Xbox 360 price drops by $50

[dobwal]

Well, MS' drives are probably more than that ($20-30), to be fair. Those Newegg 20GB drives are 1.8" hard drives - where 20GB is a 'standard' size. On a 2.5" drive like the 360 uses, I would expect it to cost more. Not Betan's numbers, but more than an equivalant 1.8" 20GB.

Even 40Gb 2.5 drives go in the neighborhood of $50-$100 on new egg. There is a mail in rebate for one model that prices it at $36.00

If NewEgg can sale 2.5" 40Gb harddrives one unit at a time for $50-100 dollars then MS should be able purchase millions of 2.5" harddrive for a fraction of that price. 10 million HDD units over 2.5 years require an average production rate of ~11,000 HDDs a day, 7 days a week.

 

[scooby_dooby]

and I kinda feel these people need to be admonished for essentialy stealing, it's also sort of ironic that after all the griping about how unreliable 360 is, now the questions seems to be how can I kill it !.

It's not stealing, it's taking advantage of the system.

The same way MS took advantage of the system for 2 years, pretending there was no problem, and forcing people to pay $100+shipping to get their console fixed. They only stopped when they realized they were going to get exposed sooner rather than later.

What goes around comes around imo. And I'll feel absolutely no pangs of guilt if I decide to brick my system in the future.

 

[dobwal]

As for one $50 price-drop now, and one at Christmas, has there ever been a machine have two small drops in quick succession like that? They run the risk of annoying a lot of folk who'd have been happy to wait a few months for another $50 price drop. Not that that really matters. Sony are getting some stick from people who bought a PS3 just before the bundle appeared - people will always complain if they think things are unfair. Still, I'm just curious if it's something anyone's tried before, as I don't remember similar.

Is this anger over a price drop post purchase a real occurence?

I have encountered instances of myself and my friends going....

"What price?!!! Ahh man, I should of waited. "

I have yet to see an instance of my own personal experience or even anyone on an internet forum going....

"What price?!!! Ahh man, XXXX company is wrong for this. "

Has anybody here gotten mad at a manufacturer of a consumer electronic because of a price drop after purchase? Could you describe that event?

 

[AzBat]

MS has it own proprietary wireless standard. If MS licensed it from some third party with huge fees, then why not use something like bluetooth.

Microsoft partnered with RTX Telecom for the proprietary wireless technology, but I don't think it was ever said if Microsoft has to pay them a license fee for every controller sold or if they bought and designed the technology outright.

http://www.rtx.dk/Default.aspx?ID=951

Tommy McClain

 

[Rangers]

It's not stealing, it's taking advantage of the system.

The same way MS took advantage of the system for 2 years, pretending there was no problem, and forcing people to pay $100+shipping to get their console fixed. They only stopped when they realized they were going to get exposed sooner rather than later.

What goes around comes around imo. And I'll feel absolutely no pangs of guilt if I decide to brick my system in the future.

Yeah yeah yeah. It's still stealing in some sense, and all of us know it.

I'm not going to fight about it because in the end, message boards aside, it's not something very many people will ever take all the trouble to do.

Once my brother had a laptop under a service plan, the newer models he noticed had much better displays, he was considering a common trick where you touch a battery to the modem card and boom, fried laptop with no trace, new model for replacement.

I think most people can clearly see that's wrong and this is no different.

 

[AlphaWolf]

It's not stealing, it's taking advantage of the system.

Actually its fraud.

 

[Daozang]

It's not stealing, it's taking advantage of the system.

The same way MS took advantage of the system for 2 years, pretending there was no problem, and forcing people to pay $100+shipping to get their console fixed. They only stopped when they realized they were going to get exposed sooner rather than later.

What goes around comes around imo. And I'll feel absolutely no pangs of guilt if I decide to brick my system in the future.

Agreed.
The replacement for my first 360 happens to be a 2005 unit like the one that died. Who in his right mind would stick with that, when he could have a 65nm, hopefully problem free machine? I know I wouldn't.

Rangers, Alphawolf, I'd really like to discuss this, but it will eventually get to the "red ring of death" argument that does not belong to this thread.

 

[borowki]

My comments are more frustration from a missed opportunity than anything else. Also, I'd say I'm genuinely surprised that Sony will be able to shave $200 off the BOM from now till the end of the year. That is shocking and I didn't figure such aggressive cost savings would be in the cards for ps3.

One can't forget about Nintendo. The opportunity lost here might be in containing the former champion's resurgence. Microsoft, in my opinion, should have move more aggressively with pricing of the Core. As it is, there's a good chance that Nintendo will take over as the market leader this Christmas.

 

[quest55720]

One can't forget about Nintendo. The opportunity lost here might be in containing the former champion's resurgence. Microsoft, in my opinion, should have move more aggressively with pricing of the Core. As it is, there's a good chance that Nintendo will take over as the market leader this Christmas.

