Xbox360, so where the hell is the AA?
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Console Technology means, that the only discussions allowed here are about technology, not about snide remarks and who are or not pushing an agenda.
If someone have something to say on topic, the X360 AA in this case, then participate, if someone have nothing but uncalled for and unnecessary comments about people's interests and motivations, then leave that for the General Discussion forum.
I pruned all the irrelevant posts.
Just address the points made, not the person who actually made those points.
Console Technology means, that the only discussions allowed here are about technology, not about snide remarks and who are or not pushing an agenda.
If someone have something to say on topic, the X360 AA in this case, then participate, if someone have nothing but uncalled for and unnecessary comments about people's interests and motivations, then leave that for the General Discussion forum.
I pruned all the irrelevant posts.
Just address the points made, not the person who actually made those points.
as someone else that has a 360 and an hdtv i thought id chime in here. pgr3 gives me a headache is looks so bad. yes i said it. sure overall the game looks good, and if you squint your eyes it looks fantastic. i thought at first there was NO anti aliasing because of how blocky everything is. but when i stop the car and look there is some.. very little. i think the bigger problem is the texture filtering, its bilinear AT BEST. its horrible.
im used to playing pc games on this same tv and in all honesty, a pc running in 480 with 4xaa and even simple trilinear filtering looks MUCH sharper than pgr3 at 720 or 1080.
im sure lots of people will argue with what im saying but ive played tons of games on my tv and know what it looks like and is capible of. my suggestion is to get a bigger or shaper tv if you dont see a problem with jaggies in pgr3. or maybe get your eyes checked.
im used to playing pc games on this same tv and in all honesty, a pc running in 480 with 4xaa and even simple trilinear filtering looks MUCH sharper than pgr3 at 720 or 1080.
im sure lots of people will argue with what im saying but ive played tons of games on my tv and know what it looks like and is capible of. my suggestion is to get a bigger or shaper tv if you dont see a problem with jaggies in pgr3. or maybe get your eyes checked.
BigGamer X
Newcomer
I own a JVC 56" HD-ILA (LCOS) TV. It is 720P native. I have had my 360 hooked up VGA (took it off because no matter what I did it left borders....leaving me with a 52" viewing area) and now on component. Everything is set up right. Now matter what I do, (720P, 1080i, 480P, turning sharpness on TV all the way down) there are always jaggies on the car roofs on both PGR3 and Ridge Racer 6. If I turn the TV to PIP, that leaves a 32 1/2" 16:9 window.....magically the jaggies are gone then! At 52" (with VGA) they were slightly less apparent. To the people with 34-36" CRTs saying there are no jaggies, they are right, FROM THEIR POINT OF VIEW. 
(and no the TV is not junk, it shows a very detailed, bright, flicker free image, it's even smooth and film like compared to other TVs its size, but nothing can hide jaggies at 56" if they are there!)
(and no the TV is not junk, it shows a very detailed, bright, flicker free image, it's even smooth and film like compared to other TVs its size, but nothing can hide jaggies at 56" if they are there!)
BigGamer X said:
And there you go. 720p on a 56" TV? On a screen that huge, the pixels are the same size as 480p on a 37" TV. And obviously, you can see jaggies in current-gen games on a 37" TV regardless of how much FSAA is applied. However, I will point out that 480i/480p games using just about any amount of AA (even if not true FSAA) look really good on my 24" TV when I sit at a reasonable distance. Also, doesn't PGR3 render internally with 600 lines?
That's one thing abou the "HD era" that I'm not thrilled about. I just don't think 720 lines is a huge number. Sure, it's better than 480, but it's not that great.
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It is nearly 3 times the pixels between the two, and that is just comparing 720p to 480p. 480i is lesser in was as well, so the move to 720p (albit slightly incomplete considering PGR3) is quite a big step up. No, nothing gets rid of the jaggies but upping the rendering resolution helps make them less obvious. That said, I'd rather play games like CoD2 at 856x480 with x4aa and x16af rather than the 1280x720 with no AA or AF at alll that we get in the game on the 360.
kyleb said:
It's not almost 3 times as much. It's 2.24 times as much. How big a step up that is visually depends on how good your vision is, what size screen you have, and how far away you sit. On a 56" TV, 720p is nowhere near high-res enough to hide the pixellation of the image. You know, kind of like if you get right up next to a Jumbotron, all you see is a blurry mess.
What do you mean by "not perfect"? Do you mean like it is using AA here and there on the first person view weapon models and such like many console games have been doing for years? If that is what you mean then yeah, I suppose I should have been more clear I have played a good bit of the game on a 360 and I am aware of that. By "no AA" that MSAA isn't aplied across the whole screen like it is when you turn it on in a PC game.
fearsomepirate said:
Could you show your math? I don't see how you got that.
480p = 720 x 480 = 345,600
720p = 1280 x 720 = 921,600
That looks like 2 and 2/3's difference to me.
It is still nearly 3 times less "a blurry mess" or whatever you want to call it than what you get a 480p, so I don't see your point.fearsomepirate said:
kyleb said:
Technically, a normal 4:3 480p display is 640x480, making the 720p a 3x jump. 720x480 and 856x480 are psuedo 480p (480p is a 4:3 standard from what I've seen) -- they are wide screened version of it which (856x480 is a ~16:9 and would yield a ~2.24, so thats what I assume he was using). As far as I know 720x480 and 852x480 aren't really used for anything (I can't think of anything for certain that I know is either of those resolutions) -- most movies use a 2+ aspect ratio anyways, and games use 640x480 or below from what I've seen.
I'm not even sure where 720x480 even comes from -- its a weird aspect ratio (3:2).
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Neither PAL nor NTSC have square pixels if I remember right.
Ahh, I didn't even think of that. I just figured he understood the difference between rendering resoltions and the resolutions of 480p and 720p signals, but I can see where the confusion came in now.AlphaWolf said:Well perhaps he got it from the first numbers you used which was 856x480, not 720x480.
I just stumbed across the fact that Gamespot posted some captures from CoD2. They are downsampled so they aren't rightly the best way to jugde, but all the same I hope you all can see what I have been talking about when I say CoD2 has no AA:
http://www.gamespot.com/pages/image...n=Every pitched battle in the game is intense.
http://www.gamespot.com/pages/image...n=Every pitched battle in the game is intense.
ralexand said:Maybe I don't know what jaggies are anymore because when I look at this image of COD2 for the 360, I'm not seeing alot of jaggies.
This is a funny thread
Look, I have more proof that there are no jaggies in X360 games at all, none whatsoever. I took a picture with my trusted 0.1Mpix mobile phone camera:
You just linked to an image, not the feature: http://www.1up.com/do/feature?cId=3145953 The image itself looks odd, like it's zoomed in. I'll have to fire up COD2 to find the same image...one said:
Also, I'm not really sure what the point of the "feature" is: some games look like crap, therefore the Xbox 360 isn't next gen? (based on the front page headline: "Is this really the HD Era. Hmmm. Are the Xbox 360 Launch Titles truly Next Gen?") But whatever it takes to drive click-thrus, I suppose.
.Sis
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