollars worth of DVD players that still provide an excellent picture.

Precisely. This year and much of next year most consumers do not know what HD-DVD or Blu-Ray is and dont care. Promises of higher resolution and sound alone wont make most people pay more for hybrid disks when their existing TV and playback hardware will not support new features and they cant afford fancy stand-alone players which will be very expensive next year.

Therefore 2007, when HD TV's will be affordable to most, will be first big year in HD media sales and this is where huge installed base of PS3 gives Blu-Ray huge advantage.

 

[scooby_dooby]

The other factor to consider though, is you have a solid 15-20 million people who spent thousands of dollars on a HDTV set. These people will be looking to maximise their investment, by getting HD-DVD/BD's.

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Yes.

The other factor to consider though, is you have a solid 15-20 million people who spent thousands of dollars on a HDTV set. These people will be looking to maximise their investment, by getting HD-DVD/BD's.

Yes, you are right that is very important demographic. Many of those might consider paying extra for fancy stand-alone player and many others will simply buy a PS3. Until many people even know that Blu-Ray and HD-DVD exists it is unlikely to be big independant movement next year but group you mentioned might be key to creating and spreading the hype of next-gen media format. Most of the market which is regular consumers who wont yet be able to afford HD tv sets wont move till 2007.