What do you think about the killzone trailer?

[see colon]

what difference does it make if the KZ trailer was rendered out in realtime or using an offline render? sony didn't show the demo being render and manipulated in realtime. either way it wasn't on final hardware, so it's largely irrelevant.

i think the final game will look different than what was shown. there's long enough between now and release that art direction could change, not to mention technology (hardware or software).

 

[mckmas8808]

?

No it wouldn't. heavenly sword looks amazing, but it still looks nothign like that CG Killzone trailer. these points you keep listing aren't making it more plausible that this is realtime. It's not, end of story

I voted for sped up and will look the same sir.

Laa-yosh knows someone that worked on it form what I understand. So if your gonna trust someone, trust him.

And obviously PSM had someone on the inside that told them that it was sped up. At the end of the day all I care about is the final product. Will I look at the final product and have the same feeling that I had when I seen the video at E3. I think I will. And I think they will basically look the same.

If Bandai could show us a CGI footage of Gundam at E3 and then turn around and show us an early build of that game in realtime and it looks the same then why can't Guerrila (considering that it is CG)?

 

[Nesh]

?

No it wouldn't. heavenly sword looks amazing, but it still looks nothign like that CG Killzone trailer. these points you keep listing aren't making it more plausible that this is realtime. It's not, end of story

In terms of static detail I think they both look almost as good.But hell!The interaction!The physics!AI!The flow!The smoke and explosion effects!

Especially the last part of the demo when the craft is shot down and falls turning everything into pieces!!

Whoah!!!

If all these were absent I would have said that it would be the same.But it cant be exactly as the trailer cam it?!

Laa-yosh knows someone that worked on it form what I understand. So if your gonna trust someone, trust him.

And obviously PSM had someone on the inside that told them that it was sped up. At the end of the day all I care about is the final product. Will I look at the final product and have the same feeling that I had when I seen the video at E3. I think I will. And I think they will basically look the same.

Someone from 1up also said that he asked someone he knew that worked at sony and he was told that it was real.

If Bandai could show us a CGI footage of Gundam at E3 and then turn around and show us an early build of that game in realtime and it looks the same then why can't Guerrila (considering that it is CG)?

Ok that surely brings hope as well as the FF-tech demo.
But there wasnt really anything going on on screen in these.

Also the Gundam demo run probaly at 15 frames per second with few mechs and no physics or special effects at all.

On the other hand it was done on aplha kid on an engine build by Bandai who arent famous for their offerings, using only one SPE and unoptimized code.

God!Everything's so ambiguous I cant make up my mind

 

[jeremyhardin]

voted.

 

[cthellis42]

Just for the record, making your first post a pointless necro of a pointless/flamebait post to only say you voted on it and nothing else isn't really the right start to have on an active message board community. It's like delivering a Charleyhorse to someone when you meet them instead of shaking their hand.

 

[jeremyhardin]

Just for the record, making your first post a pointless necro of a pointless/flamebait post to only say you voted on it and nothing else isn't really the right start to have on an active message board community. It's like delivering a Charleyhorse to someone when you meet them instead of shaking their hand.

haha. i'll take that wonderful post as a welcome. forgive me if i'm a man of few words.

i must admit i am curious as to Laa-yosh's real name.

 

[jeremyhardin]

oh, and thought some of the recent discussions here might make my vote more obvious and eliminate the need for more than one word.

cheers!

 

[robofunk]

For those too lazy to google his name.

http://jeremy.lwidof.net/jeremyhardin_resume.html

Jan 2005 - Oct 2005 Axis Animation
Lighter / Compositor / FX Artist / Generalist

 

[bleon]

Could someone explain why CGi experts are qualified to predict whether something is possible in realtime or not?

AFAIK, the methods and algorithms used for rendering in Lightwave etc are totally different from real time rendering which rely on "faking it".

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Welcome

voted.

Welcome to forum my friend. What is your vote?

 

[centerofadmiration]

I thought the video was what they will be able to accomplish with their first PS3 title. I personally think in the end it'll look alot better. The floor texturing is pretty flat in the video, and there is zero lighting going on. If thats not possible on the PS3 then I'll say UT2007 isn't possible either even though its already happening on the system. UT2007 has just as good texturing, vehicle detail, character detail, etc.

I think the video was done in video format but the engine they built on the PC's they did to the specs of the PS3 and there next showcase of the game will be completely running off the final PS3 development kits and look just as good, and possibly even better then the video shown at E3.

 

[mckmas8808]

I thought the video was what they will be able to accomplish with their first PS3 title. I personally think in the end it'll look alot better. The floor texturing is pretty flat in the video, and there is zero lighting going on. If thats not possible on the PS3 then I'll say UT2007 isn't possible either even though its already happening on the system. UT2007 has just as good texturing, vehicle detail, character detail, etc.

