Digital Foundry Article Technical Discussion Archive [2015]

[Shortbread]

Why would the devs invest in something that is better, put it only on PS4 and not on PC?? Doesn't make sense imo. PS4 is missing stuff.

Just another super bad PS4 port...every other multiplat game shows nowadays an unpolished PS4 version which gets patched later on.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Odd one, GI is clearly missing in those screens and video linked too but in some examples the lack of GI looks better (subjective, I know!). I'm guessing because in a few circumstances the GI implementation used by JC3 results in an overly bright rendition of the environment, e.g. light bouncing from light sand on light-coloured barrels. Sometimes realism << aesthetic. But GI doesn't necessarily = realism, it's an implementation/interpretation of how light should act.

I'm sure this is a bug/oversight rather than an aesthetic choice though.

 

[Scott_Arm]

Definitely not an aesthetic choice, or they never would have put it in any of the versions in the first place.

 

[onQ]

Why would the devs invest in something that is better, put it only on PS4 and not on PC?? Doesn't make sense imo. PS4 is missing stuff.

Just another super bad PS4 port...every other multiplat game shows nowadays an unpolished PS4 version which gets patched later on.

I think it's because the games are made for DirectX then ported to PS4.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

There's nothing over the top. A white container receiving bounce lighting from sand in the middle of the day looks exactly like that.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-paUXjdihXwI/TwdPfl7mUgI/AAAAAAAAANs/l799Oft1kO0/s1600/IMG_1573.JPG

The jeans in that first comparison pic look more realistic with light from the sand, but the barrels and silos, not so much. The PS4 version has plenty of secondary lighting from somewhere.
In other aspects it's even more jarring, like the protagonist's orange arm in the second image. GI doesn't cause fake tan syndrome when implemented correctly (unless standing on orange terrain). A couple of similarish real-life lighting situations, although of course it's impossible to find something truly comparable.
http://madalasafaris.net/african-cape-buffalo-hunt.jpg
http://baciliotreeservice.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Bacilio-Tree-Service-26.jpg

Ultimately neither solution, with or without, works terribly well for realism. That said, I acknowledge the effect isn't present as user542745831 explained via the PC GI setting, and technically a GI solution should be in effect to be more realistic than not. For the purposes of this discussion we need stick to the absence of the 'GI lighting pass' being present in the PS4 version.

 

[Clukos]

I seriously couldn't stop looking at that without noticing the lack of GI. Here is the PC/X1 version:

Hope they release a patch really fast.

 

[user542745831]

Here is a video which is showing the Global Illumination in Just Cause 3 quite well:

At the beginning of the video you see the vehicle driving through grass and flowers.

As you can see, the red light from the red flowers/blossoms is shining onto the vehicle, which looks very nice. Also the greenish light from the grass can also be seen on the vehicle. Very nice.

By the way, at around 00:15 min, you can also see the bug which has been mentioned in the Digital Foundry face-off article:

[...] the use of global illumination are identical across all three formats - though the latter feature is bugged on PC, and can produce an off-putting strobe effect. [...]

As you can see, at around 00:15 min, the vehicle suddenly starts to flicker, which is caused by the Global Illumination flickering/strobing bug.

It would be interesting to know if the Global Illumination in the Xbox One version also has this flickering/strobing bug.

Author is someone else.

Yeah, but @grandmaster is his boss and the head of Digital Foundry AFAICT, so it would still be appropriate to ask him and to address this issue directly to him.

But, if you know the Beyond3D forum user name of this "David Bierton", then, well, please feel free to enlighten us.

 

[L. Scofield]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-paUXjdihXwI/TwdPfl7mUgI/AAAAAAAAANs/l799Oft1kO0/s1600/IMG_1573.JPG
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-paUXjdihXwI/TwdPfl7mUgI/AAAAAAAAANs/l799Oft1kO0/s1600/IMG_1573.JPG
The jeans in that first comparison pic look more realistic with light from the sand, but the barrels and silos, not so much. The PS4 version has plenty of secondary lighting from somewhere.http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-paUXjdihXwI/TwdPfl7mUgI/AAAAAAAAANs/l799Oft1kO0/s1600/IMG_1573.JPG

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-paUXjdihXwI/TwdPfl7mUgI/AAAAAAAAANs/l799Oft1kO0/s1600/IMG_1573.JPG
Considering how dark the shadow in your shot is, it's clearly underexposed compared to the JC3 shots:

Not to mention, a blue container vs a white one. lol.

