Cheating and its implications

[YeuEmMaiMai]

from hardocp

To make an excruciatingly long story...not so long, we built a machine here to test DOOM 3 on. However, due to strenuous hardware security measures taken by id and NVIDIA to protect the DOOM 3 data from leaks, we were not able to use the scripted tools that were to make our benchmarking much speedier. To outline the facts we: A. Benchmarked on hardware put together and owned by HardOCP. B. Benchmarked using a demo recorded by id at the id offices the day of the benchmarking previously unseen by NVIDIA. c. No scripting language coded by NVIDA was used.

so you mean that B3D could not take their machine in to be tested with doom iii without contacting nVidia first?

 

[RussSchultz]

so you mean that B3D could not take their machine in to be tested with doom iii without contacting nVidia first?

For the last time: HE DIDN'T ASK FOR THAT! HE ASKED FOR THE SAME THING THAT HARDOCP AND ANANDTECH GOT!

What did they get? The red carpet treatement from NVIDIA, organized by NVIDIA, paid for by NVIDIA.

 

[Reverend]

OK here you go straight from your own forums

Beyond3D asked ID if they could get such a benchmarking opportunity and this is how it went:

B3D:"Is there any way we could work together on a similar basis as per what was accorded to HardOCP and AnandTech?"

What they replied was :

ID:"Anthony,

NVIDIA chose those outlets - we did not. It would be best to place this
request with them."

So ID (John Carmak is ID) is telling you that you will need to go through Nvidia to get a appointment with ID software.

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/viewt...t=5776&start=20

I am not totally stupid here and yes he did try to save face by chaning the demo at the last minute....

Nobody is saying you're stupid. I just think you either misunderstood the real situation due to one or two email correspondences I provided for information/clarificatio's sake or you just don't know how id Software is run or you don't understand how this whole NVIDIA arrangement was planned and executed.

First of all, John Carmack is not id -- there are other id employees in charge of making decisions or arranging for something like this and I doubt JC is the one. The id guy I corresponded with is Marty Stratton, id's Business Development Manager, a guy who not only is in charge of this kind of event but also providing exclusive screenshots to various websites. id is not run by one guy named John Carmack. JC himself has referred me to other id staff for other matters. I just don't want folks to think that JC should be solely responsible for this Doom3 benchmarking event. That was my point.

Secondly, I think JC didn't "save face" by making a last minute demo to be used. I think he was just being intelligent. It could also mean he didn't know the full details of the arrangement with NVIDIA. Like I said, id doesn't consist of just JC -- there are folks there with specific job specifications.

If this continues on in this vein, instead of the original topic started by Humus, I'm locking this thread.

 

[YeuEmMaiMai]

yeah thats like saying that the CEO of Ford did not know of problem with the Explorer and Firestone tires, while he did not know right away he and he alone is ultimately responsible for Ford's actions regarding the matter. JC runs the show so while he may not know the exact details he is ultimately responsible for his company's actions right?


yeah, thought so

Everyone is so quick to blame ATi for releasing the demo and I would almost bet my last $$ it was someone from nVidia or has something to gain by making ATi look bad....

my question still remains why does ID refer you to nVidia to set up a benchmarking session with the latest version of DOOM?

 

[Tahir2]

Everyone is so quick to blame ATi for releasing the demo and I would almost bet my last $$ it was someone from nVidia or has something to gain by making ATi look bad....

Someone from ATI got sacked for doing that.
ATI were the only ones with the alpha build.

You are no longer making any sense UMMA. Rev I suggest you lock the thread.

 

[hughJ]

idsoftware have their own CEO to "run the show" but it isn't john carmack

 

[AzBat]

You are no longer making any sense UMMA. Rev I suggest you lock the thread.

I would rather he ban him instead. No sense in stopping the conversation just because one person is ruining it.

Tommy McClain

 

[Pete]

yeah thats like saying that the CEO of Ford did not know of problem with the Explorer and Firestone tires, while he did not know right away he and he alone is ultimately responsible for Ford's actions regarding the matter. JC runs the show so while he may not know the exact details he is ultimately responsible for his company's actions right?


yeah, thought so

Everyone is so quick to blame ATi for releasing the demo and I would almost bet my last $$ it was someone from nVidia or has something to gain by making ATi look bad....

Now you're just raving. Calm down and read the facts as presented in this thread before you go off like this again. JC does not run id, and in fact is only the third-ranking person in the company in terms of ownership. He gets the most media exposure because his engines are technical marvels, consistently ahead of the curve. We'll see if id's technical dominance diminishes as JC branches off into other things (like Armadillo Aerospace) and the competition just catches up (it's bound to happen sooner or later).

I also would not doubt JC's credibility in this matter, as he's come off as eminently reasonable in the past.

Question:

my question still remains why does ID refer you to nVidia to set up a benchmarking session with the latest version of DOOM?

Answer:

so you mean that B3D could not take their machine in to be tested with doom iii without contacting nVidia first?

For the last time: HE DIDN'T ASK FOR THAT! HE ASKED FOR THE SAME THING THAT HARDOCP AND ANANDTECH GOT!

What did they get? The red carpet treatement from NVIDIA, organized by NVIDIA, paid for by NVIDIA.

 

[Reverend]

No, YEMM won't be banned because I think he's just doesn't truly understandd this particular situation... I don't myself and I'm the one corresponding with id Software! And he hasn't really insulted anyone continuously in his posting history. He's just giving his opinions, albeit sounding emotionally-driven.

I will, however, lock this thread since I think most have said what they wanted to wrt Humus' original topic question.

If Humus wants to update us on his original topic, I'm sure he won't mind starting a new thread.

If anyone wants to comment further on this Doom3 benchmarking thing, you can do so in this thread.