They described Part1 remake as a project for new arrivals to get up and running on ND tech. And in 2023 after multiplayer project started idling, they probably had many devs without anything to work on.
Digital Foundry Article Technical Discussion [2024]
- Thread starter Shifty Geezer
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It's definitely a remaster, just a far more basic one than we've gotten used to.
I'm still curious why Naughty Dog seem so reluctant to use reconstruction, though. TLOU Part 1 has it on PC with FSR2 and DLSS, and it shows it works fine, but for some reason ND sticks purely to native resolutions on console, even with these PS5 versions of their games. Given how it runs at 60fps at 1440p, I'd very much like to have seen them done a '4k reconstruction' mode also aiming at 60fps. I have to imagine this would have been preferable to native 1440p, especially when I imagine most people playing this on PS5 are doing so on a 4k TV. I feel like this would have been the sweetspot, as a more 'minimal compromise' option that gamers would have appreciated. 4k/30fps versus 1440p/60fps feels like such an unnecessarily divided set of options this day and age.
Is suspect the work to get them to reconstruction maybe extensive and thus cost prohibiting for something in which an alternative exists.
It looks stunning in 4K and plays smoothly with VRR. Or if you want more FPS there's perf VRR. I'm really enjoying my play through on Hard+. Forgot what a great TPS this is.
Here I 100% agree with ND take on this. Better stay with clean native 1440p than fake 1800-ish with tons of artefacts in motion (or not). Seriously I now find those consoles games using FSR performance ugly.
They don't use DRS either. Why not have a 4K/w DRS mode? 60fps is too much to ask for at 4K, but it's also too easy at 1440p to the point that it runs at up to 100fps. Surely, they could do something like 1800p with DRS up to 4K and easily maintain 60.
Flappy Pannus
Veteran
I'd say 'remaster' is really stretching it yeah, but the simple LOD + Aniso filtering improvements make a surprisingly large difference considering so much of the gameplay is in large areas with lots of vegetation. The pop-in was really noticeable before this, now it's an incredibly stable image, perhaps one of the most I've seen. Still just a stunning game visually, despite barely being overhauled from a game targeting a console with less than 5GB of available ram. There are some spots where the texture budget constraints can show and I would have liked to see at least those assets touched up for sure, but for the most part they know what to focus on.
Also a great improvement is the loading times, really helps to skip the godawful story and get back into the combat (throws smoke bomb, runs
).I have higher hopes for the PC port because of its origins - but then again, Uncharted 4 was also barely changed from the original and it had well outsized GPU requirements. I doubt this will change whenever this arrives. I don't expect vram struggles but expect as usual for this engine you'll need something far more than a 2070 super to reach PS5 equivalence.
I only have Oliver's footage to go by, so I'll take your word that in various areas there is a noticeable difference.I'd say 'remaster' is really stretching it yeah, but the simple LOD + Aniso filtering improvements make a surprisingly large difference considering so much of the gameplay is in large areas with lots of vegetation. The pop-in was really noticeable before this, now it's an incredibly stable image, perhaps one of the most I've seen. Still just a stunning game visually, despite barely being overhauled from a game targeting a console with less than 5GB of available ram. There are some spots where the texture budget constraints can show and I would have liked to see at least those assets touched up for sure, but for the most part they know what to focus on.
Also a great improvement is the loading times, really helps to skip the godawful story and get back into the combat (throws smoke bomb, runs
I have higher hopes for the PC port because of its origins - but then again, Uncharted 4 was also barely changed from the original and it had well outsized GPU requirements. I doubt this will change whenever this arrives. I don't expect vram struggles but expect as usual for this engine you'll need something far more than a 2070 super to reach PS5 equivalence.
If you watched the 4070 Super review by Rich, TLOU Remake is still by far the most askew performance comparison I can think of in recent memory. I thought they had improved performance beyond just the CPU but I guess not.
davis.anthony
Veteran
It's the game, DLSS performance scaling still also sucks in it.
It's also difficult to get a hard lock on PS5's actual settings, as they change depending on what source you use.
The GPU performance is still horrendous in that game. The 4070S is only 36% faster at 4K. I understand that its 192-bit bus makes it slower at 4K compared to a 3080 or even 2080 Ti, but this puts the PS5's performance in the ballpark of the latter which is insane given the fact that it routinely outperforms the PS5 by over 30%.
Flappy Pannus
Veteran
It does, albeit like I said it's still really goosing the term to call it a remaster. They at least priced the upgrade accordingly.
