AMD: Volcanic Islands R1100/1200 (8***/9*** series) Speculation/ Rumour Thread

[trinibwoy]

I am actually quite happy and satisfied that they love to listen to their customers, here you can say they are much more customer-friendly than their competitor. Kudos for this.

Haha, please. If AMD lowers prices it's because they think it's in their best interest not yours. There's no entry for "customer appreciation" on a balance sheet.

Price is really the only weapon AMD has left though. They're just hoping that nVidia doesn't join them in a race to the bottom. Take away the $100 discount and all of a sudden the 290 story looks very different.

The 780 has to drop in price though. That $100 gap provides a lot of breathing room for third party overclocked 290's with better coolers that will stomp on it even more. nVidia must be pissed.

 

[trinibwoy]

Anand's conclusion is facepalm inducing. Ryan needs to learn how to reset fan settings after upgrading the drivers.

This has to be one of the strangest releases I've seen. Anandtech outright recommends against buying the card while other sites give it an editor's choice endorsement. Some sites say it's unbearably loud while others call it negligibly so. I wonder if these are signs of IHV preferences creeping into reviews. Or maybe some people are just deaf

 

[Alexko]

Price is really the only weapon AMD has left though. They're just hoping that nVidia doesn't join them in a race to the bottom. Take away the $100 discount and all of a sudden the 290 story looks very different.

That's a rather peculiar argument. Every card's story would be very different if it were $100 more expensive.

 

[trinibwoy]

That's a rather peculiar argument. Every card's story would be very different if it were $100 more expensive.

Yes, but that wasn't my point. My point was that AMD is relying very heavily on pricing to generate interest. The problem is that price is not an inherent quality of the product and can be easily matched by a competitor. Contrast that with other releases where a product earns a premium on its own merits.

The 290 only stands up well if nVidia chooses not to follow them down that path, which of course remains to be seen. At this point it's obvious that with the same disregard for power consumption and noise GK110 will be much faster than Hawaii.

Will nVidia play that game? I hope so cause I wouldn't mind a dirt cheap fully enabled 780 with a DCIII cooler.

 

[jimbo75]

Amazing how much noisier a card sounds when it's not your favourite IHV who made it. Even at barely scraping past the 5870, with astronomical price, power draw and noise, the 480 wasn't explicitly recommended against.

 

[jimbo75]

What a difference a couple of dB makes for this super quiet 55.1 dB 690 - http://www.anandtech.com/show/5805/...view-ultra-expensive-ultra-rare-ultra-fast/16

So out of all the tests we have run, this is perhaps the result we’ve been the most eager to get to. The results are simply amazing. The GTX 690 is quieter than a GTX 680 SLI alright; it’s quieter than a GTX 680 SLI whether the cards are adjacent or spaced. The difference with spaced cards is only 0.5dB under Metro, but it’s still a difference. Meanwhile with that 55.1dB noise level the GTX 690 is doing well against a number of other cards here, effectively tying the 7970 and beating out every other multi-GPU configuration on the board.

Even when you are unbearably noisy you can always look at the competition's even noisier solution and draw attention to that instead, right?

These are the noise results collected during our Crysis temperature runs. Remember how we said NVIDIA was using the fact that they launched after AMD in order to claim that they had a quieter cooler? This is the proof. The GTX 590 simply embarrasses the 6990 here; it’s not even a contest. Make no mistake: 57.9dB is not a quiet card; we’re still looking at a dual-GPU monster, but it’s not the roaring monster that the 6990 is. On a subjective level I’d say things are even better than the numbers show—the GTX 590 is lower pitched than the 6990, which improves the perceived noise.

No direct recommendation against this 590 either at a mere $700 and off-the-chart noise. Does it no longer sound so bad because it's a dual card? Or does it not matter because it's an Nvidia card making the noise?

