All purpose sales and sales rumors/anecdotes thread next gen+

[Prophecy2k]

Correct me if I’m wrong… I thought BesTV is acting like a middle man between MS and the Chinese retailers? A partnership on getting XB1 within the correct distribution channels, as well as possible future integration within IPTV setup boxes – correct?

Are there any BesTV retail stores? Or a division within BesTV that operates as a retailer?

I would be careful with possibly confusing distribution movement, with customer sold through.

I believe you're right. Those 100k XB1s are units shipped into the Chinese market. Not sales.

 

[liquidboy]

Correct me if I’m wrong… I thought BesTV is acting like a middle man between MS and the Chinese retailers? A partnership on getting XB1 within the correct distribution channels, as well as possible future integration within IPTV setup boxes – correct?

Are there any BesTV retail stores? Or a division within BesTV that operates as a retailer?

I would be careful with possibly confusing distribution movement, with customer sold through.

Correct ...

"Microsoft has with BesTV sees them having made 100,000 Xbox One SKUs"

 

[London Geezer]

Is the black market so large in China that MS (and I suspect Sony too, whenever that happens) would launch with only 100k units in a country with more than 1 billion people and where hundreds of millions are now considered middle class?

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Is the black market so large in China that MS (and I suspect Sony too, whenever that happens) would launch with only 100k units in a country with more than 1 billion people and where hundreds of millions are now considered middle class?

I guess Microsoft were hedging their bets. Xbox may not be a brand with wide recognition in China and the console may be a pale imitation of it's Western self due to censorship issues with game content, current and future. Presumably localisation isn't an entirely trivial issue so if they prepped, say 500k units, then sold 80k they'd had load of stock just sitting about.

It'll be interesting to watch how the Xbox (and eventually PlayStation) develops over the next few years and what games are available for the consoles.

 

[wco81]

Well there's a big black market for iPhones but it officially launches in China on October 17th so people who weren't paying several times the official price are probably waiting to buy.

 

[Rangers]

Is the black market so large in China that MS (and I suspect Sony too, whenever that happens) would launch with only 100k units in a country with more than 1 billion people and where hundreds of millions are now considered middle class?

It's all relative. Middle class in China is what? Nothing like middle class in USA/Europe. It would likely take a (relatively) wealthy individual in China to purchase a $600 console (it wouldn't go down that well in USA either!). But with 1 billion people, perhaps even a tiny "wealthy" fraction is enough to make a significant market eventually.

Personally I'm very surprised to the positive at 100K thrown around. For reference, the Russian launch claimed 15k preorders. Japan as we know was 23k or whatever. Heck 100k launch, if true, probably compares favorably with many EU countries outside of UK, or even UK as I believe X1 was said to have sold 364k in UK by Dec 31 2013. However we will see if China sustains.

Look at these markets as just additions to the big markets and you'll get the idea.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Is the black market so large in China that MS (and I suspect Sony too, whenever that happens) would launch with only 100k units in a country with more than 1 billion people and where hundreds of millions are now considered middle class?

I doubt the spending power of many of those will stretch to a console and games. Sales of consoles, even officially, in places like India and Brazil are very low. Plus XB isn't a hot brand in China. I wouldn't point the finger at a huge black market as reason why numbers are low. It's not like 5 million Chinese bought XB on the black market but it hasn't registered anywhere - Indonesian XB1 sales = 5,230,000. Indonesian XBLive subscribers = 200,000

 

[Prophecy2k]

Localisation is also a big issue in China,

As of course most Chinese do not speak nor read english, and most games are not localised for the Chinese market.

It will take time for the console to begin carving out for themselves a big enough market in China, before the pubs start putting real investment into localising for the Chinese market.

This is where Sony has an advantage here, as Sony HK has done alot of this in the past, and in general their localisation efforts will be more comprehensive than MS'.

It's the primary reason I think that the Ps4 will be untimately more successful in the market when it finally launches.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

It's also been mentioned the PS is actually a brand in China already.

Also worth checking history. Sony takes PS2 to China. Didn't really take the country by storm, did it? Also,

In September, Nintendo said it would start selling a console developed specifically for the Chinese market. To thwart piracy, the machine uses a flash memory card to which games can be downloaded in stores.

Ha ha! Secure flash memory, huh?

Edit: More history -
http://www.engadget.com/2013/01/30/china-console-ban/

 

[DieH@rd]

It's also been mentioned the PS is actually a brand in China already.

Also worth checking history. Sony takes PS2 to China. Didn't really take the country by storm, did it?

Oh yes it did, but not in the way that Sony would be happy about.

As for now, WiiU, Vita, 3DS, Xbone and PS4 do not support pirated games. When they do, China, Russia and Easter Europe will suddenly start purchasing console hardware in much larger quantities.