I think the video was done in video format but the engine they built on the PC's they did to the specs of the PS3 and there next showcase of the game will be completely running off the final PS3 development kits and look just as good, and possibly even better then the video shown at E3.

Wow! I didn't know anybody would have the balls to actually say that.

 

[robofunk]

Wow! I didn't know anybody would have the balls to actually say that.

"That's no moon..."

Seriously though 'no lighting'... if they used in game assets for everything in the trailer, lighting would have been about the only thing that would have seperated the trailer from the finished game. As it stands there is very little reason for me to believe that anything in the trailer was straight out of game assets and when the game is done the I have no doubt the biggest reason the game won't look anywhere near as good won't be lower polycount models or lower res textures, it will the the lighting.

Huge fake prosthetic balls.

 

[SubD]

There are still people clinging to the Killzone CGI claim?



Since when do 3D package renderers, like say Lightwave's..., have geometry pop and sorting problems?

 

[SubD]

From http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=killzone&message.id=73776

"Okay, I'm going to have to lock this thread because it's getting heated again... sigh...

A couple of things to mention though...

First, we have stated up here before that the earlier versions of the PS3 dev kits were not final specs and we could not produce real-time at the proper frame rate on them for E3.

Second, we have stated that the video was done to specs. Let me explain something about game development. There are very, very few development teams that have the time and manpower to do every single bit of the in-game movies themselves and still get the game done. We outsource all the time. One of the benefits to having standard tools in the industry light LightWave and Maya is that you can exchange actual models, textures, etc with others using the same program. That means you can provide assets and offload the work of putting them all together to someone else.

Third, we stated that this video represents what we believe is achievable on the PS3. I'll dance around my NDA restrictions just a bit to say that I've seen graphics coming together at Guerrilla that support this claim.

Fourth, if you look at the credits for KZ1 - you'll see that we used Axis before. Doesn't it make sense to use a proven vendor when you need to outsource work? Especially when under the gun to complete something for a presentation? One who is able to work with your assets and development pipeline? Just think about it...

Fifth - if I say anymore, I risk getting chewed out by my bosses - so I'm stopping here.

Ferret7
Killzone Dev Team "

 

[Laa-Yosh]

Wonderful, guys, beating the dead horse again. I wonder how long until Vysez locks this thread too...

 

[Hardknock]

From http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=killzone&message.id=73776

"Okay, I'm going to have to lock this thread because it's getting heated again... sigh...

A couple of things to mention though...

First, we have stated up here before that the earlier versions of the PS3 dev kits were not final specs and we could not produce real-time at the proper frame rate on them for E3.

Second, we have stated that the video was done to specs. Let me explain something about game development. There are very, very few development teams that have the time and manpower to do every single bit of the in-game movies themselves and still get the game done. We outsource all the time. One of the benefits to having standard tools in the industry light LightWave and Maya is that you can exchange actual models, textures, etc with others using the same program. That means you can provide assets and offload the work of putting them all together to someone else.

Third, we stated that this video represents what we believe is achievable on the PS3. I'll dance around my NDA restrictions just a bit to say that I've seen graphics coming together at Guerrilla that support this claim.

Fourth, if you look at the credits for KZ1 - you'll see that we used Axis before. Doesn't it make sense to use a proven vendor when you need to outsource work? Especially when under the gun to complete something for a presentation? One who is able to work with your assets and development pipeline? Just think about it...

Fifth - if I say anymore, I risk getting chewed out by my bosses - so I'm stopping here.

Ferret7
Killzone Dev Team "

Okay,, we understand all this. But the point is that particular video was pre-rendered. Regardless if it was "built to spec" or not.

Honestly after owning a 360, I'm not too impressed after watching that E3 trailer anymore. The texturing and modeling isn't unbelievable at all. The animations and physics were very nice though. Overall I think those graphics should be more than possible next-gen for either system. Hope you guys meet your targets to shut some people up.

 

[SubD]

Okay,, we understand all this. But the point is that particular video was pre-rendered. Regardless if it was "built to spec" or not.

Honestly after owning a 360, I'm not too impressed after watching that E3 trailer anymore. The texturing and modeling isn't unbelievable at all. The animations and physics were very nice though. Overall I think those graphics should be more than possible next-gen for either system. Hope you guys meet your targets to shut some people up.

Whatever.

 

[!eVo!-X Ant UK]

I speak to the Dev's alot on the playstation forum, and ive had a few chats were they say they have seen evidence in the studio that shows they can acheive the graphics in that trailer.

 

[!eVo!-X Ant UK]

There are still people clinging to the Killzone CGI claim?



Since when do 3D package renderers, like say Lightwave's..., have geometry pop and sorting problems?

Unless its CGI rendered on a PC GPU, It could be done like the cut-scenes in a Final Fantasy game.