 

[boxleitnerb]

So you didn't see that those measurements cannot be compared since the methodology obviously changed (different case, different measurement device, different distance to the noise source)?
Example:
5870 (back then): 59.3 dbA
5870 (now): 51.6 dbA

And you should also take into account that the importance of noise can change over time. Fact is, the cards are very loud according to today's standards. Dual-GPU cards are a different matter since they just generate so much heat, that you have to make some sacrifices there.

And btw, why do you have to troll and insinuate bias without having and having considered all the relevant information? That is not needed. I would rather be concerned with Anandtechs AMD-Center.

 

[Picao84]

What a difference a couple of dB makes for this super quiet 55.1 dB 690 - http://www.anandtech.com/show/5805/...view-ultra-expensive-ultra-rare-ultra-fast/16

Even when you are unbearably noisy you can always look at the competition's even noisier solution and draw attention to that instead, right?

No direct recommendation against this 590 either at a mere $700 and off-the-chart noise. Does it no longer sound so bad because it's a dual card? Or does it not matter because it's an Nvidia card making the noise?

They are comparing noise between dual GPU cards, which the 290/290X are not
And yes, the GTX480 was slammed for its noise and power consumption at the time. Please dont try to rewrite history

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Tolerable noise or not, both the 290 and the 290X are begging for 3rd party coolers.
I thought the 290 would have the OEM's avail to apply 3rd party coolers from the start.

I couldn't care less about power consumption during high loads because I doubt there are many gamers out there willing to buy a $400 graphics card who are limited to a power supply below ~600W, which should handle this card perfectly.
It's not the extra ~50W for the 8-10 weekly gaming hours I do that will make any substantial difference in the yearly electricity bill.

 

[Arty]

Amazing how much noisier a card sounds when it's not your favourite IHV who made it. Even at barely scraping past the 5870, with astronomical price, power draw and noise, the 480 wasn't explicitly recommended against.

AT reviews went down the drain the moment they started justifying the $1K pricetag for the 690 and Titan.

 

[Kaotik]

Wawawacomagain? 20% is low?

In the US I can purchase an R9280X (290X is still not a purchasable product) for 300USD free shipping. How much does the 280X cost in Euros in France after tax?

Well it averages to around 21,5% but many have 23-25%
edit:
I'm not familiar with French stores but in Finland, with 24% VAT, cheapest R9 280X is 280.80€ including shipping, which is $378.91

 

[kalelovil]

Keep in mind the competitive landscape has changed quite a lot since the GTX 590/ HD 6990, the noise gulf between the R9 290 and the GTX 780 is much larger than it was then
(and enthusiasts have become somewhat spoiled by the GTX 780/Titan first-party coolers, although there is a probably a significant materials cost to Nvidia for that).

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Please, 20% is indeed not on the high side for the EU.

His shock wasn't about 20% being low in the EU. But that in comparison to the highest tax rates in the US where only 20% of the states have a State + City tax of 10% or more. And only 1 state has sales tax for state + city over 12%.

It is indeed quite shocking for most Americans when they learn how much Europeans have to pay in sales tax (VAT).

Also why prices after currency conversion aren't comparable between the US (no tax) and EU (VAT included).

Regards,
SB

 

[3dcgi]

I wonder if everyone complaining about 290 noise levels uses stock CPU cooler. If not, why is it such an issue using after market cooler with 290? Its still gonna be cheaper and beat the crap out of 780 and Titan.

For me it would be the other way. I have a stock CPU cooler and when I had two 7970's in Crossfire the CPU cooler drowned them out. I should replace the CPU cooler, but have been lazy about it. I doubt the noise of any GPU would bother me while gaming.

 

[A1xLLcqAgt0qc2RyMz0y]

Magic 3rd party coolers

Tolerable noise or not, both the 290 and the 290X are begging for 3rd party coolers.

I thought the 290 would have the OEM's avail to apply 3rd party coolers from the start.

I have seem quotes like this one littering the forums and follow-ups to reviews and this begs the following question(s):

First, are the AMD design teams really incompetent in designing proper cooling?