Yeah they never really improved it in that regard, you see a lot of recent Steam reviews that say the port is 'great' now, but the GPU performance has always remained pretty brutal. My guess is TLOU2:RM will be using the same PC port of the engine, so the pessimist in me expects that 3080/4070 class card necessary (pre-DLSS mind you) to get PS5+~30% level performance once again. We'll see. Really surprised it never got native DLSS3 support too, considering its GPU demands it seemed like it would be a no-brainer patch eventually.
Still, in a far better spot that Dead Space/Jedi Survivor, simply because it seems you can at least brute force your way to a very good experience - that's really in the 'good old days' of unoptimized PC ports.
Taking it from the disaster zone into 'just' a GPU hungry game is something, hell of a lot more effort than EA has shown.
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Cost prohibiting? For Naughty Dog?
Also, reconstruction is like completely bog standard nowadays and we've had implementations of it since the PS4 Pro came out in 2016. Naughty Dog also clearly got it running in TLOU Part 1 on PC without any issue.
There's also no 'alternative' here, they are simply running TAA with a standard resolution. It does look clean enough, but they could likely get 60fps with >1440p image quality using reconstruction.
Maybe one of their tech leads for their main console versions is simply some purist who dislikes reconstruction or something?
davis.anthony
Veteran
The games TAA is actually poor and FSR 2 offers a noticeable increase in IQ, as observed in the PC version.
So I wouldn't expect FSR to look worse on PS5.
DavidGraham
Veteran
The engine doesn't scale well with GPU/CPU power, Uncharted 4 and Uncharted Lost Legacy exhibited the same issue, so it stands to reason that TLOU2 will exhibit the same thing as well.
When an engine exhibits both CPU and GPU scaling issues, you can probably blame the DX12 code of it as not being extensively optimized, it probably needs another optimization pass or two.
That’s entirely possible.
DRS and other upscaling solutions typically come out on top, but if it doesn’t work, for whatever reason, you can see them leave it out. I’m not trying to assume or explain why they didn’t do it, but if not doing is the path of least resistance, and it still looked good enough then this could be why.
It's obvious this 'remaster' is a quick PS5 port from the PS4 and the only way to justify the PC port (that is probably already done). The laughable loadings times (for a 1st party PS5 game) show this is not using specific PS5 hardware and is just benefiting from SSD raw speeds which makes perfectly sense once you consider they are likely targeting cross-compatible PC hardware.
Not really considering PCs are quite capable of the same ultra fast load times as the PS5 as shown in dozens of titles.
Far more likely its simply too much work for them to re-engineer how the game handles data loading to be worth it.
latest df direct weekly #146
0:00:00 Introduction
0:00:44 News 01: Developer_Direct 2024 reaction: Indiana Jones and the Great Circle
0:21:06 News 01: Senua’s Saga: Hellblade 2
0:33:41 News 01: Ara: History Untold
0:39:35 News 01: Visions of Mana
0:46:15 News 01: Avowed
0:54:03 News 02: Hellblade 2 to go digital-only
1:10:49 News 03: Is The Last of Us Part 2 Remastered worthwhile?
1:23:08 News 04: RTX 40 Super series reaction + Q&A
1:45:50 News 05: Bulletstorm VR is a disappointment
1:53:05 Supporter Q1: How much manpower does it take to produce current-gen 60fps patches for consoles?
1:57:32 Supporter Q2: Was 2023 the year of the in-house engine?
2:04:24 Supporter Q3: Will 2024 be the year of Linux gaming?
0:00:00 Introduction
0:00:44 News 01: Developer_Direct 2024 reaction: Indiana Jones and the Great Circle
0:21:06 News 01: Senua’s Saga: Hellblade 2
0:33:41 News 01: Ara: History Untold
0:39:35 News 01: Visions of Mana
0:46:15 News 01: Avowed
0:54:03 News 02: Hellblade 2 to go digital-only
1:10:49 News 03: Is The Last of Us Part 2 Remastered worthwhile?
1:23:08 News 04: RTX 40 Super series reaction + Q&A
1:45:50 News 05: Bulletstorm VR is a disappointment
1:53:05 Supporter Q1: How much manpower does it take to produce current-gen 60fps patches for consoles?
1:57:32 Supporter Q2: Was 2023 the year of the in-house engine?
2:04:24 Supporter Q3: Will 2024 be the year of Linux gaming?
cheapchips
Veteran
It's funny to me that while John was quick to bagsy the Indy DF review, I bet that Ara has a really interesting tech story.
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