The only explanation is coming to my mind it that MS isn't capable of producing quality hardware.
Technical Comparison Sony PS4 and Microsoft Xbox
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The only explanation is coming to my mind it that MS isn't capable of producing quality hardware.
AstoundingHolmes
Newcomer
I dunno, I don't think the price difference is that surprising if you think about it.
PS4 doesn't include PSEye, while XBO includes kinect.
This probably saves a good 20+ USD off the bat.
PS4 weighs 2.8kg (PS3 was 5), while XBO is said to weigh a ton (I think I recall a rumor about 10lbs) and the heat sink is huge.
Metal costs for heatsinks can add up quite fast, and since they work on razer thin margins, there's not much room for negotiation, so that's probably another 10-20 USD in savings. Additionally, the lower weight saves on shipping costs.
PS4 has an internal PSU, while XBO does not.
It's more of an engineering pain, but you do save a few dollars in materials and construction.
PS4 has similar rumble to PS3, while XBO has rumbling triggers.
The extra rumble motors must add at least a few on to the cost.
PS4 has bluray just like PS3, while bluray is new to XBO.
Sony's had 7 years to develop a mature supply chain for Bluray parts, while MS has to start from scratch. That's probably a few dollars of savings right there.
PS4 doesn't have HDMI in, while XBO does.
Aside from the few dollars in savings from the materials and chips to handle HDMI in, there may be additional savings in licensing fees.
PS4 has finishes similar to PS3, while XBO goes more high end.
MS developed their own pigment for the XBO and a larger area of the product is polished. This probably adds a half dollar or so to the cost.
PS4 uses GDDR5, while XBO uses DDR3.
While GDDR5 pricing is higher than DDR3, GDDR5 doesn't have layout limitations, thus allowing Sony to design a smaller, simpler board. I would not be surprised if the PS4's internals look very similar to most modern GPUs.
Additionally, if we consider the hypothetical yield troubles MS may or may not be having. It probably costs Sony less per SoC than MS. Saving something like maybe 10-20 USD. And if Sony's SoC turns out to be a good bit smaller, say 50mm2, there could be even more savings.
Additionally, if we consider that online multi is now part of PSN+ (kinda defeats the point of calling it plus. wankers.), it may result in more consistent revenue for Sony, allowing them to be more aggressive in launch pricing.
The only real place MS seems to win is the memory chips, and I have no idea about the pricing differential.
PS4 doesn't include PSEye, while XBO includes kinect.
This probably saves a good 20+ USD off the bat.
PS4 weighs 2.8kg (PS3 was 5), while XBO is said to weigh a ton (I think I recall a rumor about 10lbs) and the heat sink is huge.
Metal costs for heatsinks can add up quite fast, and since they work on razer thin margins, there's not much room for negotiation, so that's probably another 10-20 USD in savings. Additionally, the lower weight saves on shipping costs.
PS4 has an internal PSU, while XBO does not.
It's more of an engineering pain, but you do save a few dollars in materials and construction.
PS4 has similar rumble to PS3, while XBO has rumbling triggers.
The extra rumble motors must add at least a few on to the cost.
PS4 has bluray just like PS3, while bluray is new to XBO.
Sony's had 7 years to develop a mature supply chain for Bluray parts, while MS has to start from scratch. That's probably a few dollars of savings right there.
PS4 doesn't have HDMI in, while XBO does.
Aside from the few dollars in savings from the materials and chips to handle HDMI in, there may be additional savings in licensing fees.
PS4 has finishes similar to PS3, while XBO goes more high end.
MS developed their own pigment for the XBO and a larger area of the product is polished. This probably adds a half dollar or so to the cost.
PS4 uses GDDR5, while XBO uses DDR3.
While GDDR5 pricing is higher than DDR3, GDDR5 doesn't have layout limitations, thus allowing Sony to design a smaller, simpler board. I would not be surprised if the PS4's internals look very similar to most modern GPUs.
Additionally, if we consider the hypothetical yield troubles MS may or may not be having. It probably costs Sony less per SoC than MS. Saving something like maybe 10-20 USD. And if Sony's SoC turns out to be a good bit smaller, say 50mm2, there could be even more savings.
Additionally, if we consider that online multi is now part of PSN+ (kinda defeats the point of calling it plus. wankers.), it may result in more consistent revenue for Sony, allowing them to be more aggressive in launch pricing.
The only real place MS seems to win is the memory chips, and I have no idea about the pricing differential.
Quality hardware = good engineering wise+reliable.
Dunno, but I think "tiny by comparison" might stretch it to say the least. Smaller...but PS3 was bigger than 360 at every turn.
Maybe it's the ESRAM, maybe MS wanted to really be safe with cooling...
well engineering wise I'd argue they've been the best. That's just imo based on power relative to release timeframe. And not counting Xbone/PS4 yet cause it's too early imo.
Quality they are 1/2. Sony has had some problems in the past too (remember turning PS1 upside down to read discs, and I think early PS3's have problems), but RROD was the biggest one...
Agreed, but that should have been a pretty huge win...
Of course another aspect to this is company policy, if Sony is breaking even on PS4 and MS is making $100 on every Xbone, obviously that explains it. But we can only go with what we see on the outside.
Not many remember the upside down trick. My garage is filled with 90's failed products, but they are considerably better today.
Ps4 does feel like a different direction, but that is probably from not knowing all the features yet.
AstoundingHolmes
Newcomer
I dunno, trying to make a profit on every console sold in the launch year, in an industry pushing the razer/blade model seems kinda ludicrous to me, to be honest. Even Nintendo can't get away with that anymore. For MS to turn around and do that would imply, to me at least, that they really aren't focused on the game industry or their hubris levels shot through the moon. However, despite what people say, I don't think MS is really all that egoistic.
Also, OT, but I remember flipping my PS1 and DC too. Odd enough, after a while they fixed themselves and worked just fine right side up.
Acceptable noise levels is the other piece of this. MS has had to create a box that is as silent as a cable box or blu-ray player based on the way they are positioning this device (they've flat-out said it's silent).
Sony does(may) not have the same requirement and the PS4 could be much noisier under load, which would explain a lot. If the XBO is as loud as my PS3 was/is that could turn off a lot of people who think they are buying something akin to the other black, rectangular boxes under their TVs. Still a lot of unknowns.
EDIT: Just realized this was a longer-winded way of saying what 3dilletante said on the last page...
It looks to be slightly bigger than the PS3, which in the start of it's life didn't make a lot of noise, and the PS4 should run a bit cooler, right?
I just think that Sony is playing their strength with their hardware.
AstoundingHolmes
Newcomer
I think this is guaranteed since blowers always tend to be more noisy than top-down coolers. More so due to airflow turbulence than the actual fans.
Xbone just has a reasonably large heat sink and fan. The ps4 is going to have a bespoke cooling solution and I imagine the fan will cover most of the available space available under the pcb much like the ps3 had.
For any low-intensity use, the power management of the APUs should be able to make both very quiet.
Does it sound feasible that Microsoft's solution allows it to go fully passive at the low end, with the venting at the top?
Does it sound feasible that Microsoft's solution allows it to go fully passive at the low end, with the venting at the top?
(((interference)))
Veteran
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-sony-details-final-ps4-spec
DF says PS4 is currently reserving 2 cores and perhaps 1GB of memory.
DF says PS4 is currently reserving 2 cores and perhaps 1GB of memory.
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