 

[tuna]

As for now, WiiU, Vita, 3DS, Xbone and PS4 do not support pirated games. When they do, China, Russia and Easter Europe will suddenly start purchasing console hardware in much larger quantities.

O was offered to buy a chipped 3ds when I was in China.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Also, Ha ha! Secure flash memory, huh?

Yes, this is very secure. You use a WORM flash card and the kiosk writing the game to the card uses a form of encryption with two key pairs; one public (the kiosk) and one private (your console).

This approach is used a lot although not in consumer products because support is an issue. If your console breaks and you buy get a new console (with a new private key), your old games don't work. But Nintendo owners are used to this stuff

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Oh yes it did, but not in the way that Sony would be happy about.

Hardware sales weren't strong though. Or are a substantial part of the worldwide sales illicit imports to China?

Yes, this is very secure. You use a WORM flash card and the kiosk writing the game to the card uses a form of encryption with two key pairs; one public (the kiosk) and one private (your console).

Oh, okay. I imagined something like DS's flash. Didn't realise the 'download' was via a custom kiosk and not the internet.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Oh, okay. I imagined something like DS's flash. Didn't realise the 'download' was via a custom kiosk and not the internet.

That's a mega assumption on my part but it seems like a logical assumption. But it's Nintendo so

{
}

 

[DieH@rd]

O was offered to buy a chipped 3ds when I was in China.

They are for emulation of DS games.

 

[London Geezer]

So the answer to my very relevant question is Yes, the black market in China is huge and will destroy the Universe as we know it. Thank you.

 

[djskribbles]

Interesting posts from Abdiel and Aquamarine at GAF regarding PS4 sales (and he touches up on XB1 a bit):
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=132780806&postcount=43
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=132782642&postcount=51
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=132785408&postcount=64

Of note:

So, I had expected the ps4 to do well, but it did very, very well. The white bundle brought in a ton of new consumers, and even some current owners (like myself, actually) bought the white one as well (I sold my launch unit to a friend who struggles with finances, letting him pay me back over time, haha). We actually cleared our stock in almost over store in our district at least once, and needed replenishment. Crazy stuff. I remain keenly interested to see how other chains reflect this, though I know the game stop near my home did impressive numbers as well.

The XB1 still sold well, and certainly didn't lose momentum from the previous month, but there was a distinct gap in sales. Very distinct. Though I don't think anyone assumed the XB1 would win Destiny month.

Yeah I've heard this from multiple places.

Destiny + White Glacier PS4 = Massive sales.

Comparing to last year is... Hm. There was a tremendous upswell around the new unit and Destiny as a franchise just was a clincher (even though you only save $10 on the game!). I'll honestly say it was kind of surprising how many people really were excited about the fact that the system was white, and how clean/sleek it looks in that color... even with all that, we were still selling black units too, they didn't really see much of a downswing, just the white had the star power status. Despite the chaos, I don't think it really aligns quite with launch last year, where we had people camped out more than a couple days, due to the hitting shipment capacity, etc. We ran out of stock at stores, definitely, but we also restocked very quickly, and the levels of inventory on those shipments weren't 'launch' shipments, if that makes sense. Very manageable levels, just... very successful.

The more interesting part is that he says there wasn't much of a downswing for the regular black model, which I was expecting to see a drop there.
With the PS4's 190-200k baseline, I think the PS4 will sell >500k in September.

I can echo his findings here in Canada. The Destiny bundle was sold out at all online retailers in the weeks after launch and many people struggled to find them in store as well. Only fairly recently did supply meet demand.

 

[DrJay24]

The more interesting part is that he says there wasn't much of a downswing for the regular black model, which I was expecting to see a drop there.

That is in-line with Amazon where the black was right next to the white in hourly sales, it did not fade off into the distance like with some of the XB1 bundles which just replaced whatever SKU was around.

 

[Rangers]

Hardware sales Amazon September:

#6 Destiny PS4 bundle
#11 PS4
#28 Regular Xbox One

August for comparison

#4 Regular PS4
#8 PS4 Destiny bundle (but pre-orders only)
#50 Madden Xbox One bundle
#58 Regular Xbox One

Also from Auqamarine at GAF, Highest ever Septembers (not sure why she didn't mention 360 or what 360's highest September was):

PS2 - 532K (September 2002)

PS3 - 492K (September 2009)

Wii - 687K (September 2008)

So those predicting 700k+ PS4 are likely...overly bullish LOL. My gut feel at first was 300-400k. But >400k (lets say 413k or 438k) seems possible when I think about it more.

 

[djskribbles]

This is is an unusual case that possibly hasn't happened before. 3 months of pre-orders, plus 1 whole month of sales. A high profile game bundled in, and a sleek white console -- a color that many people love. Plus a baseline of ~190-200k of the regular model.

I'm thinking it's gonna be in the 500-600k range, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was higher.