They should be world wide market leader come julys NPD in 2 weeks. They will pass MS some time early next year in NA. The Wii has won the fight is for second place. I have to hand it to nintendo I have neve seen a fucking system sold out until august. I have given up hope finding a Wii in my area. If I can't find one now demand is only going increase many times starting september through xmass. Maybe if nintendo ever gets off their asses and makes more than a million units a month I might get one.

If there is not a second price cut come november then MS is content being a distant 3rd place world wide and eventually 3rd in NA. A price cut this november and they lock sony out of NA and will carry momentum into next year when they need it against sonys huge line up plus a price cut.

 

[Carl B]

Even 40Gb 2.5 drives go in the neighborhood of $50-$100 on new egg. There is a mail in rebate for one model that prices it at $36.00

I see 40GB drives available for $44, 60GB drives for $49, 80GB for $55, and I don't see 20GB drives at all...

If NewEgg can sale 2.5" 40Gb harddrives one unit at a time for $50-100 dollars then MS should be able purchase millions of 2.5" harddrive for a fraction of that price. 10 million HDD units over 2.5 years require an average production rate of ~11,000 HDDs a day, 7 days a week.

Hard drives are not some item that can forever scale downwards in price though; their mechanical nature places a minimum price on them that can't be broken past. NewEgg sourcing direct from the OEMs, I doubt suffers from too great a disadvantage to MS themselves on the low end (of course there's a markup).

With platter densities increasing, that's how the market sustains itself - smaller densities are simply dropped from production. And that's what's happened to MS on 20GB drives - the market has dropped them. It doesn't matter how many millions they order, someone's keeping a manufacturing line churning out these anachronistic drives just for them, and it likely comes at a price. Even 40GB has had its time come and go. These drives (20GB, 40GB, 60GB, 80GB) are *all* single platter drives - it's simply the platters themselves that differ.

MS has built-in a very large cushion with the $100 pricing, but at some point it just becomes ridiculous for them to not increase the drive size.

It's worth noting that last gen their fixed ~6GB 3.5" hard drive size eventually became one of the many cost anchors around the neck of the system.

 

[one]

The plan of Microsoft was launch early in 2005 and reach the lower price range in 2007 with Halo 3 and GTA 4 for the harvest time, but the hardware failure, late 65nm introduction and the competition with strong Wii for people with $300 disposable money might be unexpected for them.

 

[Rangers]

I see 40GB drives available for $44, 60GB drives for $49, 80GB for $55, and I don't see 20GB drives at all...



Hard drives are not some item that can forever scale downwards in price though; their mechanical nature places a minimum price on them that can't be broken past. NewEgg sourcing direct from the OEMs, I doubt suffers from too great a disadvantage to MS themselves on the low end (of course there's a markup).

With platter densities increasing, that's how the market sustains itself - smaller densities are simply dropped from production. And that's what's happened to MS on 20GB drives - the market has dropped them. It doesn't matter how many millions they order, someone's keeping a manufacturing line churning out these anachronistic drives just for them, and it likely comes at a price. Even 40GB has had its time come and go. These drives (20GB, 40GB, 60GB, 80GB) are *all* single platter drives - it's simply the platters themselves that differ.

MS has built-in a very large cushion with the $100 pricing, but at some point it just becomes ridiculous for them to not increase the drive size.

It's worth noting that last gen their fixed ~6GB 3.5" hard drive size eventually became one of the many cost anchors around the neck of the system.

I sure hope so XBD.

The thing I cannot see MS keeping 20GB drives if they aren't saving a buck or two on them currently though. So 20GB must be the cheapest currently available to MS.. For whatever reason.

And I dont think it was the fixed size that really became a anchor around Xbox, just the HDD itself. MS did switch to 10GB with only 8 available at one point.

For that matter, I dont see why they couldn't have increased the size if it was cheaper in Xbox1.

 

[Carl B]

I sure hope so XBD.

The thing I cannot see MS keeping 20GB drives if they aren't saving a buck or two on them currently though. So 20GB must be the cheapest currently available to MS.. For whatever reason.

Well, possibly... but it really is a relic even two years after launch now.

And I dont think it was the fixed size that really became a anchor around Xbox, just the HDD itself. MS did switch to 10GB with only 8 available at one point.

For that matter, I dont see why they couldn't have increased the size if it was cheaper in Xbox1.

The HDD itself *definitely* was an anchor, due to the very fact I mentioned that you can never cost reduce them past a certain point, but the fact that they kept it so low forever more or less to me indicates that they were either locked in to another one of their bogus XBox-related contracts, or were more concerned with uniformity and SKU maintenance than having a divergent set of offerings... certainly something they have not shied away from this gen. But seriously, come the end of 2004/2005, there's no reason they should have been slumming at 10GB on a 3.5" drive - it almost boggles the mind.