Because statements like "begging for 3rd party coolers" seem to imply that they are.

Second, how will these "3rd party coolers" manage to both lower the noise and at the same time not have the GPUs throttle?

 

[jimbo75]

So you didn't see that those measurements cannot be compared since the methodology obviously changed (different case, different measurement device, different distance to the noise source)?
Example:
5870 (back then): 59.3 dbA
5870 (now): 51.6 dbA

And you should also take into account that the importance of noise can change over time. Fact is, the cards are very loud according to today's standards. Dual-GPU cards are a different matter since they just generate so much heat, that you have to make some sacrifices there.

And btw, why do you have to troll and insinuate bias without having and having considered all the relevant information? That is not needed. I would rather be concerned with Anandtechs AMD-Center.

Irrelevant, we're talking about noise plain and simple. If this 290's is unacceptable now then all those cards above it (what's that, about half of them?) must have been unacceptable back then.

They are comparing noise between dual GPU cards, which the 290/290X are not
And yes, the GTX480 was slammed for its noise and power consumption at the time. Please dont try to rewrite history

Has the noise changed due to there being two GPU's? No, the noise is the same regardless. If one card cannot be recommended simply because of noise - like this 290 was - then everything above it cannot be recommended for the same reason. No if's or buts.

Keep in mind the competitive landscape has changed quite a lot since the GTX 590/ HD 6990, the noise gulf between the R9 290 and the GTX 780 is much larger than it was then
(and enthusiasts have become somewhat spoiled by the GTX 780/Titan first-party coolers, although there is a probably a significant materials cost to Nvidia for that).

The significant cost was to the buyer, something that Ryan seems to think is quite ok even though you could slap a $60 aftermarket MK26 cooler on this 290 which would make it blow past even Titan while being much cooler and quieter.

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showpost.php?p=25180380&postcount=46

 

[trinibwoy]

Second, how will these "3rd party coolers" manage to both lower the noise and at the same time not have the GPUs throttle?

It's simple. They're bigger, badder and more expensive. The Titan cooler for example is a pretty serious piece of work.

 

[boxleitnerb]

Irrelevant, we're talking about noise plain and simple. If this 290's is unacceptable now then all those cards above it (what's that, about half of them?) must have been unacceptable back then.

Exactly...back then. Tolerance for noise at a given performance level can change over time. Therefore it is relevant.

And you still ignore the different results for the 5870, hinting at changed testing methods. ALL other cards tested back then would be much much quieter if measured the same way the 290(X) are measured today.

 

[Babel-17]

Regarding 3rd party coolers

The cooler on my HIS IceQ HD 7950 gives me cooler temp's and quiter sound than stock cooling. And it does that while exhausting the air.

So, yeah, a lot is possible. Imo this is something of a tradition for a lot of us. Those of us with more humble cases, and who don't modify stock cards cooling on our own, watch AMD roll out new cards and then we wait for, and compare, what the independent vendors can do with the design.

That was my process for my MSI 5770 Hawk, my Gigabyte HD 6870 Windforce, and now with my HIS card.

Tom's Hardware seemed to love the HIS design.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-7950-review-benchmark,3207-2.html

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-7950-review-benchmark,3207-10.html

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-7950-review-benchmark,3207-11.html

It blows away the reference card in terms of temp's and noise, even when the HIS is running at factory overclocked speeds while the reference card runs at stock speeds.

I hope HIS doesn't abandon that design. It's bulky but it does it all.

 

[kalelovil]

Second, how will these "3rd party coolers" manage to both lower the noise and at the same time not have the GPUs throttle?

Toms Hardware Guide have hard evidence of just that:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-r9-290-review-benchmark,3659-19.html

As trinibwoy said, these high-end third-party coolers are considerable pieces of engineering, and they can also assume you have decent case cooling and so don't need the video card to dump all its heat outside the case.