In other aspects it's even more jarring, like the protagonist's orange arm in the second image. GI doesn't cause fake tan syndrome when implemented correctly (unless standing on orange terrain).

Nothing jarring, that's how bounce lighting looks like.

A couple of similarish real-life lighting situations, although of course it's impossible to find something truly comparable.
http://madalasafaris.net/african-cape-buffalo-hunt.jpg
http://baciliotreeservice.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Bacilio-Tree-Service-26.jpg

http://baciliotreeservice.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Bacilio-Tree-Service-26.jpg
Those shots are nothing like it.

Ultimately neither solution, with or without, works terribly well for realism. That said, I acknowledge the effect isn't present as user542745831 explained via the PC GI setting, and technically a GI solution should be in effect to be more realistic than not. For the purposes of this discussion we need stick to the absence of the 'GI lighting pass' being present in the PS4 version.

Yes, looks more realistic with GI on.

 

[Globalisateur]

Considering how dark the shadow in your shot is, it's clearly underexposed compared to the JC3 shots:

Not to mention, a blue container vs a white one. lol.


Nothing jarring, that's how bounce lighting looks like.

Those shots are nothing like it.


Yes, looks more realistic with GI on.

The barrels look realistic enough (if you can imagine that a flashlight directly illuminates those barrels or that there was still an explosion around the character), but that's OK. But what about the 4 tanks on the background? IMO GI destroys the detailed shadows without bringing the same sort of lighting touch on it.

 

[goonergaz]

regardless of what's missing (or not) IMHO (and very untrained eye) the PS4 version looks more realistic.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

The barrels look realistic enough (if you can imagine that a flashlight directly illuminates those barrels or that there was still an explosion around the character), but that's OK. But what about the 4 tanks on the background? IMO GI destroys the detailed shadows without bringing the same sort of lighting touch on it.

That's an aesthetic discussion. If people really want to talk about whether JC3 looks better with or without GI, it needs its own thread. This thread is focussing on why the feature that enables realtime bounce light is absent on the PS4 build.

 

[L. Scofield]

The barrels look realistic enough (if you can imagine that a flashlight directly illuminates those barrels or that there was still an explosion around the character), but that's OK. But what about the 4 tanks on the background? IMO GI destroys the detailed shadows without bringing the same sort of lighting touch on it.

Somebody needs to step outside more often, lol. As for the barrels, there's no GI involved there. The grunge texture on the tanks is stronger in the PS4 version. This is easily visible even on the bright side of the tanks.

 

[Deleted member 86764]

Apart from his initial sentence, I actually agree with L. Scofield on this.

PS4 definitely doesn't appear to have the GI and it's at a slight disadvantage because of it.

 

[London Geezer]

I step outside very often but never spend much time checking tanks and barrels.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

I step outside very often but never spend much time checking tanks and barrels.

Your haven't lived!

 

[Cyan]

.

Is that a picture from a game or is it real? If that's the first case, that's a GREAT example of good GI. Everything looks real to me in that picture.

As for GI, which is better and whatnot, it's one of those features I like the most in games. The absence of it in JC3 -in some instances on PC according to DF, and PS4, judging from images- is a big win for the X1 version, which in turn seems to be a complete disaster in other regards, sadly. But GI is a must in games like Quantum Break or JC3, it makes everything look more believable.

 

[London Geezer]

Your haven't lived!

Maybe that's what's been missing from my life this whole time.

 

[Scott_Arm]

There are really four options:
1) removed intentionally because of performance
2) removed intentionally because it was bugged
3) included but bug prevents it from showing
4) unintentionally shipped without feature

Option 1 really isn't likely at all. Option 2 doesn't make a lot of sense. The game has already been patched, I think. Not sure what the issue would be. My guess is 3 or 4.

 

[zed]

GI doesn't cause fake tan syndrome when implemented correctly

Its just the developers have turned everything up to 11 so its in your face, like they do with any new tech/fx, eg lensflares,bloom,AO. Newer games will tone it down like they always do.
Definitely a major plus for the xbox1, pretty bad DF missed it

 

[Scott_Arm]

In the grand scheme of things, I don't think GI is really a big deal. The only question I have is whether GI is running on PS4 and just not showing, or if it's totally absent and will affect performance if they add it in.