 

[Rangers]

Well, possibly... but it really is a relic even two years after launch now.



The HDD itself *definitely* was an anchor, due to the very fact I mentioned that you can never cost reduce them past a certain point, but the fact that they kept it so low forever more or less to me indicates that they were either locked in to another one of their bogus XBox-related contracts, or were more concerned with uniformity and SKU maintenance than having a divergent set of offerings... certainly something they have not shied away from this gen. But seriously, come the end of 2004/2005, there's no reason they should have been slumming at 10GB on a 3.5" drive - it almost boggles the mind.

Yeah back then they seemed commited to keeping all Xbox's the same I guess.

Today with so many different 360 sku's and the modular nature thereof one doubts that is a consideration with 360.

There was very little to do with Xbox 1 on the HDD anyway. My favorite term because it fit so well was always "glorified memory card". This gen is only when it now makes sense (well, if you are broadband connected of course).

 

[one]

There was very little to do with Xbox 1 on the HDD anyway. My favorite term because it fit so well was always "glorified memory card". This gen is only when it now makes sense (well, if you are broadband connected of course).

With bigger game assets than the last gen, HDD can contribute to faster loading too if it allows game installation.

 

[betan]

Betan, no - there's just no way. Note also that the "licensing" premium being paid for any wireless guitar on 360 would be going straight to Microsoft, not some removed 3rd party.

I don't see why this have to be the case. Even MS's own license covers all of its peripherals, more than likely it doesn't cover 3rd party hardware, as MS cannot be stupid enough to charge extra $20 for the pretty much same peripheral available to PS3.

I'm not seeing $70 worth of difference between the Core and the Premium; I maintain the the higher margin on the premium has simply come down relative to the core.

Let me pull the costs out of my back:
HD:$45 , weird wireless headset $25, wireless controller difference $5.
And I am being conservative here.

 

[Rangers]

I don't see why this have to be the case. Even MS's own license covers all of its peripherals, more than likely it doesn't cover 3rd party hardware, as MS cannot be stupid enough to charge extra $20 for the pretty much same peripheral available to PS3.


Let me pull the costs out of my back:
HD:$45 , weird wireless headset $25, wireless controller difference $5.
And I am being conservative here.

More like HD: $20 Wired Headset $2 Wireless controller difference $1.

Okay I exaggerated, the wireless controller difference probably really is $5.

 

[betan]

More like HD: $20 Wired Headset $2 Wireless controller difference $1.

Okay I exaggerated, the wireless controller difference probably really is $5.

I assumed it came with wireless headset using similar chipset, is it standard 2-1/4'' jack headset?
If that's the case, it may be hard to come up with $70 indeed.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Depends on the tech and the field.

see:
VCR's
DVD players
Monitors
HD optical players
etc.

All of which got cheaper ... and some also increased the feature-set at the same time.

I was thinking specific models, although of course you're right, the core tech of CE goods drops. And it's that principle that has people waiting for the price of HDTVs to come down. That is slightly different than watching a particular product though. You don't wait for the Samsung ABC1234 or whatever TV to drop from $1000 to $500, but instead wait for a $500 HDTV. And because there's so much choice of other products, the pricing is quite different from consoles. Console prices affect a lot more people. You'll have many more owners of an XB360 just before price drop than of a particular model TV just before its price drop, so there might be more complaints.

Not that complaints are anything really. That's the way things are. Can't please all the people all the time!

Is this anger over a price drop post purchase a real occurence?

I don't know about anger. I did say 'annoyed' rather than angry. Here's a link to the Sony situation though.

However, emails being sent from Sony to consumers dissatisfied that they purchased the GBP 425 console before the Starter Pack was announced – and therefore missed out on free games and peripherals – have stated that the current deal is a summer promotion only.

Some people are annoyed enough to complain, despite all market changing constantly and deals appearing and disappearing. It's luck of the draw, and you'd have thought people would be used to that by now!

Again, it's not a huge deal. MS can just do their thing and some people will gripe and then move on. But could the reaction to two smaller, closer price drops be more noticeable?

 

[borowki]

They should be world wide market leader come julys NPD in 2 weeks. They will pass MS some time early next year in NA. The Wii has won the fight is for second place. I have to hand it to nintendo I have neve seen a fucking system sold out until august. I have given up hope finding a Wii in my area. If I can't find one now demand is only going increase many times starting september through xmass. Maybe if nintendo ever gets off their asses and makes more than a million units a month I might get one.

Nintendo will be hard to catch once they take the lead. I can't recall an instance where a console manages to come from behind after being beaten.

Then again, it appears that Microsoft is content with staying at a respectable, profitable second-place. I think the Xbox project was launched largely in response to the perceived threat to their core business from Sony. In that respect it has achieved its goal already.