Xbox Showcase 2023 (June 11th)

[Seanspeed]

No AAA game is made by a single studio anymore.

The amount of outsourcing is massive, it’s not about saving money, it’s about actually being able to deliver. It just requires too much work to complete a high end AAA game now.

It's almost like I referenced this already. But the point was made that The Initiative was not a 'traditional' studio specifically because it was outsourcing far more than other studios already do.

And yes, it's absolutely about saving money. You think it's a coincidence like half these outsourcing studios tend to be located in like Indonesia and Malaysia and whatnot?

Of course games today require huge workforces, but the point is that instead of hiring local in-studio employees, they outsource and have loads of temporary hires and whatnot. It's ALL about saving costs, who are you kidding? In-house, professional employees in places like the US demand well paid salaries and of course these studios are trying to avoid paying that. Hence all the outsourcing.

 

[iroboto]

It's almost like I referenced this already. But the point was made that The Initiative was not a 'traditional' studio specifically because it was outsourcing far more than other studios already do.

And yes, it's absolutely about saving money. You think it's a coincidence like half these outsourcing studios tend to be located in like Indonesia and Malaysia and whatnot?

Of course games today require huge workforces, but the point is that instead of hiring local in-studio employees, they outsource and have loads of temporary hires and whatnot. It's ALL about saving costs, who are you kidding? In-house, professional employees in places like the US demand well paid salaries and of course these studios are trying to avoid paying that. Hence all the outsourcing.

That’s not necessarily true. It’s just incredibly hard to find all this talent. Ubisoft is the only AAA publisher that does minimal outsourcing, but they’ve a great deal of many studios around the world that specialize in different things.

Ubisoft Toronto has a large motion capture facility, they Toronto office is responsible for a lot of mocap and cinematics for several different titles; they are seldom used to be the main studio to developing a title.

All studios offers something, and most games need everything. If you don’t have the talent in house you’re going to go to external studios that offer that specialty. There’s nothing necessary special about doing everything from scratch in house, except that it’s just expensive to run if you can’t have all your resources constantly working on projects.

It is just plain and simple that it is not economically advantageous or feasible to keep on hand labour for every aspect of your games.

 

[Seanspeed]

I think this line of thought is somewhat misguided. The thing about large projects with lots of money involved, is that you come face first to economies of scale. Of course they are going to outsource, regardless of any acquisitions or mergers, or anything else going on. Any business is going to produce the best product they can at the lowest cost possible, because costs during production are a large part of the risk involved in releasing a product.

For frick's sake, I already addressed that all AAA companies outsource nowadays. How are y'all missing that the talking point was that The Initiative was 'not a traditional studio' in that they were outsourcing far more than normal? That was not even my talking point, I was just piggybacking off that.

My issue isn't that they are outsourcing, it's that for a brand new studio whose core team has never built a game together yet, introducing an extraordinary amount of outsourcing seems like a recipe for setbacks. Just imagine an art department lead dealing with a game in the midst of rookie turmoil, with no real set direction yet, trying to organize a dozen different outsourced asset creation studios to work on stuff that might not even be relevant for what the game might be in 12 months time.

"Any business is going to produce the best product they can" - see, that's my whole bigger point here. Microsoft/Xbox have spent over a decade now failing to deliver quality 1st party games. They aren't producing 'the best product they can' and I think strategies like this, which are centered heavily on cost cutting, are not going to help at all.

 

[cheapchips]

How are y'all missing that the talking point was that The Initiative was 'not a traditional studio' in that they were outsourcing far more than normal?

The Initiative's primary outsourcer is Crystal Dynamics. It's not clear if they're doing outsourcing beyond that partnership (unless you have additional info).

It's not outsourcing as a cheap option. It's partnering with one of the premier 3rd person action game developers in the world.

They may not have intended to go that way initially, but it's where they are today.

 

[iroboto]

How are y'all missing that the talking point was that The Initiative was 'not a traditional studio' in that they were outsourcing far more than normal? That was not even my talking point, I was just piggybacking off that.

It takes 8 years to start a studio from scratch and build it up to 400 employees. I know, I’ve been counting Ubisoft Toronto since it arrived here. They are still not at the promised 700 to the government today.

The Initiative was formed and tasked to deploy a massive AAA title in a very short amount of time.

It’s not going to happen without massive outsourcing.

 

[see colon]

For frick's sake, I already addressed that all AAA companies outsource nowadays. How are y'all missing that the talking point was that The Initiative was 'not a traditional studio' in that they were outsourcing far more than normal? That was not even my talking point, I was just piggybacking off that.

I was responding the the sentiment that they were outsourcing to skim costs while spending billions on Activision. My response was meant to convey that regardless of any acquisitions Microsoft, or any responsible publisher, would be using content creations outsourcing to keep costs in check.

 

[milk]

It’s not going to happen without massive outsourcing.

It also did not happen WITH the massive outsorcing either.

 

[iroboto]

It also did not happen WITH the massive outsorcing either.

Yup, tall ask. 50 people is barely an AA studio. They need to outsource and entire studio like CD, or something of the size of like the Embracer deal that fell through.
I don't think TI will stay this size of course. But they were given a task and a deadline.

 

[eastmen]

I wonder if it would make sense for MS just to have large groups of devs that go from game to game in the last 1-2 years of development and just have that large group continue on to the next almost complete game

 

[SmooTh]

Xbox Games Showcase followed by Starfield Direct | Xbox

Join us for the Xbox Games Showcase followed by Starfield Direct, streaming live on Sunday, June 11, 2023. Watch sneak peaks of new game trailers and get the inside scoop on world premieres and other Xbox gaming news.

www.xbox.com

The Xbox Games Showcase is your look at the new games from Xbox Game Studios, Bethesda, leading creators, and partners from around the globe coming to Xbox, Xbox Game Pass and PC Game Pass. Immediately following the Showcase stay tuned for Starfield Direct

 

[cheapchips]

This glitter trail + music tease from Xbox is almost certainly confirming Fable will be shown.

I'm expecting lovely foliage and realtime GI.

(The clip isn't actually worth a view, unless you want a preview of what it's like to have young kids)

https://twitter.com/x/status/1663651704133373953

 

[fehu]

That's what happens when an elf jerks off
Ewwwww
Please don't ask how I know it

 

[BRiT]

This glitter trail + music tease from Xbox is almost certainly confirming Fable will be shown.

My opinion: It's not Fable.

 

[cheapchips]

My opinion: It's not Fable.

Speculate or you'll be sacrificed to Fehu's randy glitter elves!

 

[BRiT]

Speculate or you'll be sacrificed to Fehu's randy glitter elves!

They were just having fun and getting engagement.

 

[fehu]

They were just having fun and getting engagement.

I don't think, they must really be dumb to do this.
In the past, they had a huge backslash for pumping hype on this kind of event and then delivering a "just normal" one.

 

[Johnny Awesome]

I think this is going to be a good show. I think this glitter tease means something Fable will be there. At least something about the direction of the game, if not actual gameplay footage.

I might be wrong, but I predict that from this Fall onwards that MS delivers AAA content on a regular basis. Maybe 2 in 2023 (Forza, Starfield). 3 in 2024 (Hellblade 2, Avowed, State of Decay 3) and 4 in 2025 (Fable, Wolfenstein, Perfect Dark, Gears 6) and beyond.

 

[cheapchips]

At least something about the direction of the game, if not actual gameplay footage.

If they have a single prerender trailer for any game or interview with no accompanying in engine footage I'm calling the whole show a write off!

 

[eastmen]

If they have a single prerender trailer for any game or interview with no accompanying in engine footage I'm calling the whole show a write off!

Why ? Even sony had a prerendered trailer with marathon

All I want is updates on the games in development as they should hopefully be getting close to the finish line. If they announce a few new games with cgi trailers then its whatever to me as long as they show progress on the other stuff.

 

[iroboto]

Why ? Even sony had a prerendered trailer with marathon

I think it's fair to say, we all think MS should aim for a higher bar than what Sony accomplished.